IMPORTANT: I WILL NOT COUNT VOTES FROM THOSE WHO DO NOT VOTE FOR EACH FIGHT. ALSO IF I SEE OR NOTICE SOME SUSPICIOUS ACTIVITY THAT ENTRY WILL BE DISQUALIFIED.
In this round in this thread we will have 6 deuteragonists, which means 3 fights.
FIRST FIGHT
Roronoa Zoro
VS
Askeladd from Vinland Saga
In the manga Vinland Saga, Askeladd serves the role as the second most important character perfectly. The weight of his decisions impacts pivotal story arcs and pushes the narrative more than the youthful Thorfinn โthe actual protagonist. But that alone isnโt what makes Askeladd such a great character. What defines Askeladd is the relationship he shares with Thorfinn that accents every choice made and hangs over both with looming dread.
Quite simplyโAskeladd was responsible for the death of Thorfinnโs father, a well revered former Viking. Swearing vengeance upon Askeladd, a prepubescent Thorfinn stole himself upon Askeladdโs crew with the single thought of murdering this man. A deal was struck after several arduous tasks, Thorfinn would serve Askeladd faithfully and every completed assignment, Thorfinn would have the chance to murder Askeladd.
This dichotomy puts these two constantly at odds despite often times cooperating towards a single goalโalways Askeladdโs goal.
Askeladd is the wall that Thorfinn strives to ascend and never quite reaches. Heโs the schemer who is happy to use Thorfinnโs how turbulent emotions and exceptional talent for life taking to his own benefit.
All this comes to a head after successfully completing a task in Northern Englandโwhere Thorfinn challenges Askeladd yet again. This time though itโs revealed that, after a brutal beat down, that Thorfinn will never overcome Askeladd. And the simple reason is because Thorfinn will never consent to doing the rational thing, killing Askeladd in his sleep.
Here we learn that Askeladd was once similar to Thorfinn. He was a slave however, watching his mother descend into insanity as she physically weakened. Given the first opportunity, Askeladd wormed his way into his father/masters inner circle and struck. He murdered his father and half siblings. His grudge was dealt with.
Askeladd represents a purpose for Thorfinn but also a mirror into a whole new world. One of violence and deceit, one that Thorfinn cannot immerse himself in despite being a prolific killer himself. Askeladd succeeds so well thanks to his own similarities and growth from where Thorfinn shies away from.
Even beyond his demise, sacrificing himself in an uncharacteristic display of altruism, he remained a pivotal figure for Thorfinn. His death shattered Thorfinnโs will to continue and brought Thorfinn back to his fathers earnest intentions as opposed to the world of violence that Askeladd so embodies.
He is the cynical schemer who comes from a humble origin but nonetheless aspires to greatness. Carrying us all along the way.
SECOND FIGHT
Obi Wan Kenobi
VS
Griffith from Berserk
In this round in this thread we will have 6 deuteragonists, which means 3 fights.
FIRST FIGHT
Roronoa Zoro
Roronoa is the swordsman of the Strawhat pirates, and the first member recruited by Luffy. His dream is to become the world's strongest swordsman. And to that end, he trains everyday to achieve it. As a member of the Strawhats, Zoro embarks on a journey which would see him and his friends meet various people and overcome new foes. With strength and will power that rivals his captain, Zoro stands shoulder to shoulder with Luffy, as his personal ambitions and desires evolve to safe keep those of his captain.
Accompanying scene.
Accompanying scene.
VS
Askeladd from Vinland Saga
In the manga Vinland Saga, Askeladd serves the role as the second most important character perfectly. The weight of his decisions impacts pivotal story arcs and pushes the narrative more than the youthful Thorfinn โthe actual protagonist. But that alone isnโt what makes Askeladd such a great character. What defines Askeladd is the relationship he shares with Thorfinn that accents every choice made and hangs over both with looming dread.
Quite simplyโAskeladd was responsible for the death of Thorfinnโs father, a well revered former Viking. Swearing vengeance upon Askeladd, a prepubescent Thorfinn stole himself upon Askeladdโs crew with the single thought of murdering this man. A deal was struck after several arduous tasks, Thorfinn would serve Askeladd faithfully and every completed assignment, Thorfinn would have the chance to murder Askeladd.
This dichotomy puts these two constantly at odds despite often times cooperating towards a single goalโalways Askeladdโs goal.
Askeladd is the wall that Thorfinn strives to ascend and never quite reaches. Heโs the schemer who is happy to use Thorfinnโs how turbulent emotions and exceptional talent for life taking to his own benefit.
All this comes to a head after successfully completing a task in Northern Englandโwhere Thorfinn challenges Askeladd yet again. This time though itโs revealed that, after a brutal beat down, that Thorfinn will never overcome Askeladd. And the simple reason is because Thorfinn will never consent to doing the rational thing, killing Askeladd in his sleep.
Here we learn that Askeladd was once similar to Thorfinn. He was a slave however, watching his mother descend into insanity as she physically weakened. Given the first opportunity, Askeladd wormed his way into his father/masters inner circle and struck. He murdered his father and half siblings. His grudge was dealt with.
Askeladd represents a purpose for Thorfinn but also a mirror into a whole new world. One of violence and deceit, one that Thorfinn cannot immerse himself in despite being a prolific killer himself. Askeladd succeeds so well thanks to his own similarities and growth from where Thorfinn shies away from.
Even beyond his demise, sacrificing himself in an uncharacteristic display of altruism, he remained a pivotal figure for Thorfinn. His death shattered Thorfinnโs will to continue and brought Thorfinn back to his fathers earnest intentions as opposed to the world of violence that Askeladd so embodies.
He is the cynical schemer who comes from a humble origin but nonetheless aspires to greatness. Carrying us all along the way.
SECOND FIGHT
Obi Wan Kenobi
Obi Wan is well known in the Star Wars universe. He was always a very important character, but was not the deuteragonist of the first movies (4,5,6).
But he became the leading partner of the main character, Anakin, and his past, motivations, failures, love etc were explored deeply. Obi Wan with the Prequel 1,2,3 and the multiple seasons of The Clone Wars became the real deuteragonist of the franchise and even stole it sometimes. Obi was sometimes doing his own things, having his own fights, and his own episodes.
Now lets explain a bit Obi Wan as a character :
We met Obi-Wan in the phantom menace as a Padawan, a young apprentice, under master Qui Gon Jin.
Obi was brash and young but this movie was the real beginning of his story : he met the young Anakin, lost his master thanks to Darth maul mighty double blade, and in the end was tasked to train the young Skywalker.
Obi Wan grew to be a really skilled Jedi, power wise, the guy was still learning but was strong. And he was one of the most calm, diplomatic, and efficient Jedi in the whole Order.
Obi Wan is often the smart one, he doesn't act without thinking first, can have good battle plans, and his wits often helped him to leave battle with the win. Obi Wan never was pure power and sheer might, but craft and skill.
Obi Wan has also a great talent the guy likes to troll and taunt, he is often the one trashtalking people and he kept the spirit even in the worst situations :
Obi is a great deuteragonist because he also has his side quest and his sides story. Everything is not linked to Anakin. He had a lot of screen time.
Obi Wan defeated Maul in the first episode, was tasked to check on Kamino and fought jango fett, beat Grievous and even in the end was the one beating Anakin.
Other exemple : Obi Wan had an episode where he faked his death to infiltrate a crime syndicate and took the identity of a bounty hunter :
Obi had lots of solo adventures.
Obi Wan can be explained with 3 great relationships :
Obi Wan and Anakin, Obi Wan and Satine, and Obi Wan and Darth Maul.
Obi and Anakin :
Obi Wan and Anakin relationship is interesting : he didn't want Anakin at first but he promised a death bed Qui Gon to raise and train him. But Obi Wan wasn't really old at that time and barely a Jedi knight. Quickly he took Anakin under his wing and they became close. Anakin boldness and talent coupled with Obi Wan brain made a great team. Obi wasn't the perfect little jedi who was just followed the code blindly with a huge stick into his ass, he was loose enough to adapt and understand others. But he was still deeply attached to the Jedi ways and the force.
Obi Wan soon enough became Anakin big brother and mentor before being his master. They knew like 1000 tough to extreme situations and often managed to leave in one piece doing things their own way.
Anakin ofetn proved to be a difficult pupil and Obi still had to order him and put him straight from time to time.
Finding the real balance between the friend, the mentor, the master, was difficult for a young knight and then a young master especially when tasked training the chosen one but Obi Wan did the best of his capacity.
And obviously the end was pure greek tragedy. Obi Wan vs Anakin was both sad and spectacular.
But Obi Wan even after everything and the end of the republic Obi Wan still had faith in the force and didn't lose all hope. He took care of Luke, Anakin son.
Obi Wan and Satine :
The Jedi order forbid all attachment and love. Yet Obi Wa was not made of stone and loved someone even tough he resisted till the end. But Obi respected the code and never confessed to Satine knowing thatif he said the words he would have to leave to order.
Satine and Obi Wan fought and argued all the time like an old couple, but it was only sheer sexual attraction and feelings.
Satine was the new ruler of Mandalore and Obi Wan went there to protect her and save her.
This relationship proved that Obi Wan wasn't like the other Jedi, he was a lot more human, prone to real feelings, and it showed the difficulty he had between his duty and his heart.
Obi Wan and Darth Maul :
Darth Maul is maybe Obi Wan main enemy. Yeah Anakin/Vader became his bane but Maul really impacted all his life, from the beginning to the end.
Maul took Obi Wan master Qui Gon. Maul took Obi Wan loved one Satine. Maul tracked him everywhere during the whole clone wars and they had an ultimate fight when both were old.
Obi Wan hated Maul at first for killing Qui Gon but over the years he learnt how and why Maul became like that and he understood him. Obi Wan never again yield to rage or hate against Maul (Maul main theme). Even when Maul killed Satine Obi Wan was distressed but didn't turned dark.
After decades of fighting Obi killed Maul but not for somr great revenge but only to stop and free Maul from his hate and miserable life. In the end Maul died in Obi arms.
But he became the leading partner of the main character, Anakin, and his past, motivations, failures, love etc were explored deeply. Obi Wan with the Prequel 1,2,3 and the multiple seasons of The Clone Wars became the real deuteragonist of the franchise and even stole it sometimes. Obi was sometimes doing his own things, having his own fights, and his own episodes.
Now lets explain a bit Obi Wan as a character :
We met Obi-Wan in the phantom menace as a Padawan, a young apprentice, under master Qui Gon Jin.
Obi was brash and young but this movie was the real beginning of his story : he met the young Anakin, lost his master thanks to Darth maul mighty double blade, and in the end was tasked to train the young Skywalker.
Obi Wan grew to be a really skilled Jedi, power wise, the guy was still learning but was strong. And he was one of the most calm, diplomatic, and efficient Jedi in the whole Order.
Obi Wan is often the smart one, he doesn't act without thinking first, can have good battle plans, and his wits often helped him to leave battle with the win. Obi Wan never was pure power and sheer might, but craft and skill.
Obi Wan has also a great talent the guy likes to troll and taunt, he is often the one trashtalking people and he kept the spirit even in the worst situations :
Obi is a great deuteragonist because he also has his side quest and his sides story. Everything is not linked to Anakin. He had a lot of screen time.
Obi Wan defeated Maul in the first episode, was tasked to check on Kamino and fought jango fett, beat Grievous and even in the end was the one beating Anakin.
Other exemple : Obi Wan had an episode where he faked his death to infiltrate a crime syndicate and took the identity of a bounty hunter :
Obi had lots of solo adventures.
Obi Wan can be explained with 3 great relationships :
Obi Wan and Anakin, Obi Wan and Satine, and Obi Wan and Darth Maul.
Obi and Anakin :
Obi Wan and Anakin relationship is interesting : he didn't want Anakin at first but he promised a death bed Qui Gon to raise and train him. But Obi Wan wasn't really old at that time and barely a Jedi knight. Quickly he took Anakin under his wing and they became close. Anakin boldness and talent coupled with Obi Wan brain made a great team. Obi wasn't the perfect little jedi who was just followed the code blindly with a huge stick into his ass, he was loose enough to adapt and understand others. But he was still deeply attached to the Jedi ways and the force.
Obi Wan soon enough became Anakin big brother and mentor before being his master. They knew like 1000 tough to extreme situations and often managed to leave in one piece doing things their own way.
Anakin ofetn proved to be a difficult pupil and Obi still had to order him and put him straight from time to time.
Finding the real balance between the friend, the mentor, the master, was difficult for a young knight and then a young master especially when tasked training the chosen one but Obi Wan did the best of his capacity.
And obviously the end was pure greek tragedy. Obi Wan vs Anakin was both sad and spectacular.
But Obi Wan even after everything and the end of the republic Obi Wan still had faith in the force and didn't lose all hope. He took care of Luke, Anakin son.
Obi Wan and Satine :
The Jedi order forbid all attachment and love. Yet Obi Wa was not made of stone and loved someone even tough he resisted till the end. But Obi respected the code and never confessed to Satine knowing thatif he said the words he would have to leave to order.
Satine and Obi Wan fought and argued all the time like an old couple, but it was only sheer sexual attraction and feelings.
Satine was the new ruler of Mandalore and Obi Wan went there to protect her and save her.
This relationship proved that Obi Wan wasn't like the other Jedi, he was a lot more human, prone to real feelings, and it showed the difficulty he had between his duty and his heart.
Obi Wan and Darth Maul :
Darth Maul is maybe Obi Wan main enemy. Yeah Anakin/Vader became his bane but Maul really impacted all his life, from the beginning to the end.
Maul took Obi Wan master Qui Gon. Maul took Obi Wan loved one Satine. Maul tracked him everywhere during the whole clone wars and they had an ultimate fight when both were old.
Obi Wan hated Maul at first for killing Qui Gon but over the years he learnt how and why Maul became like that and he understood him. Obi Wan never again yield to rage or hate against Maul (Maul main theme). Even when Maul killed Satine Obi Wan was distressed but didn't turned dark.
After decades of fighting Obi killed Maul but not for somr great revenge but only to stop and free Maul from his hate and miserable life. In the end Maul died in Obi arms.
VS
Griffith from Berserk
Griffith is one of the greatest manga characters ever created and is the deuteragonist/villain of Kentaro Miuraโs masterpiece Berserk. He is the leader of the reborn Band of Falcon and was the leader of the original Band of Falcon. His story, character, the narrative it takes is a direct contrast to the protagonist of the series - Guts.
As the leader of the original Band of the Falcon, he and his mercenaries are able to end the Hundred-Year War and bring peace to the war-torn kingdom of Midland. Following the desertion of his most trusted confidant Guts, Griffith beds Princess Charlotte on impulse, bringing about his imprisonment, year-long crippling torture, and the seeming demise of his dream. Though he is eventually rescued by the band, his state of extreme invalidity and undying desire to obtain his own kingdom compels him to sacrifice his comrades during the Fifth Eclipse, for kinsmanship with the God Hand as their fifth member Femto โ a demonic, idealized version of himself stripped of his human inhibitions. In time, he is incarnated into the Physical World, concerned solely with the realization of his dream, which comes to pass with his thwarting of the Kushan invasion of Midland, the Great Roar of the Astral World he prompts, and the rise of his utopian capital city, Falconia
When we meet Griffith in the Golden Age Arc, he's introduced as a charismatic white knight, so unique in the world that he appears like a "saint" sent to save his followers, the "blazing inferno" for lost souls to gather around in an otherwise hostile world. He's a childish dreamer in a world where impractical things like dreams are in short supply, but because he can deliver on his convictions, he becomes the "miracle" people project their hopes upon, starting with his band of mercenaries and eventually growing to be a symbol for the entire kingdom of Midland. Long before the post-Eclipse prophecies of the Hawk of Light are spread, Kentaro Miura paints Griffith as someone who transcends the bounds of his world. Characters often comment on his almost otherworldly allure, which they can only admire but never quite comprehend.
Aside from his heritage as a poor commoner who refused to quietly waste away in a meaningless existence as a back-alley rat, we learn very little about Griffith's childhood. While admired and idolized by his Band of the Hawk, Griffith is shrewd and ruthless in his ambition, manipulating or disposing of the people who oppose his rise to power without hesitation. He's arrogant and brutally realistic about human nature, but most importantly, he's the kind of person that Guts aspires to stand on equal ground with.
THIRD FIGHT
Samwise Gamgee from LOTR
"Bravery is not the absence of fear. Bravery is feeling the fear, the doubt, the insecurity and deciding that something else is more important".
Samwise Gamgee also known as Samwise "The Brave" is one of the 2 deuteragonists of the Lord of the rings film series (the other being Aragorn). He is Frodo Baggins' gardener/best friend who by chance and the will of a wizard ends up joining Frodo on his quest to destroy the one ring of power.
Throughout the 3 films Sam shows tremendous loyalty towards his friend Frodo and bravery in the face of impossible odds. What makes Sam special to me is his bravery and how he overcomes his self doubt and the fact that he is the voice of reason for Frodo on their quest. As Frodo once quoted "Frodo would not have gotten very far without Sam".
Samwise Gamgee also known as Samwise "The Brave" is one of the 2 deuteragonists of the Lord of the rings film series (the other being Aragorn). He is Frodo Baggins' gardener/best friend who by chance and the will of a wizard ends up joining Frodo on his quest to destroy the one ring of power.
Throughout the 3 films Sam shows tremendous loyalty towards his friend Frodo and bravery in the face of impossible odds. What makes Sam special to me is his bravery and how he overcomes his self doubt and the fact that he is the voice of reason for Frodo on their quest. As Frodo once quoted "Frodo would not have gotten very far without Sam".
MY FAVE SCENES
VS
L from DN
L is a world-renowned detective who takes on the challenge of catching the mass murderer known as Kira. In his investigation, L becomes suspicious of Light Yagami and makes it his goal to prove that Light is Kira.
L, who also uses the aliases Hideki Ryuga, Ryuzaki, Eraldo Coil and Deneuve, the latter two for which he has developed reputations as the secondโand thirdโbest detectives in the world, is quite secretive and only communicates with the world through his assistant Watari. He never shows his face to the world, instead of representing himself with a capital L in Cloister Black font. After meeting the Kira investigation team, he requests that the task force refers to him as Ryuzaki for discretion. The Kira investigation team never learns his true name.
L's disheveled and languid appearance masks his great powers of deduction and insight. He tends to second-guess everything he is presented with and is extremely meticulous and analytical. He has several quirks such as preferring to crouch rather than sit, eating only sweet foods like desserts and fruits, and holding items very delicately. He stayed in England for five years, and during that time he was the champion in tennis for the England Junior Cup.
L suggests that even though he eats only sweet foods, he remains underweight because the brain uses the most calories of any organ in the body. He also says that if he sits normally, his reasoning ability would drop 40%.
L is very intelligent, though his disheveled and languid appearance masks his great powers of deduction and many question his abilities upon viewing him. L tends to second-guess everything he is presented with, and is extremely meticulous and analytical. He is good at deceiving his opponents, and is willing to take drastic measures to solve a case. Some of his tactics are quite bold, such as having death row inmate Lind L. Tailor pose as himself on live TV in order to draw out Kira, while others seem bizarre to those involved, such as handcuffing himself to suspected-Kira, Light Yagami. He is also shown to have a dry sense of humor, and he isn't above making sarcastic remarks to people. Although he tends to be polite, to some (such as Task Force member Shuichi Aizawa), L can seem condescending at times.
Using subterfuge, misinformation, disinformation, and an analytical knowledge of human nature to help lure a suspected murderer into a false sense of security and possibly make him carelessly over-confident, L sometimes gets what he wants through abnormal or possibly criminal channels. Whenever L gives percentages to indicate how much he suspects a person of committing a crime, such as "five percent," he may in fact be over ninety percent convinced of their culpability. Although L tells Light that he is among the least likely suspects with one of the lowest percentages of probability, in reality L is "pretty certain" that Light is Kira. As series writer Tsugumi Ohba said laughing, making light of L's tactics: "The truth is, he's a liar."
From his debut, L establishes himself as Light's definitive opponent. That is, he shows himself to be the sole character in the story who is capable of not only disproving Kira's godhood, but is also very real threat to Light's survival. While L lives, Light cannot be the God he seeks to be.
To repeat, L is the unmovable object to Light Yagamiโs unstoppable force, but that in itself doesnโt make him on equal grounds with Kira in terms of the narrative. Whilst his role and legacy does achieve this, and L himself is Light's single main rival and equal, making the assumption that in the entirety of the Death Note series Ryuzaki himself is on par with Kira is a mistake. The cat and mouse dynamic between L and his legacy in relation to Light Yagami is what many believe to be the greatest part of the Manga, the former especially, but that particular section only spans half the plot. Itโs important to note that whilst L and his personal hunt for Kira may be what makes people remember Death Note more than anything, making the claim that Ryuzaki was as much an antagonist as Light was a protagonist would only be true if the story had ended following the conclusion of that arc (also known as Episode 25 and Chapter 58). However, it didn't, and the story continued with new threats with new faces, and although they all link back to the same source in a thematically pleasing sense, Ryuzakiโs role wasnโt to be the equal character to Kira.
In my opinion, it was the role of L to parallel and personify different ideologies along with Light, acting as the other half of the same coin, as well as to demonstrate the evolution of Lightโs god-complex; he provides an alternate to Kiraโs justice. This can be seen as his more thematic duty, and duty from a story-telling perspective, but of course his character is loved for very different reasons.
L, who also uses the aliases Hideki Ryuga, Ryuzaki, Eraldo Coil and Deneuve, the latter two for which he has developed reputations as the secondโand thirdโbest detectives in the world, is quite secretive and only communicates with the world through his assistant Watari. He never shows his face to the world, instead of representing himself with a capital L in Cloister Black font. After meeting the Kira investigation team, he requests that the task force refers to him as Ryuzaki for discretion. The Kira investigation team never learns his true name.
L's disheveled and languid appearance masks his great powers of deduction and insight. He tends to second-guess everything he is presented with and is extremely meticulous and analytical. He has several quirks such as preferring to crouch rather than sit, eating only sweet foods like desserts and fruits, and holding items very delicately. He stayed in England for five years, and during that time he was the champion in tennis for the England Junior Cup.
L suggests that even though he eats only sweet foods, he remains underweight because the brain uses the most calories of any organ in the body. He also says that if he sits normally, his reasoning ability would drop 40%.
L is very intelligent, though his disheveled and languid appearance masks his great powers of deduction and many question his abilities upon viewing him. L tends to second-guess everything he is presented with, and is extremely meticulous and analytical. He is good at deceiving his opponents, and is willing to take drastic measures to solve a case. Some of his tactics are quite bold, such as having death row inmate Lind L. Tailor pose as himself on live TV in order to draw out Kira, while others seem bizarre to those involved, such as handcuffing himself to suspected-Kira, Light Yagami. He is also shown to have a dry sense of humor, and he isn't above making sarcastic remarks to people. Although he tends to be polite, to some (such as Task Force member Shuichi Aizawa), L can seem condescending at times.
Using subterfuge, misinformation, disinformation, and an analytical knowledge of human nature to help lure a suspected murderer into a false sense of security and possibly make him carelessly over-confident, L sometimes gets what he wants through abnormal or possibly criminal channels. Whenever L gives percentages to indicate how much he suspects a person of committing a crime, such as "five percent," he may in fact be over ninety percent convinced of their culpability. Although L tells Light that he is among the least likely suspects with one of the lowest percentages of probability, in reality L is "pretty certain" that Light is Kira. As series writer Tsugumi Ohba said laughing, making light of L's tactics: "The truth is, he's a liar."
From his debut, L establishes himself as Light's definitive opponent. That is, he shows himself to be the sole character in the story who is capable of not only disproving Kira's godhood, but is also very real threat to Light's survival. While L lives, Light cannot be the God he seeks to be.
To repeat, L is the unmovable object to Light Yagamiโs unstoppable force, but that in itself doesnโt make him on equal grounds with Kira in terms of the narrative. Whilst his role and legacy does achieve this, and L himself is Light's single main rival and equal, making the assumption that in the entirety of the Death Note series Ryuzaki himself is on par with Kira is a mistake. The cat and mouse dynamic between L and his legacy in relation to Light Yagami is what many believe to be the greatest part of the Manga, the former especially, but that particular section only spans half the plot. Itโs important to note that whilst L and his personal hunt for Kira may be what makes people remember Death Note more than anything, making the claim that Ryuzaki was as much an antagonist as Light was a protagonist would only be true if the story had ended following the conclusion of that arc (also known as Episode 25 and Chapter 58). However, it didn't, and the story continued with new threats with new faces, and although they all link back to the same source in a thematically pleasing sense, Ryuzakiโs role wasnโt to be the equal character to Kira.
In my opinion, it was the role of L to parallel and personify different ideologies along with Light, acting as the other half of the same coin, as well as to demonstrate the evolution of Lightโs god-complex; he provides an alternate to Kiraโs justice. This can be seen as his more thematic duty, and duty from a story-telling perspective, but of course his character is loved for very different reasons.
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heard many good things.
