Ugh, too complex, impossible to say imho. You could make a case for both.
Rinbukun is a cocky idiot, I thin he'll fall to Tou soon. Then it becomes a 2v2...
Karin already outsmarted Tou, but in this case Ousen is there as well. Though Qin has zero chance of taking out Kanmei in 1 v 1...
I think Qin will kill more soldiers due to Ousen tactics and at some point Kanmei will be forced to take the field to turn the tide...
Guess it depends on how much devastation Ousen can bring to Chu before Kanmei goes for his HQ, assuming that Tou doesn't get overrun by Karin in the meantime.
The Chu Army would probably take this one but it could go either way.
The biggest problem for the Qin is Ka Rin. Unlike in Ousen vs a Kanmei, Karin is a strategist who is basically on par with Ousen as a strategist, so any advantage of having Ousen is basically nullified as Ousen is more likely to be pushed into a retreat by a comparable strategist than he is to honestly engage them like he is uncharacteristically doing against Riboku.
But on the flip side of that, Ousen’s presence means Karin will essentially get away with less of her tactics, so that’s nice. Lol
So with Karin and Ousen will essentially cancel each other out which leaves Tou to deal with both Rinbukun and Kanmei. Which...yeah. He would struggle to say the least.
Ugh, too complex, impossible to say imho. You could make a case for both.
Rinbukun is a cocky idiot, I thin he'll fall to Tou soon. Then it becomes a 2v2...
Karin already outsmarted Tou, but in this case Ousen is there as well. Though Qin has zero chance of taking out Kanmei in 1 v 1...
I think Qin will kill more soldiers due to Ousen tactics and at some point Kanmei will be forced to take the field to turn the tide...
Guess it depends on how much devastation Ousen can bring to Chu before Kanmei goes for his HQ, assuming that Tou doesn't get overrun by Karin in the meantime.
In the beginning i made both side with equal soldiers only because in coalition Qin vs Chu was 90k vs 150k and Tou vs Karin was 30k vs 70 or 80k (coz Karin got Rinbunkun later on) and still couldn't wiped out Tou led Qin when both side were using full strength and soldiers at there disposal.
Honestly what i believe is that, in the beginning it would be same as coalition where at first Rinbunkun and Tou will face off and end in same way.
At the same time, the show between Karin and Kanmei vs OuSen would be the most awesome one. Brute force of Kanmei along with Karin's tactics would still be useless as @MarineHQ62 said, the defence formations deployed by OuSen and Akou would be unimaginable. That would be enough to get Tou back on OuSen's side after killing Rinbunkun.
Now 1st) - Tou Akou SouOu and Shiryou vs Kanmei : Kanmei down.
2nd) - OuSen vs Karin : Honestly this could turnout to be in stalemate. I strongly believes that Karin is no less than Riboku if she ain't above him. And again, this war would be most epic.
The Chu Army would probably take this one but it could go either way.
The biggest problem for the Qin is Ka Rin. Unlike in Ousen vs a Kanmei, Karin is a strategist who is basically on par with Ousen as a strategist, so any advantage of having Ousen is basically nullified as Ousen is more likely to be pushed into a retreat by a comparable strategist than he is to honestly engage them like he is uncharacteristically doing against Riboku.
But on the flip side of that, Ousen’s presence means Karin will essentially get away with less of her tactics, so that’s nice. Lol
So with Karin and Ousen will essentially cancel each other out which leaves Tou to deal with both Rinbukun and Kanmei. Which...yeah. He would struggle to say the least.
Well Qin will have an advantage as they will be on the defensive which will give Ousen all the time he needs to strategize on how delicately he would want to destroy the Chu Army along with their Generals. Karin is no where near the greatness of the Ousen-sama who cooked up a plan of taking the impregnable city of Gyo in a matter of minutes/ an hour tops, while being on the enemy doorsteps with the plan that will shape on about a month later which will lead them to the victory on the battle field of entire different location against the Mighty Riboko. :cheers:
During the coalition Karin never tried to take out Tou though, she targeted Kankoku Pass.
Akou & Co. are basically one shot material for Kanmei, they shouldn't go near him. I even doubt about the efficacy of Ousen's tactics. Moubu absolutely wrecked Rihaku's tactics. I believe Kanmei could do the same with Ousen. The problem for Kanmei is that he's still only one man, and while he destroys Ousen's defense Akou & Co. could concentrate on the rest of Kanmei army and do more damage to Chu than Kanmei to Qin. As I've said imho it's a time race. Can Akou & Co. wipe out Kanmei's army before Kanmei gets to Ousen? Can Tou hold his own against Karin long enough? Who knows.
EDIT: Voted for Chu anyway. I think Karin is superior to Tou and might lend a hand to Kanmei allowing Chu to win.
Brute force of Kanmei along with Karin's tactics would still be useless as @MarineHQ62 said, the defence formations deployed by OuSen and Akou would be unimaginable.
Y’all really think Ousen’s defensive formations can stop Kanmei? Lol
Shin broke through Chou Garyuu’s Sifting Sands defensive formation which by hype is probably about as strong as Akou’s formation if not stronger, and Kanmei’s brute power >> Shin’s, I don’t think Ousen’s defense is stopping this guy. His elite men? Maybe, but not the Giant of Chu himself.
Well Qin will have an advantage as they will be on the defensive which will give Ousen all the time he needs to strategize on how delicately he would want to destroy the Chu Army along with their Generals. Karin is no where near the greatness of the Ousen-sama who cooked up a plan of taking the impregnable city of Gyo in a matter of minutes/ an hour tops, while being on the enemy doorsteps with the plan that will shape on about a month later which will lead them to the victory on the battle field of entire different location against the Mighty Riboko. :cheers:
Karin was able to let Chu soldiers get inside Kankouku pass which was unimaginable for even Riboku. Riboku believes that only way is to defeat Qin army or go through southern pass for which he started sending soldiers on 10th night. So you can see even Riboku felt being defeated on Kankouku pass while somehow Karin succeeds in infiltrating.
During the coalition Karin never tried to take out Tou though, she targeted Kankoku Pass.
Akou & Co. are basically one shot material for Kanmei, they shouldn't go near him. I even doubt about the efficacy of Ousen's tactics. Moubu absolutely wrecked Rihaku's tactics. I believe Kanmei could do the same with Ousen. The problem for Kanmei is that he's still only one man, and while he destroys Ousen's defense Akou & Co. could concentrate on the rest of Kanmei army and do more damage to Chu than Kanmei to Qin. As I've said imho it's a time race. Can Akou & Co. wipe out Kanmei's army before Kanmei gets to Ousen? Can Tou hold his own against Karin long enough? Who knows.
First of all Tou Akou Shiryou etc aren't one shot material for Kanmei by any means you think while i said if these guys attacks Kanmei together than now way Kanmei is surviving it.
Secondly, don't compare Rihaku and OuSen. That's like comparing heaven and earth. Without OuSen, Akou using his boss formation stopped CGR and GyouUn (he's a beast and won't be far less than MouBu and Kanmei) and Banaji was able to break it only because of Riboku's help.
Also nope, Kanmei couldn't do same against OuSen.
Third, yup it's race against time. But it won't be Akou and co. chirping out Chu army. Ousen and Denrimi will be commanding armies of Tou, Akou, Makou and SouOu while these four and Shiryou would be targeting Kanmei.
It would be more likely OuSen and Denrimi vs Karin.
Fourth, Tou would definitely be able to put Karin on stalemate and I'm sure for this thing.
First of all Tou Akou Shiryou etc aren't one shot material for Kanmei by any means you think while i said if these guys attacks Kanmei together than now way Kanmei is surviving it.
Moubu is the real martial benchmark of the manga, and Kanmei who could oneshot a Qin Six pushed him to extreme diff. Truth is he would've won w/o Moubu's plot armor.
Moubu/Kanmei can destroy the enemy and their weapon with a single attack. (As a reminder Kanmei initially used his mace because he knew that his sword would shatter more or less immediately against Moubu's mace)
Secondly, don't compare Rihaku and OuSen. That's like comparing heaven and earth. Without OuSen, Akou using his boss formation stopped CGR and GyouUn (he's a beast and won't be far less than MouBu and Kanmei) and Banaji was able to break it only because of Riboku's help.
Also nope, Kanmei couldn't do same against OuSen.
We can totally compare Rihaku who specialized on defense or CGR with Ousen. Why? Because their tactics at the end of the day are based on their man standing planted on the ground and resisting the enemy attack. And they will not resist Kanmei's advance.
CGR's was called the shield of a 3GH and his defensive formation was broken through by Shin which is weaker than Kanmei.
You think Kanmei will be stonewalled by a couple of shields like Shiryou was? Good luck. Kanmei can tear entire bodies apart with a mace.
Ousen and Denrimi will be commanding armies of Tou, Akou, Makou and SouOu while these four and Shiryou would be targeting Kanmei.
It would be more likely OuSen and Denrimi vs Karin.
Yeah, this is a good point. While Karin might look at Kanmei's battlefield Ousen can look at Tou's battlefield. I doubt though that he'll be able to spare much effort though.
Doubtful. Karin literally did whatever he wanted during the Coalition. Sneaked 5k elites behind Tou w/o him even noticing, went to Kanmei's battlefield, played with Elephants ecc. ecc. Meanwhile Tou had to promote Ousen and Mouten as commanders to avoid kicking the bucket and was essentially reacting all the time. Though he could probably resist long enough to keep Karis focused on him though.
Please don’t tell me you think that this means the gap between Oukotsu andKanmei is actually that big lol. Oukotsu was Ouki’s equal and many people still think Ouki > Moubu.
Actually, Oukotsu had greater brute strength than Ouki as the Qin 6GG with the strongest brute force.
Oukotsu just goofed against Kanmei is all. Kanmei is not that much stronger than him lol.
Please don’t tell me you think that this means the gap in Oukotsu andKanmei is actually that big lol. Oukotsu was Ouki’s equal and many people still think Ouki > Moubu.
Actually, Oukotsu had greater brute strength than Ouki as the Qin 6GG with the strongest brute force.
Oukotsu just goofed against Kanmei is all. Kanmei is not that much stronger than him lol.
Q6 are not necessarily equal in term of martial might.
Ousen is Q6 level as a general due to his strategy and tactics, not because of his martial might. Even Houken disposed of Q6 Kyou fairly easily and was immediately destroyed by Ouki.
It's very likely that Oukotsu underestimated Kanmei and I don't think Moubu/Kanmei would one-shot Ouki or Renpa. But that's because Ouki and Renpa are pretty much the next big thing after Moubu/Kanmei. Then there's Gaimou. Everyone else? Not gonna last long. Especially vassals like Souou or Shiryou LOL.
Q6 are not necessarily equal in term of martial might.
Ousen is Q6 level as a general due to his strategy and tactics, not because of his martial might. Even Houken disposed of Q6 Kyou fairly easily and was immediately destroyed by Ouki.
It's very likely that Oukotsu underestimated Kanmei and I don't think Moubu/Kanmei would one-shot Ouki or Renpa. But that's because Ouki and Renpa are pretty much the next big thing after Moubu/Kanmei. Then there's Gaimou. Everyone else? Not gonna last long. Especially vassals like Souou or Shiryou LOL.
The Qin6 are for a fact not equal in martial might, Kou Shou had 0 fighting ability himself but he was still a member of the Qin6.
But Oukotsu was specifically stated to have the greatest brute strength among the Qin6, meaning he’s probably a heavily martial general.
I agree, I think he just underestimated Kanmei and got one shot because of it lol. In actuality, Oukotsu was probably pretty close to his level of strength. I doubt we’ll ever meet any generals in kingdom who can low/mid diff qin6 level generals lol.
The point anyway was Kanmei vs. Akou & co., which clearly are not Q6 level, so that doesn't even matter.
Rinbou was getting his ass kicked by Shoumou which was one-shotted by Ouki. But somehow Shiryou which is Ousen's Rinbou is gonna give trouble to Kanmei? ROTFL. Not a chance in hell. One shot material.
The Qin6 are for a fact not equal in martial might, Kou Shou had 0 fighting ability himself but he was still a member of the Qin6.
But Oukotsu was specifically stated to have the greatest brute strength among the Qin6, meaning he’s probably a heavily martial general.
I agree, I think he just underestimated Kanmei and got one shot because of it lol. In actuality, Oukotsu was probably pretty close to his level of strength. I doubt we’ll ever meet any generals in kingdom who can low/mid diff qin6 level generals lol.
Houken is a martial beast and i doubt if there's a clash between him and MouBu or Kanmei than either of them could come out unscathed as you believe in there strength.
On everything about real strength of MouBu and Kanmei
MouBu or Kanmei aren't out of earth. Yup both are super strong but than again they came in same level Ouki, Renpa, SHK, Tou, Houken, Gaimou, Ranbihaku etc.
If it's about brute force than Rinbunkun was doing pretty good as well (against Rokuomi and other one) but Tou destroyed him. Lol
First of all there are characters who were put on same level as Moubu like ShouHeikun or Ouki. Now Tou is someone who believed to be on same level as Ouki by Rinou or GHM. MouBu said he can't even guess the real strength of this man.
Now there's underestimation of Akou coz he was strong that's why came out without death but still GyouUn sent him in coma.
Moubu is the real martial benchmark of the manga, and Kanmei who could oneshot a Qin Six pushed him to extreme diff. Truth is he would've won w/o Moubu's plot armor.
Neither Kanmei oneshots any of Qin six nor he can do that.
How could that be possible even when MouBu is real benchmark of strength.
MouBu got compared with Ouki and SHK. Than Ouki vs Houken was already a extreme diff fight same as Moubu vs Kanmei so now either Ouki or Houken could push Kanmei to extreme diff as well.
MouBu in reality defeated Kanmei as well so there isn't any plot armour.
We can totally compare Rihaku who specialized on defense or CGR with Ousen. Why? Because their tactics at the end of the day are based on their man standing planted on the ground and resisting the enemy attack. And they will not resist Kanmei's advance.
The level of complexity in OuSen/Akou's defensive formation and CGR's Shifting sand formation or whole existence of Rihaku is unmatched. That's why OuHon said specifically for OuSen's formation that it can't be broke down with brute force only.
One more fact, with just formations, Rihaku was able to hold MouBu for whole day.
Doubtful. Karin literally did whatever he wanted during the Coalition. Sneaked 5k elites behind Tou w/o him even noticing, went to Kanmei's battlefield, played with Elephants ecc. ecc. Meanwhile Tou had to promote Ousen and Mouten as commanders to avoid kicking the bucket and was essentially reacting all the time. Though he could probably resist long enough to keep Karis focused on him though.
The point anyway was Kanmei vs. Akou & co., which clearly are not Q6 level, so that doesn't even matter.
Rinbou was getting his ass kicked by Shoumou which was one-shotted by Ouki. But somehow Shiryou which is Ousen's Rinbou is gonna give trouble to Kanmei? ROTFL. Not a chance in hell. One shot material.
Akou and co. aren't going to duel with Kanmei but rather attack him on same time. Now if you're still believing that Kanmei can handle 5 vs 1 situation where Tou and Akou are available than i totally believes that you're overestimating Kanmei.
I should have elaborated more, I meant in a War type scenario. Someone like Rinshoujou would push Ouki to neg diff in a 1v1 fight, but would push Ouki to extreme diff or even win in War. Rinshoujou is not a martial General, so he pushes martial generals to neg diff in 1v1 fights.
Ou Kotsu on the other hand was a General who’s strength was based on his brute power, so I doubt there’s anyone in Kingdom who can mid or high diff him in a contest of brute strength
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