Questions & Mysteries A problem that I have with JJK (so far)

#1
This might be a very unpopular opinion considering the succes JJK currently has but atleast hear me out on this.

I am currently on episode 9 and the biggest issue that I have with this series is that there is so little ''substance'' behind everything that is happening, allow me to explain this :

When I look back at most of my favourite Shounen fights or climactic events within those anime, it's not so much about how amazing it looks or how well animated something is but rather the investment that I have with the story and the characters.

For instance, one of my favourite fights in Bleach is Ichigo vs Kenpachi. This fight happens around episode 40 and beforehand we (the viewers) get to spend a sufficient amount of time with Ichigo, we see his personal life, his friends/family. We see how he develops himself through his training and we understand his motivation for saving Rukia. We also get to spend some time in the soul society so we can understand the hierarchy between the Captains and vice-captains and this serves as a way to establish Kenpachi's threat-level. And so, when the fight happens not only does it look very good in terms of choreography but the substance and context behind it perfects it. Those two components combined (substance and fight choreography) make it amazing.

The problem with JJK is that there is just so little substance behind the events and fight that have transpired so far. When Gojo fights against Jogo for instance, while it looks amazing there is so little investment that I have with either of these characters or the story. Gojo is a character that I barely know, the power-system is still something that has to be properly explained and Gojo releasing his domain-expansion happens way to early.
The show also constantly introduces new characters while we've barely seen any of the 'older' cast do much.

What do you think?
 
#4
Oh for sure. There's very little depth to most things in JJK. This applies to the story, the surface level characters and also their fights. There are exceptions such as the Mahito fight after the Junpei incident, but 95% of everything just comes out of nowhere. The characters have no greater reason for fighting other than the fact that one is a curse and the other is a sorcerer.

The story seems like it's written to work around and for the purpose of getting to the next fight rather than the fights being a natural occurrence of the events of the story. The villains are less actual characters and are more just punching bags. There's often little or no build up at all to battles and so as you said, they're severely lacking in depth or any real substance. But they look cool, so can't complain too much.

Gege seems to favour more technical fights with impressive and flashy choreography over emotional battles with thematic meaning and contrasting ideals , so I guess it just comes down to what you prefer more. I can appreciate both, especially the fights in the Shibuya arc in the manga, but the lack of depth and a real narrative will always hold it back for me personally, since it shouldn't be a choice of whether to have good choreography or meaningful battles.
 
#5
Oh for sure. There's very little depth to most things in JJK. This applies to the story, the surface level characters and also their fights. There are exceptions such as the Mahito fight after the Junpei incident, but 95% of everything just comes out of nowhere. The characters have no greater reason for fighting other than the fact that one is a curse and the other is a sorcerer.

The story seems like it's written to work around and for the purpose of getting to the next fight rather than the fights being a natural occurrence of the events of the story. The villains are less actual characters and are more just punching bags. There's often little or no build up at all to battles and so as you said, they're severely lacking in depth or any real substance. But they look cool, so can't complain too much.

Gege seems to favour more technical fights with impressive and flashy choreography over emotional battles with thematic meaning and contrasting ideals , so I guess it just comes down to what you prefer more. I can appreciate both, especially the fights in the Shibuya arc in the manga, but the lack of depth and a real narrative will always hold it back for me personally, since it shouldn't be a choice of whether to have good choreography or meaningful battles.
Couldn't have said it any better. Personally, I'd say that the investment in a story is far more important than the way it looks. It wouldn't have been a problem if this was just a tournament-series like Baki but I initially expected a series with strong and essential narrative considering it starts off with Yuuji's Grandfather dying which was supposed to be emotional I geuss.
 

TheAncientCenturion

Kami no Sharingan
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#6
Yeah. I think that’s a general problem that follows a bulk of the series. There are two sections of the manga (well, one is a prequel spin off but written by the author all the same) that really delivers a good story. Everything before and after that comes off as bland in comparison.

Not a bad series by any means but definitely not something I see worth it’s hype, animation quality not withstanding.
 
#7
What I get from the anime was that it was a mixup between real life time(new experince) and flashback in the past when we actually get more character building for the characters. As Todo we see his motive and also get a hint, I feeling like(pls correct me if im wrong, all manga reader since I only watch the anime version) the mangaka doing it on purposely!

As example with Luffy and Rayleigh, Oda using their training multiple times to showcase new things, but also in same time we learning what happen in the past.

I feeling like the mangaka of JJK doing it also, only putting small details/flashbacks around the characters, with we learning only small details puzzle about each character. Like im sure with new missions, with new obstacles we learning more about each character. Megumin as example, we not get the full past flashback but small details, with every new experince we see a counterpart who show actually a past story, showing how a character growing up.

Im sure in case Gojo gonna get lot of background building too in the future, it will take time to explain the lore of the manga and im sure with new arcs we learning more about the concept, about the powerscaling, about character building.
At least that is what I get from the anime version.

In case if my though are true, the mangaka could make a very great worldbuilding and perform a great storywriting. I think the time will answer our question in the future.
 

Cinera

𝐘𝐚𝐦𝐚𝐭𝐨 > 𝐊𝐢𝐧𝐠
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#8
Oh for sure. There's very little depth to most things in JJK. This applies to the story, the surface level characters and also their fights. There are exceptions such as the Mahito fight after the Junpei incident, but 95% of everything just comes out of nowhere. The characters have no greater reason for fighting other than the fact that one is a curse and the other is a sorcerer.

The story seems like it's written to work around and for the purpose of getting to the next fight rather than the fights being a natural occurrence of the events of the story. The villains are less actual characters and are more just punching bags. There's often little or no build up at all to battles and so as you said, they're severely lacking in depth or any real substance. But they look cool, so can't complain too much.

Gege seems to favour more technical fights with impressive and flashy choreography over emotional battles with thematic meaning and contrasting ideals , so I guess it just comes down to what you prefer more. I can appreciate both, especially the fights in the Shibuya arc in the manga, but the lack of depth and a real narrative will always hold it back for me personally, since it shouldn't be a choice of whether to have good choreography or meaningful battles.
Yeah. I think that’s a general problem that follows a bulk of the series. There are two sections of the manga (well, one is a prequel spin off but written by the author all the same) that really delivers a good story. Everything before and after that comes off as bland in comparison.

Not a bad series by any means but definitely not something I see worth it’s hype, animation quality not withstanding.
JJK is good enough combat porn. It's fun enough if you enjoy that sort of thing. Other than that, the story isn't that compelling on it's own merits.
 
H

Haoshoku

#11
@dizzy2341 pretty much said everything. I would agree as well. I dropped the anime for a bit for pretty similar reasons. Didn’t think the all hype it was getting was nearly worth what I just watched (about 14 or so episodes). I tried getting into the manga but the art was lowkey ugly lol. The fights are solid though and MAPPA breaks the bank for them, making it the only appealing thing for the series imo.
 

Cinera

𝐘𝐚𝐦𝐚𝐭𝐨 > 𝐊𝐢𝐧𝐠
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#12
@dizzy2341 pretty much said everything. I would agree as well. I dropped the anime for a bit for pretty similar reasons. Didn’t think the all hype it was getting was nearly worth what I just watched (about 14 or so episodes). I tried getting into the manga but the art was lowkey ugly lol. The fights are solid though and MAPPA breaks the bank for them, making it the only appealing thing for the series imo.
Bruh, you read Solo Leveling. It's way worse on the "lack of an independently compelling story line aspect". JJK has some actually compelling characters and those characters get real development as the story progresses. Solo Leveling is just an unending power romp to godhood.
 
H

Haoshoku

#13
Bruh, you read Solo Leveling. It's way worse on the "lack of an independently compelling story line aspect". JJK has some actually compelling characters and those characters get real development as the story progresses. Solo Leveling is just an unending power romp to godhood.
I’m not big on Solo Leveling but its art, intricate power dynamics and dope combat makes it enjoyable enough for an occasional read through. Don’t get me wrong I enjoyed JJK too but it simply wasn’t worth the hype it was getting and entering its least favored arc, I decided to just wait for season 2. There’s still a lot I ain’t seen but I would be lying if I said those 14 episodes left a strong impression on me relative to the hype it was getting (shit was getting panned the “new school Bleach”, so my expectations were high coming into it).
 
#14
I’m not big on Solo Leveling but its art, intricate power dynamics and dope combat makes it enjoyable enough for an occasional read through. Don’t get me wrong I enjoyed JJK too but it simply wasn’t worth the hype it was getting and entering its least favored arc, I decided to just wait for season 2. There’s still a lot I ain’t seen but I would be lying if I said those 14 episodes left a strong impression on me relative to the hype it was getting (shit was getting panned the “new school Bleach”, so my expectations were high coming into it).
I mean, Bleach also suffered from the same issues that plague JJ

The main difference being that despite all the boring story. Bleach Characters still managed to be more memorable than the Landfill bore known as Jujutsu Characters
 
#15
I mean, Bleach also suffered from the same issues that plague JJ

The main difference being that despite all the boring story. Bleach Characters still managed to be more memorable than the Landfill bore known as Jujutsu Characters
Two things Bleach has going for it over JJK is originality and distinct character designs.

I tried reading the JJK manga (I got through 20 chapters or so) and I could not go two chapters without being reminded of other big name shonen manga, namely Bleach and Naruto.

JJK designs are just not that memorable. The art ain't up to much either.
 

Cinera

𝐘𝐚𝐦𝐚𝐭𝐨 > 𝐊𝐢𝐧𝐠
.
#17
I’m not big on Solo Leveling but its art, intricate power dynamics and dope combat makes it enjoyable enough for an occasional read through. Don’t get me wrong I enjoyed JJK too but it simply wasn’t worth the hype it was getting and entering its least favored arc, I decided to just wait for season 2. There’s still a lot I ain’t seen but I would be lying if I said those 14 episodes left a strong impression on me relative to the hype it was getting (shit was getting panned the “new school Bleach”, so my expectations were high coming into it).
I mean, Bleach also suffered from the same issues that plague JJ

The main difference being that despite all the boring story. Bleach Characters still managed to be more memorable than the Landfill bore known as Jujutsu Characters
Two things Bleach has going for it over JJK is originality and distinct character designs.

I tried reading the JJK manga (I got through 20 chapters or so) and I could not go two chapters without being reminded of other big name shonen manga, namely Bleach and Naruto.

JJK designs are just not that memorable. The art ain't up to much either.
I've only read the manga (I made it past chapter 100), but I found some characters distinctive and compelling enough in their own rights.

That said, @Light D Lamperouge can attest that I regularly fail to recognise several characters from JJK, so maybe I'm not the best person to argue that they have memorable characters.
:chopoff:
 
H

Haoshoku

#18
I mean, Bleach also suffered from the same issues that plague JJ

The main difference being that despite all the boring story. Bleach Characters still managed to be more memorable than the Landfill bore known as Jujutsu Characters
That’s the thing, the characters held the fort for Bleach through all the inconsistencies and bad writing. I don’t think JJK has had any such inconsistencies or bad writing on the levels that Bleach stooped to at times nor have I heard anything of the sort. So JJK probably handles that far better, my expectations were more in line with the characters but it turns out the only real similarity that JJK and Bleach share is that of the Hollows and the Curses attacking humans. Bleach grows out of that setting by its second arc. Otherwise I get more Naruto vibes tbh. And yes the side characters of Bleach >>>> JJK’s. Though there are some that I liked (Mahito, Sukuna). Setting aside the Bleach comp, JJK has been getting insane hype regardless.
 
#19
That’s the thing, the characters held the fort for Bleach through all the inconsistencies and bad writing. I don’t think JJK has had any such inconsistencies or bad writing on the levels that Bleach stooped to at times nor have I heard anything of the sort. So JJK probably handles that far better, my expectations were more in line with the characters but it turns out the only real similarity that JJK and Bleach share is that of the Hollows and the Curses attacking humans. Bleach grows out of that setting by its second arc. Otherwise I get more Naruto vibes tbh. And yes the side characters of Bleach >>>> JJK’s. Though there are some that I liked (Mahito, Sukuna). Setting aside the Bleach comp, JJK has been getting insane hype regardless.
It has a lot more Naruto comparisons lol. Some scenes feel like homages to Naruto, like when the students all fought before the forest school exam. Felt very Lee vs Sasuke.

Toji breaking free of his undead constraints is like Itachi too.

Sukuna is honestly a better utilized version of the Kyuubi.

Though Mahito feels like a bastardization of Shigaraki from MHA and Ulquiorra.
 
#20
That’s the thing, the characters held the fort for Bleach through all the inconsistencies and bad writing. I don’t think JJK has had any such inconsistencies or bad writing on the levels that Bleach stooped to at times nor have I heard anything of the sort. So JJK probably handles that far better, my expectations were more in line with the characters but it turns out the only real similarity that JJK and Bleach share is that of the Hollows and the Curses attacking humans. Bleach grows out of that setting by its second arc. Otherwise I get more Naruto vibes tbh. And yes the side characters of Bleach >>>> JJK’s. Though there are some that I liked (Mahito, Sukuna). Setting aside the Bleach comp, JJK has been getting insane hype regardless.
To be honest, it is better for a series to be good at a few select areas than to be average in every area. It has a far better chance of being memorable.

A series also has a much better chance of being memorable when it is original. Imitation might be the sincerest form of flattery but it only flatters someone else, not oneself.

After 20 chapters of JJK, all I could think was "Okay, so Curses are basically Hollows but minus the disturbing human factor, Gojo is Kakashi, Sakuna is Kyuubi, Yuji is Naruto, Yuji's classmates are the serious black haired one and Sakura 2.0, oh and that bigwig bloke from the rival school looks like some hipster Yamamoto."

This was followed by "A feckin tournament arc? Already? Really?" and that was when I decided to read Claymore instead. Lol.

Early JJK leans too much on other notable shonen and that was a big turn off for me. It's got a superficial Bleach setting combined with Naruto's initial plot points.
 
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