Questions & Mysteries Did Katakuri break Jinbe out of jail?

Did Katakuri free Jinbe?


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#62
Sanji hold back a lot same goes for Judge, the fodders are nothing when their own boss get basically one shotet by Big mom, so yes you are wrong.
Ah yes, just like when Oda specifically wrote the chapter this week that allowed Kanjuro to entirely trump over 5 supernova, 8 scabbards and an entire army of samurai.

Watch him do the same next week to explain how Germa and Sun Pirates escaped.
 
#63
I was talking from the writing perspective. It shows that Kaido is perfectly able of letting potential threats escape despite having had the perfect occasion to crush them.
But i dont think that any of that stuff from Kaido is comparable to BM vs Jimbei. If the fishmen were to, for example, sink their fleet with a big ass tsunami, and they make their escape while the non DF eaters are busy rescuing BM and the commanders, then thats not the same as Kaido having everyone checkmated and instead of winning quits the game. Kaido could have wiped them out if he cared enough, BM couldnt, and thats not because she was weaker than anyone present there but because she was at a disadvantage terrain wise
 
#64
Ah yes, just like when Oda specifically wrote the chapter this week that allowed Kanjuro to entirely trump over 5 supernova, 8 scavbards and an entire army of samurai.
5 Supernova who didn´t first know that Kanjuro was a traitor. Luffy only get the news after Chopper said him this, but that was then to later while Kanjuro was already flying away. Sanji go back to protect Nami, the Scabbards outside of Kawamatsu couldn´t do anything, amry of samurai and also the Sunny had problems with the beast pirates(fighting them offpanel).

Yet you can´t compare them to Big mom who was in full rage and using her life or death, while the germa66+sun pirates was already totally exhausted and injured a lot.

Jinbe don´t let his crewmates get slaughter by Big mom, he would not run away and see how Aladdin and co get killed by Big mom.
And I don´t think that fodder germa soldiers could do something against Big mom when even Judge,Niji and Yonji get beaten in a immediately in few seconds.
 
#65
But i dont think that any of that stuff from Kaido is comparable to BM vs Jimbei. If the fishmen were to, for example, sink their fleet with a big ass tsunami, and they make their escape while the non DF eaters are busy rescuing BM and the commanders, then thats not the same as Kaido having everyone checkmated and instead of winning quits the game. Kaido could have wiped them out if he cared enough, BM couldnt, and thats not because she was weaker than anyone present there but because she was at a disadvantage terrain wise
I doubt that they would have been. Fishmen are not able of creating tsunamis, even the strongest Fishman karate or Fishman Jujutsu users like Jinbei and the Sun Pirates were able of damaging and slowing the BMP fleet down but not of destroying it even before BM came.
The best thing they could have done was of escaping.
 
#66
5 Supernova who didn´t first know that Kanjuro was a traitor. Luffy only get the news after Chopper said him this, but that was then to later while Kanjuro was already flying away. Sanji go back to protect Nami, the Scabbards outside of Kawamatsu couldn´t do anything, amry of samurai and also the Sunny had problems with the beast pirates(fighting them offpanel).

Yet you can´t compare them to Big mom who was in full rage and using her life or death, while the germa66+sun pirates was already totally exhausted and injured a lot.

Jinbe don´t let his crewmates get slaughter by Big mom, he would not run away and see how Aladdin and co get killed by Big mom.
And I don´t think that fodder germa soldiers could do something against Big mom when even Judge,Niji and Yonji get beaten in a immediately in few seconds.
My god guys, the point wasn't that fodder could do something to Big Mom, it was that they could be used as a distraction against Big Mom and her crew to escape. Thats all I was literally saying. You see how Judge, Ichichi, Niji, Yonji and Reiju's distraction allowed everyone to escape into Big Father before they were beaten? THATS what I'm talking about.

A big part of Germa at WCI was the fact that their clones are just meat shields with no lives of their own. An overwhelming number (most of Germa's kingdom and ships) could sacrifice themselves to let one crew and the Germa mothership escape. THATS my point. Say for example:

- Judge sends 1000s of soldiers to their deaths. They do so and it allows a fishman to save Peckoms.
- This also allows Jinbe and the Sun Pirates to setup a massive water type attack that distracts the hell out of the BMPs.

Are we all going to act like Enies Lobby NEVER happened? 7 Pirates fought Commodores and Captain level Marines while the 5 Vice Admirals for the Buster Call did NOTHING. Sanji then outsmarted the ENTIRE marine force there by closing the Gates of Justice. Franky then further outsmarted them by using Coup de Burst. All while Aokiji did NOTHING.

I'm just telling, be prepared for Oda's writing to explain how they escaped by outsmarting the BMP's. Its CLEAR she is pissed and is at Wano because they escaped. It is the nature of HOW they escaped that is the question.
 
#67
No he was able to ran away on his own

Jinbe and his crew being able to escape make sense, its how Oda made a big deal out of BM appearing in front of them than off paneling the ending of the fight that made us expect that he wouldn't be able to, Oda trolled us that's all lol

I don't get why BM reached Wano before him tho it doesn't make sense
 
#68
No he was able to ran away on his own

Jinbe and his crew being able to escape make sense, its how Oda made a big deal out of BM appearing in front of them than off paneling the ending of the fight that made us expect that he wouldn't be able to, Oda trolled us that's all lol

I don't get why BM reached Wano before him tho it doesn't make sense
My guess is that Jinbe actually recruited some people and we just haven't seen them yet. Or they were recovering their injuries (though definitely too much time has passed for that, considering Luffy took the worst and was fine in a few days). We'll find out next chapter.
 
#69
If he was even caught, probably.
Why would you assume Jinbe went to jail... He is a fishman against a bunch of DF users in the middle of the sea. He can just dive down and swim away.

If anything Germa is the one who would have the problem. Although even they can fly at light speed away, if they were willing to abandon their castle.
Not necessarily. Jinbe could have helped Germa too. Remember he can call whale sharks to him, as he did following Impel Down. Could have used those to help Germa escape.
 
#70
Jinbe was on the sea already and was just waiting for Luffy's group to escape.
All he needed to do was go underwater in a second without fighting back anymore. And no, I don't see Oven being enough to completely stop the fishmen fleeing at full speed underwater.
Ok so what the fuck hasn't he went minutes later on the Sunny while the others went to hiding
 
#71
Thats all I was literally saying. You see how Judge, Ichichi, Niji, Yonji and Reiju's distraction allowed everyone to escape into Big Father before they were beaten? THATS what I'm talking about.
But that wasn´t really a escaping, the BM pirates know that Capone and the alliance was in trouble and couldn´t move anymore, they just need to stay and wait until they come out. Do you forget the second escape plan which totally fail and only get saved by the bomb?
Two whole different situations, why someone as Oven or Big mom would let in the first place let the alliance escape, she has a huge range attack arsenal. It doesn´t matter if fodders stand against her, she will hit many of them with one attack and then?

She was already using his ability death or life and not everyone was immun to that ability. And of course Jinbe don´t let his own crewmates get slaughter by Big mom. He would rather stand against her then just one of his crew member, don´t forget the point, stalling Big mom little more would mean> Strawhats can safety escape not only from her terittory but also in a huge distance.

An overwhelming number (most of Germa's kingdom and ships) could sacrifice themselves to let one crew and the Germa mothership escape. THATS my point. Say for example:

- Judge sends 1000s of soldiers to their deaths. They do so and it allows a fishman to save Peckoms.
The problem is, fodders don´t gonna stop Big mom to use her aoe attacks, she don´t get district her either when she could spamm such huge attacks:


Which something like this she could immediately sink a exhausted Germa66 and Sun pirates.
Don´t forget also the fact that the Germa66 and Sun pirates fight four hours, their power wasn´t fresh or at maximum, something as you said wouldn´t be able anymore...

7 Pirates fought Commodores and Captain level Marines while the 5 Vice Admirals for the Buster Call did NOTHING. Sanji then outsmarted the ENTIRE marine force there by closing the Gates of Justice. Franky then further outsmarted them by using Coup de Burst. All while Aokiji did NOTHING.
Sanji and co do that while don´t even face a vice admiral on their own or did they battle them off?
Aokiji was sectretly cheering up the Strawhats, of course he don´t do nothing, if he would want to do he would kill them easily off.

I'm just telling, be prepared for Oda's writing to explain how they escaped by outsmarting the BMP's. Its CLEAR she is pissed and is at Wano because they escaped. It is the nature of HOW they escaped that is the question.
She was pissed because of Luffy and Morgan, otherwise she travel back to whole cake island and didn´t care much about them in first place. Do you think a germa and fodder sun pirates can easily escape from a territory when they need 5 hours to go out of totland while Big mom is in back with massiv attacks and without beeing nerfed? They couldn´t even survive in the first escape plan without going down in few seconds/minutes, do you think they can escape while the route take 5 hours to go out of totland?



This panel would mean nothing anymore if everyone could just escape, but this would speak against the previous storywriting of Oda when he need a bomb and a nerf of Big mom to let the alliance escape from Whole cake island.
Also the another point is that Jinbe arrive in Wano after Big mom, even though he should be the first one as fishmen who arrive before Big mom. Why Jinbe need so long time, if we assume your theory he should escape with minor wounds and we speak about a dude who get a magma hole by a Admiral and from exhausted war, yet he was up in few days and could easily move. So the recover point wouldn´t make sense either which could help for the question "why it take a long time for Jinbe to arrive in Wano after Big mom?"...
 
#72
But that wasn´t really a escaping, the BM pirates know that Capone and the alliance was in trouble and couldn´t move anymore, they just need to stay and wait until they come out. Do you forget the second escape plan which totally fail and only get saved by the bomb?
Two whole different situations, why someone as Oven or Big mom would let in the first place let the alliance escape, she has a huge range attack arsenal. It doesn´t matter if fodders stand against her, she will hit many of them with one attack and then?

She was already using his ability death or life and not everyone was immun to that ability. And of course Jinbe don´t let his own crewmates get slaughter by Big mom. He would rather stand against her then just one of his crew member, don´t forget the point, stalling Big mom little more would mean> Strawhats can safety escape not only from her terittory but also in a huge distance.



The problem is, fodders don´t gonna stop Big mom to use her aoe attacks, she don´t get district her either when she could spamm such huge attacks:


Which something like this she could immediately sink a exhausted Germa66 and Sun pirates.
Don´t forget also the fact that the Germa66 and Sun pirates fight four hours, their power wasn´t fresh or at maximum, something as you said wouldn´t be able anymore...



Sanji and co do that while don´t even face a vice admiral on their own or did they battle them off?
Aokiji was sectretly cheering up the Strawhats, of course he don´t do nothing, if he would want to do he would kill them easily off.



She was pissed because of Luffy and Morgan, otherwise she travel back to whole cake island and didn´t care much about them in first place. Do you think a germa and fodder sun pirates can easily escape from a territory when they need 5 hours to go out of totland while Big mom is in back with massiv attacks and without beeing nerfed? They couldn´t even survive in the first escape plan without going down in few seconds/minutes, do you think they can escape while the route take 5 hours to go out of totland?



This panel would mean nothing anymore if everyone could just escape, but this would speak against the previous storywriting of Oda when he need a bomb and a nerf of Big mom to let the alliance escape from Whole cake island.
Also the another point is that Jinbe arrive in Wano after Big mom, even though he should be the first one as fishmen who arrive before Big mom. Why Jinbe need so long time, if we assume your theory he should escape with minor wounds and we speak about a dude who get a magma hole by a Admiral and from exhausted war, yet he was up in few days and could easily move. So the recover point wouldn´t make sense either which could help for the question "why it take a long time for Jinbe to arrive in Wano after Big mom?"...
I'm just going to blanket reply to this whole thing as: We'll see next chapter.


Big Mom cannot take Jinbe's soul. It was directly stated at WCI and established. And I'm assuming Jinbe was doing something else after escaping WCI, which is why he was late. Realize he's the only person as of last chapter. Wouldn't be surprised if we get some big double spread at the end of 977 that shows all the forces he brought, if any.

You can show me as many example's as you want of Big Mom delivering "Big" attacks, but that won't stop Oda from writing Germa or the Sun Pirates from escaping in a way that sounds logical otherwise.

Can't wait for next weeks spoiler thread where people, once again, call Oda a "hack writer" because it clashes with their imagination or ideals of how they think the situation is going to go down.

Edit: And @playa4321 thats 100% not an attack on you, its just what I'm forseeing as with every week. Oda writes the story based on how he wants it to progress. I totally understand the logic of Big Mom demolishing everyone, but Oda has written the Strawhats out of massively ridiculous situations many times before. All I'm saying.
 
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#73
I doubt that they would have been. Fishmen are not able of creating tsunamis, even the strongest Fishman karate or Fishman Jujutsu users like Jinbei and the Sun Pirates were able of damaging and slowing the BMP fleet down but not of destroying it even before BM came.
The best thing they could have done was of escaping.
Jimbei said it himself, when a fishman gets serious they can even change sea currents, i imagine a crew of very strong ones would be capable to manipulating it to such a degree that it creates a big ass wave. They could have just escaped sure, but what about Germa? The whole deal about SHs staying at the wedding was because Sanji wanted to rescue them, did Oda waste ~50 chapters just for them to be captured again? They did say 'mission complete, retreat' on the same page that BM appeared on, would they be able to successfully do it with BM on their tails however? Would they abandon their kingdom and fly away? Hopefully we find out next chapter
 
#74
That argument is way too good and you have nothing to counter it :kayneshrug:

Jinbe escaping BM without any notable injuries makes no sense. The question here is, why do people want BM to look like a joke? :seriously: Hasn't she suffered enough already?
Its not an argument because Oda will bend over backwards to save strawhats and allies, hes a shit writer. The straw hats and allies are invincible and defy the laws of causality. Nothing bad will ever happen to them. He will hit villains with the stupid bat everytime. How anyone is enjoying the fact that jinbe came there unscathed is beyond me.
 
#75
The problem here is that this makes BM look even worse. Yes, you could say that makes Aokiji or Garp look bad too, but no one is constantly being torn apart by Oda's writing than BM. How can a Yonko that just got back to full power, not Kill some fishmen? If that was Kaido, they'd be dead, already.
No they wouldnt, you dont understand. Put any top tier in stead of BM in WCI and the same shit would happen. They would get hit by the retard bat, and youlll have Oda doing whatever it takes so that the straw hats survive. Just understand this simple fact and move on tbh. Its not BMs fault at all, Oda had to make her an incompetent fool and retarded so that she doesnt murder everyone there.
The straw hats are invincible. There are 0 stakes in this manga and 0 Threats.
 
#76
Its not an argument because Oda will bend over backwards to save strawhats and allies, hes a shit writer. The straw hats and allies are invincible and defy the laws of causality. Nothing bad will ever happen to them. He will hit villains with the stupid bat everytime. How anyone is enjoying the fact that jinbe came there unscathed is beyond me.
And this is exactly what I'm talking about lol. This has always been One Piece, not sure why this is surprising to anyone. Luck (or Plot Armor, whatever you want to call it), has always been a feature of the story. Anyway, just wait until 977, we'll see if there was a consequence or not. As of right now, its almost pointless to argue.
 
#77
And this is exactly what I'm talking about lol. This has always been One Piece, not sure why this is surprising to anyone. Luck (or Plot Armor, whatever you want to call it), has always been a feature of the story. Anyway, just wait until 977, we'll see if there was a consequence or not. As of right now, its almost pointless to argue.
Yeah, if there isnt then oda is a hack writer through and through. Luck was always in the story but the amount of bullshit thats been happening in post skip is ridiculous to be honest. It removes any sense of threat or stakes.

Look at now, they are getting ready to invade onigashima and there is 0 sense of dread at all. Because the arc was a mess. Its villains werent built up at all, we've seen kaido 3 TIMES in his own arc. Felt like the straw hats were on vacation in wano. Kaido and co had 0 interractions with said alliance. Its too much man.
 
#78
Yeah, if there isnt then oda is a hack writer through and through. Luck was always in the story but the amount of bullshit thats been happening in post skip is ridiculous to be honest. It removes any sense of threat or stakes.

Look at now, they are getting ready to invade onigashima and there is 0 sense of dread at all. Because the arc was a mess. Its villains werent built up at all, we've seen kaido 3 TIMES in his own arc. Felt like the straw hats were on vacation in wano. Kaido and co had 0 interractions with said alliance. Its too much man.
I'd say just hold onto the hope that Oda will make Kaido and his army more threatening soon. Kabuki plays, usually in act 3, end with some form of tragedy. I don't think we've gotten to this point just yet. I personally agree with the sentiment that Kaido hasn't exactly felt "scary" or that the arc has felt "personal" yet for many people, including myself.

Apparently I'm one of the few people who enjoyed the back half of WCI because Pedro died and it at least made it feel a bit more personal than than usual (barring the arcs other problems).

Now for the Strawhats, its the problem with having 10 main characters who literally cannot die until the end unfortunately.
 
#79
You guys wanna find any excuse to negate the idea that Jinbe and Germa got out of there by themselves...

Let me just say this... If Jinbe was being captured... Big Mom wouldn't have come to Wano to search for Luffy...
She would have talked to Luffy on "Den Den Mushi" threatening him to kill Jinbe if he doesn't come and meet her... basically laying out the conditions in which she meets him however she wants...

She knows he will come the same way he came for Sanji

The fact that Big Mom came for Luffy in Wano... only means one thing... she HAS ZERO bargaining chip... NOTHING in her possession to pressure Luffy to agree to come see her...

Jinbe simply escaped... with many sun pirates and Germa as well... and if there was a sacrifice.. it MIGHT be few sun pirates, but not all...maybe Alaadin... that as far as things might have gone bad... nothing more than that...

Jinbe was not a prisoner.. and there was NOTHING in Big Mom possession to negotiate for with Luffy... It's why that humiliation made her set sail instead of staying in her place and FORCING Luffy to come with Jinbe card...
 
#80
You guys wanna find any excuse to negate the idea that Jinbe and Germa got out of there by themselves...

Let me just say this... If Jinbe was being captured... Big Mom wouldn't have come to Wano to search for Luffy...
She would have talked to Luffy on "Den Den Mushi" threatening him to kill Jinbe if he doesn't come and meet her... basically laying out the conditions in which she meets him however she wants...

She knows he will come the same way he came for Sanji

The fact that Big Mom came for Luffy in Wano... only means one thing... she HAS ZERO bargaining chip... NOTHING in her possession to pressure Luffy to agree to come see her...

Jinbe simply escaped... with many sun pirates and Germa as well... and if there was a sacrifice.. it MIGHT be few sun pirates, but not all...maybe Alaadin... that as far as things might have gone bad... nothing more than that...

Jinbe was not a prisoner.. and there was NOTHING in Big Mom possession to negotiate for with Luffy... It's why that humiliation made her set sail instead of staying in her place and FORCING Luffy to come with Jinbe card...
Look at how BM was acting in the Luffy bounty chapter. No hint of anger over Jinbe and Germa escaping
 
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