Fanclub The V̶i̶n̶s̶m̶o̶k̶e̶ Sanji FC: The Prince of love

[Raiden7]

I feel like everything is going to be haki-centric.

The fact is that the word haki in japanese means ambition, so it is used as a power like ki, aura, chakra, nen like but it is also what the word says. It is also the ambition or the spirit of the character, what the character want. What the character aspire to be.

It's dual meaning it's too important and this is why I don't think the "power of love" is another kind of power. It is just haki, it is just ambition, it is just the drive that moves a specific character. Why Kuma was able to act on his own even when he is a cyborg? Because his human spirit was stronger than his cold, cyborg other side.

This is what I think, let's see Oda's answer for that.

 

[Rumble]

We still have Sora warrior of the sea, the 66 days of Germa dominion on North Blue and Judge storyline.

I think it's possible will become super famous and notorious, but only as some kind alter ego - most likely inadvertently.

 

[Royal Kick]

This makes as much sense as saying Luffy won't need to max out his Haki due to his fruit, sure it helps boost him above other people on his level but it's still crucial that he has great Haki too.
I don't see a reason for Sanji to not get Conq Haki, it's already been foreshadowed in many ways (even outside of this arc where Gaban just straight up says they'll need to unlock it to beat their opponents), and he'll definitely need it to stay on the level of people like Zoro and Luffy.
Think about all the things Zoro and Luffy will have in comparison to Sanji EoS. Even if PoL is different from Conq Haki (instead of just being a form of it/term for it like Mantra is for Observation Haki) I don't think that alone is nearly enough to keep up with the other two.

Not to mention Sanji had only one PU post-TS and it was haki-related, him not getting a lot of haki development doesn't mean much. Zoro pre-Wano didn't get anything that was haki-related, Luffy got a ton of haki development because he's the MC.

A unique ability and haki development aren't mutually exclusive, Luffy has his DF as you pointed out and Zoro has Enma.

 

[PuckTheGreat]

This makes as much sense as saying Luffy won't need to max out his Haki due to his fruit, sure it helps boost him above other people on his level but it's still crucial that he has great Haki too.
I don't see a reason for Sanji to not get Conq Haki, it's already been foreshadowed in many ways (even outside of this arc where Gaban just straight up says they'll need to unlock it to beat their opponents), and he'll definitely need it to stay on the level of people like Zoro and Luffy.
Think about all the things Zoro and Luffy will have in comparison to Sanji EoS. Even if PoL is different from Conq Haki (instead of just being a form of it/term for it like Mantra is for Observation Haki) I don't think that alone is nearly enough to keep up with the other two.

Crucial difference here is that Sanji is not Luffy.
Sure Sanji could have OD haki on top of his lineage factor powerups but if Oda does that there is no way in hell that Zoro will remain stronger than Sanji and it'd be difficult to even call them equals. Imagine giving King OD Haki on top his genetic stack and thinking Zoro beats him on Wano
This is also the reason why Marco & King have average Haki in comparison to Kat.


Completely disagree on the bolded bit.
This is the same tired argument that Sanji downplayers have made since the very start of the timeskip.
Sanji's armament is weak so he's been left behind by Zoro and Sanji muh muh muh.
Sanji's been left behind by Luffy and Zoro so he will fight a Tobi Roppo etc.
Now I'll ask you what exactly has changed on the haki front for Sanji since the TS that has now changed that opinion? or you of the opinion that Luffy and Zoro have left Sanji behind irregardless of the events on Wano or even Egghead?

 

[Hueconite]

Sanji + Haoushoku haki

It's now or never!

 

[Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier]

Crucial difference here is that Sanji is not Luffy.
Sure Sanji could have OD haki on top of his lineage factor powerups but if Oda does that there is no way in hell that Zoro will remain stronger than Sanji and it'd be difficult to even call them equals. Imagine giving King OD Haki on top his genetic stack and thinking Zoro beats him on Wano
This is also the reason why Marco & King have average Haki in comparison to Kat.


Completely disagree on the bolded bit.
This is the same tired argument that Sanji downplayers have made since the very start of the timeskip.
Sanji's armament is weak so he's been left behind by Zoro and Sanji muh muh muh.
Sanji's been left behind by Luffy and Zoro so he will fight a Tobi Roppo etc.
Now I'll ask you what exactly has changed on the haki front for Sanji since the TS that has now changed that opinion? or you of the opinion that Luffy and Zoro have left Sanji behind irregardless of the events on Wano or even Egghead?

I'm just saying Haki is clearly very important in this series and I don't see how Sanji will be hard carried by his genetics enough to still be relative to Zoro and Luffy EoS. Do you really believe he won't get any major Haki related upgrades at all? Come on now. Even people like Law and Whitebeard had moments where they needed strong Haki to survive fights.

 

[PuckTheGreat]

I'm just saying Haki is clearly very important in this series and I don't see how Sanji will be hard carried by his genetics enough to still be relative to Zoro and Luffy EoS. Do you really believe he won't get any major Haki related upgrades at all? Come on now. Even people like Law and Whitebeard had moments where they needed strong Haki to survive fights.

It is important but it is not the only factor in fights is what I'm saying. There is no need to max it out if you have other abilities that can cover for it.Sanji's Haki will grow as he grows stronger like everybody else and I also expect Sanji to get a buff to his Observation Haki at some point in the series as well.

Not really liking the phrasing of hard carried tbh, haki is not the only ability in this series. That's like saying the admirals are hard carried by their DFs which is very near sighted and not true. Kiz doesn't have half the Haki mastery that Luffy does yet he was arguably superior to him on Egghead.

There are a variety of abilities in the series and many different characters have different ways of stacking them.
Haki can either be the core of said abilities like you have for the majority of human character without DFs (e.g. Zoro, Gaban, Rayleigh) or complementary for DF users or races with special genetic perks.

I'll say it again yes Sanji can have OD haki in addtion to his genetic perks but again he is not Luffy. Oda has to keep the balance somehow. For instance, Linlin and Kaido don't have awakenings even though they've had their DFs for years which doesn't make any sense but the simple reason for that again is balance. If you give Kaido awakening on top of his current ability stack then there'd be no way to keep the balance with the other top tiers.

 

[Royal Kick]

I'm just saying Haki is clearly very important in this series and I don't see how Sanji will be hard carried by his genetics enough to still be relative to Zoro and Luffy EoS. Do you really believe he won't get any major Haki related upgrades at all? Come on now. Even people like Law and Whitebeard had moments where they needed strong Haki to survive fights.

The only thing I don't see him getting is ACoA, just like I don't see Zoro getting ACoO. That's the thing that will separate Luffy from them imo, he's one of the few people who can use both ACoO and ACoA and it's an extremely rare and nearly impossible feat because most people's brain is wired in such a way that they can only get the advanced form of one of these two colours (in addition to CoC). Luffy having both is a bit like being ambidextrous when most people are either right-handed or left-handed.

Gaban having CoC is pretty much confirmation Sanji will get it as well, I don't get the recurring point about Sanji having his Germa genes to dispute that. It just what makes him a unique fighter with his own fighting style, this is as relevant as Gaban fighting with axes while Sanji has only his legs. I wonder if there were people pre-Onigashima that claimed Zoro wouldn't get CoC like Rayleigh because he got a magical sword, it's equally nonsensical imo.

Characters' overall abilities are totally irrelevant here. CoC isn't about the way you fight, it's about whether you have what it takes. If Sanji's parallel has what it takes to be part of this select group of people who are the very best fighters in the world, then Sanji simply has what it takes too, and that's what CoC symbolizes. Doesn't have to be more complicated than that.

 

[RayanOO]

Post automatically merged: Thursday at 3:41 PM

 

[Rumble]

The only thing I don't see him getting is ACoA, just like I don't see Zoro getting ACoO. That's the thing that will separate Luffy from them imo, he's one of the few people who can use both ACoO and ACoA and it's an extremely rare and nearly impossible feat because most people's brain is wired in such a way that they can only get the advanced form of one of these two colours (in addition to CoC).

The only form of Armament Zoro uses that Sanji doesn’t is Imbuement.

If Zoro was to learn aCoA and Sanji wasn't as a matter distinction, Wano would be the arc for that, but instead we got Sanji specifically unlocking Ifrit with Armament as a component.

idk why so many overlook the fact Sanji is more reliant on Armament Haki than Zoro. It’s not a thing he can do, it’s a thing he does constantly, by necessity.

Sanji is the unarmed martial artists that can only guard with his limbs and Haki. He has at least two specific instances I can recall now where his Armament Haki is referenced specifically in the context of him defending himself with it. Zoro is no doubt capable and must’ve done it implicitly on panel, but it’s relevant it’s never been called to.

More importantly, consider what Luffy learned in 1009 and 1010 about CoC Infusion and what Kaidō said about it. Then consider that just about every CoC we’ve seen can use CoA Emission.

I think there’s considerable overlap in mechanics, which is why I expect Zoro to use Emission regularly after he gains control over CoC.

Same goes for Sanji, who is not relative to Zoro, but his equal by design - a dynamic that has favoured Zoro more than vice-versa given Sanji’s dominant wins over relative, equal or superior opponents.

Linlin and Kaido don't have awakenings even though they've had their DFs for years which doesn't make any sense but the simple reason for that again is balance. If you give Kaido awakening on top of his current ability stack then there'd be no way to keep the balance with the other top tiers.

The idea Big Mom and Kaidō didn’t have Awakenings isn’t based in anything but fanon. Like YC labels as a measure of strength.

It’s never been confirmed whether they do or don’t have Awakenings

For all we know, they did. In fact, it seems far more likely than not given the diversity of abilities and applications shown by both.

 

[Bisoromi Bear]

Post automatically merged: Thursday at 3:41 PM

Wanji

 

[Rumble]

Spoiler: the actual deuteragonist of OP

 

[PuckTheGreat]

The only thing I don't see him getting is ACoA, just like I don't see Zoro getting ACoO. That's the thing that will separate Luffy from them imo, he's one of the few people who can use both ACoO and ACoA and it's an extremely rare and nearly impossible feat because most people's brain is wired in such a way that they can only get the advanced form of one of these two colours (in addition to CoC). Luffy having both is a bit like being ambidextrous when most people are either right-handed or left-handed.

Gaban having CoC is pretty much confirmation Sanji will get it as well, I don't get the recurring point about Sanji having his Germa genes to dispute that. It just what makes him a unique fighter with his own fighting style, this is as relevant as Gaban fighting with axes while Sanji has only his legs. I wonder if there were people pre-Onigashima that claimed Zoro wouldn't get CoC like Rayleigh because he got a magical sword, it's equally nonsensical imo.

Characters' overall abilities are totally irrelevant here. CoC isn't about the way you fight, it's about whether you have what it takes. If Sanji's parallel has what it takes to be part of this select group of people who are the very best fighters in the world, then Sanji simply has what it takes too, and that's what CoC symbolizes. Doesn't have to be more complicated than that.

Falling hook line & sinker for the z-boy narrative💀. If Sanji doesn’t get it I reckon you will acknowledge that he doesn’t have what he takes to be one of the best fighters in the world? 👌🏿

I have tried my best lol. Really hope he gets it for y’all good 🙏🏿

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

Y'all want Sanji to have Conqueror's Haki for his character development.

I want Sanji to have Conqueror's Haki so I can ragebait Sanji haters.

 

[Royal Kick]

Sanji getting CoC isn't a matter of if, it's a matter of when.

@Warchief Sanji D Goat Please stop liking all my posts, my alert box was a mess earlier.

 

[Juanpiz]

Sanji getting CoC isn't a matter of if, it's a matter of when.

@Warchief Sanji D Goat Please stop liking all my posts, my alert box was a mess earlier.

You can Not stop him

 

[Devilbat]

Sanji getting CoC isn't a matter of if, it's a matter of when.

@Warchief Sanji D Goat Please stop liking all my posts, my alert box was a mess earlier.

You can always turn off the "like" notification?

On "Sanji should get CoC" matter, narratively and powerscale-wise it makes absolute sense for him to have it.

Personally I would love it either way, either being so strong that not having CoC doesn't make you less of a badass or being advCoC user capable of amazing feats is fine with me. I just hope that Oda doesn't drag this out to the very last minute.

 

[Julius]

The strongest Conquerors are built like this

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1994495084147216819

Post automatically merged: Today at 2:17 AM

Give me parallels, give me epiteths, give me epic speeches or i retire

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1994577824548614518

 

[Rumble]

The strongest Conquerors are built like this

I've said this in the Loki thread, but I believe Oda liked his Saint Shanks character design so much, he filled the story with characters modelled of it.

The secret origin, noble by birth in life of some kind of hardship and outsider among family, with difficult relationship particularly with birth parent(s), found family and/or parent - though not all of them tick all the same boxes, this applies to a considerable number of beside Saint Shanks like Luffy, Ace, Sabo, Law, Yamato, Loki and others.

By design, Sanji is centred and acts like a narrative mirror for effectively all of these characters.

That's why he's the only Strawhat with an actual secret origin and a story Oda has not stopped teasing in the manga or SBS.

I also don't think it's coincidental Sanji is the only Strawhat we know to have Power of Love, or that he's apparently about to awaken Conqueror's Haki in the very same arc his Wing parallel appears to share vital information about and more lore come. I don't think it's a coincidence we didn't get to read what Gaban had to Sanji to make him react like that.

Spoiler: manga hints

Sommers appears designed specifically as an ideologically enemy to Sanji. His Devil Fruit is a hard-counter without Haki, and Sanji will need to awaken Conqueror's Haki to put him down decisively to win.