Garp the Fist
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  • After the latest chapter, I think that at least the mid trio vs F6 is at least guaranteedl. The Scabbards are most likely gonna get taken out next chapter, and there aren't much other characters that can step up to take on the F6. I could see Usopp fighting all the Numbers instead of a F6, and maybe Chopper helping him, and maaaaybe Nami helping them too (but I seriously doubt it).
    Did you know in his Prime, Garp made Akainu seem low tier Marine? I like Garp. Wish there was more of him in the show
    What do you think about Nine Scabbards vs Nine Numbers, then followed by Kinemon vs Kanjuro, Raizo vs Fukurojuku, the rest of the Scabbards finishing off the Mimawarigumi and Oniwabanshu I guess, and then the all of the Scabbards confronting Kaido and losing?
    Shiroyru
    Shiroyru
    The Nine Scabbards confronting Kaido is almost a necessity imo. The Scabbards really only care about Kaido and Orochi (does any of them besides Denjiro even know the names of any F6, or even King and Queen for that matter)? They could confront Orochi, but there’s obviously no tension in that since even the weakest Scabbard can easily beat Orochi, so that leaves Kaido by default (he is the one who killed their lord).
    Shiroyru
    Shiroyru
    Kaido is the one who killed their lord, Kaido is the one who ruined their homeland, Kaido is the one who is the real leader because Orochi will have to do whatever Kaido says, and Kaido is the one they’ve spent the last 20 years preparing to kill. It would be a huge missed opportunity if they didn’t confront him imo. Ideally it would be after the SN lose round 1,
    Shiroyru
    Shiroyru
    so that way the Scabbards can prove to be useful in fighting Kaido even though they would obviously lose, because they can buy the SN time to escape and recover their strength for round 2
    I notice the playing cards are often ranked as "spades, hearts, diamonds, clubs." Does that mean "Pica > Vergo (Corazon) > Diamante > Trebol"?
    Garp the Fist
    Garp the Fist
    I wouldn't say so. I think that based on everything Oda has ever written, Vergo's the right hand man and strongest DD Pirate apart from the man himself. However, I also feel that Diamente and Trebol are quite underrated by the community and that as a whole the Seats are all quite close in strength
    C
    critical mindset
    yeah not in poker lmao
    Do you think Blackbeard will get a bounty of over 5 billion and if so, when and how?
    HA001
    HA001
    Soon when he kills shanks
    Garp the Fist
    Garp the Fist
    He'll definitely get one above Whitebeard's at some point. I'm not sure it'll be after this arc- I know he's on the hunt for something big right now, but Oda might want to keep most of the attention on Luffy taking down Kaido. Like was said above- he's got his fated meeting with Shanks- which should happen after Luffy meets Shanks again- and that's the best bet for him getting his last bounty
    Garp the Fist
    Garp the Fist
    Either that or- pet theory time- Blackbeard follows Luffy to Laugh Tale using Shiryu's fruit, "beats" him there by cheating and ambushing, and walks out proclaiming himself Pirate King. And that's when he gets a 5+ billion bounty.
    Did the latest chapter change your position on how nerfed you think Killer was?

    The most salient information was that Killer ate the SMILE of his own volition (Orochi presumably offered it to him to make him stronger) and chose to work for Orochi so that he could save Kidd (his willpower and determination should have been at it's maximum).
    Cinera
    Cinera
    > We are meant to see that the right hand men of Luffy and Kid can knock each other out in circumstances that are murky. A message that doesn't work if Zoro is massively more nerfed than Killer, or vice versa.

    I think this is a plausible argument.
    Cinera
    Cinera
    > Oda’s been leaning heavily on the similarities between Strawhat and Kid Pirates this arc- more specifically, between Luffy/Zoro and Kid/Killer.

    I have been seeing similarities between Luffy and Kidd, but haven't really been seeing similarities/parallels between Kidd and Killer. Could you go over them.
    Cinera
    Cinera
    And now I should really, log off (please continue in the thread).
    Garp the Fist
    Garp the Fist
    Su Long's a great boost, Inu was taking on Ashura fine without it and both of them did decent against Jack as well. Denjiro might prove stronger but I'm fairly confidant that Su Long Inu and Neko are stronger than Ashura.
    Cinera
    Cinera
    Fair enough. I think Asura did better against Jack and that the Dukes are weaker now, but I haven't really been accounting for their Sulong transformations (it's also a bit ludicrous for it to be as big a power multiplier for them as it was for Carrot).
    Kidd and Apoo's confrontation is currently unresolved, and it doesn't look like it would reach a resolution. As such, Kidd has yet to get a warm up fight. Does this change anything for you?
    Garp the Fist
    Garp the Fist
    Not really. I still don't believe that warmups are at all necessary for the overwhelming majority of the main fighters. Kid I would like to see get one since he's never won a fight, but I can live without it if Apoo's to play another role. Marco's just neatly cut in half the number of potential opponents here, the TR are too important to be wasted as warmups, the Headliners aren't strong enough.
    Garp the Fist
    Garp the Fist
    I think the Numbers will end up being not much more than hypetools, but for the characters who aren't going to get real fights- the Scabbards, mostly, maybe a few Minks or Law and Kid's crew. But I'm talking basically one-shots that aren't real fights here.
    What do you think of the bad blood Oda has been depicting between Queen and Who's Who. It would be weird if after all the panels devoted to it, nothing comes out of it.
    Cinera
    Cinera
    I am now even more sceptical that one of the Fodder Hats would be responsible for Who's Who's defeat. Not after the role Oda seems to have fashioned for him.
    Garp the Fist
    Garp the Fist
    Who's Who does seem to be playing a bigger role in the plot than I thought he would. I still don't think he's in the same league as a Calamity, but I can see him playing a different role than simply getting beaten. Maybe even turning sides depending on how seriously he takes his grudge. This could be leading to a Franky Brook teamup on Sasaki.
    Garp the Fist
    Garp the Fist
    Although it's still not confirmed that Queen's the one he hates, and vice-versa. Queen's the most likely option, given WW talked about it and Jack's already got Neko and Inu hating him, but Oda has left it a bit vague given neither has actually named each other as the one they want to kill.
    I can never make out Kaido's hierarchy. A Tobi Roppo can take a Lead Performer's place, and they look more ideal for the mid/weak trio. The Numbers were jammed after the Tobi Roppo in Queen's pecking order and fit the face cards. Headliners are either former captains or special Gifters, and what becomes of the former's crew? They clearly keep them.
    Luffy, Jinbei and Crocodile are presented in Impel Down in the exact same manner as Luffy, Kid and Law were in Wano.

    Once again, standing next to each other does not portray equality in strength.
    Cinera
    Cinera
    I am aware I have a Zoro bias, so I've asked reasonable folks who aren't particularly biased on the topic, and their conclusions were similar. I haven't really seen someone I would consider reasonable (I'm pretty confident in my assessments here) argue that an unnerfed Killer could give Santoryu Zoro a high or extreme diff fight.
    Cinera
    Cinera
    An addendum to the scythes issue. There's another reason Killer had to use sickles and not his original weapons: he would have been instantly recognised (by the readers) had he used his original weapons. Oda intended to hide Kamazou's identity, we haven't been told that the scythes substantially weakened him (at least to the extent that Zoro is weakened by losing his (by far) strongest weapon and fighting style).
    Cinera
    Cinera
    I'm willing to grant some credence to Killer having been weakened. I expect him to perform better with his weapons, but it's possible he wasn't weakened at all. Oda didn't want the reader to recognise him, and Killer's mechanical scythes are iconic for him.
    How come you hate AoT?
    Garp the Fist
    Garp the Fist
    Overall I remember thinking that it was the worst kind of edgy, and was just an unpleasent read. I didn't think it was deep or clever enough to justify its grimdark tendancies.
    D
    dizzy2341
    Fair enough. Seems like it just failed to fundamentally connect with you. Much the case with Vinland Saga for me. Since you read it about 4/5 years ago, I'd recommend maybe giving it one more shot, trying with the anime instead. The art in the beginning is shite and that for anything can act as a massive turn off. Shame that you already know all the twists and everything though.
    D
    dizzy2341
    I enjoyed season 1, but season 2 onwards is where things really took off. But this might just be something that's "not for you".
    > Jinbei's bounty is a special case because Jinbei is a Strawhat, so Oda would need to balance his with the crew in mind, makinf sure it's not too high compared to Zoro and Sanji, leaving space for him to have more raises than other characters are going to get.

    This is a very good argument. What do you think of Law's bounty remaining 440 million after he quit the Shichibukai?
    Garp the Fist
    Garp the Fist
    Which would be that Law joined the Warlords and masterminded the defeat of Doflamingo as part of an overarching plan to destabilise the world. And he allied with Luffy for that purpose. Luffy is the brawn, Law the brains
    Finalbeta
    Finalbeta
    At the end of the day Law's plan is still the only one still standing lol
    Cinera
    Cinera
    That's fair. I guess Law I can accept that some part of Law's jump to 500m after DR is due to leaving the Shichibukai. 440m - 500m is narrow enough a range for bounty estimation purposes anyway.
    Did the latest chapter change anything for you?
    Garp the Fist
    Garp the Fist
    If anything it confirmed to me that there are not going to be warm fights since Luffy and Zoro are actively avoiding them so as not to take damage before the final battle. Kid and Apoo is the exception since Kidd has never actually won a fight before now and it has actual build up.
    Cinera
    Cinera
    I see the argument, but it's not entirely up to them. If Queen blocks their advance they would have no resort but to take him down.

    At any rate, the next ten or so chapters should make things clear.
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