Forum Event Garp vs Kaido (Jew vs KKG) FINISHED

Who was the better debator?

  • Jew

    Votes: 8 72.7%
  • KKG

    Votes: 3 27.3%

  • Total voters
    11
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Jew D. Boy

I Can Go Lower
.
#2
Sorry we had to switch the order, @KINGKONGGUN15!! I know you’ll still be giving it your all when you’re ready, so I’ll do the same in turn :cheers:
I had to cut out some stuff that I plan on repurposing for my second post, but heads up - unlike some others have done, my defense consists solely of words and panels. Formatting isn’t my thing, but I hope y’all will give me a fair chance even if it’s not jazzed up and fancy :laughmoji:

When it comes to One Piece, there’s a single name that immediately comes to mind - Monkey D. Luffy, our vaunted protagonist and the man who will someday (soon?) be recognized throughout the OP world as the inimitable King of the Pirates. We’ve fallen in love with the rubber boy’s antics over the years, but perhaps more fascinating than his personality and his abilities, perhaps even more so than his various exploits, is his lineage.

Oda sent shockwaves through the fandom just after the Enies Lobby arc came to a close by revealing a stunning, previously unpredictable piece of information - Luffy’s father was none other than Monkey D. Dragon, only known by his given name at the time, a mysterious man who runs the Revolutionaries, a group dedicated to bringing down the oppressive, tyrannical World Government. The connection was obvious in hindsight; Dragon’s only appearance in the series to that point was when he blew into Loguetown just before Luffy entered the Grand Line and saved him from Smoker, who would become his son’s archenemy and eventual quasi-ally. Additionally, they both aim for the destruction of long-held institutions by yanking the corrupt WG and Celestial Dragons off their high horses and inspiring people all over the world to follow their own destinies. In message, if not mindset, they are practically identical.

But what about the man who’s directly responsible for either one being alive to topple the powers that be? What about the oldest known bearer of the Monkey D. family name? What about the symbol of Marine supremacy for decades, one of the most valuable members of the offensive faction belonging to the very same government against which Luffy and Dragon revolt?

What if I told you that Garp - the legend, the Hero of the Marines, a man so revered for his fighting prowess that of all the pugilistic warriors in the OP world (including his grandson), he alone is known as the Fist - was the most important member of his bloodline?


In the following posts, I will explain in detail each of these points - Garp’s presence is central to both the One Piece world and One Piece existing in ours; several major characters would either not be where they are or would not exist with him; even in the confines of the naval system, he represents a greater sense of freedom than many pirates, including the one being compared to him in this match; even now, his strength can be reasonably placed within the highest tier.

First, the simplest reason why Garp reigns supreme - without him, there is no One Piece. I don’t just mean that in a biological sense; Oda planned for Luffy’s grandfather to be a vital character in his story no matter what. We’re all familiar with the fact that chapter 1 of this series is really the third version of OP’s opening salvo, and while it bears a large resemblance to the first version, what’s really interesting is how they’re different from the second. In Romance Dawn version 2, our hero doesn’t receive his iconic straw hat and Gomu Gomu no Mi from his idol Shanks, the man we know today as one of the Yonko and someone who figures to be a major presence in the series endgame, but from Garp. Did Oda entrust any other character with this kind of importance from the early goings? Did anybody else have their identity concealed when we first met them because of their true role in the series, instead of simple dramatic effect like CP9 or Duval?


This early proto-Garp bore only a few similarities to the vice admiral we know and love: the signature look and laugh, a deep love for his family that often manifested in physical attacks, an unerring sense of boastful confidence. However, these characteristics were ably adopted to the finished product in ways beyond imagination when Oda first drew these panels. Even though his role changed dramatically between RDv2 and the sprawling saga that came out of its successor, it’s clear that Garp was as important for Oda to flesh out as Luffy himself.



Moreover, Garp is a main character not only in his grandson’s life, but the man poised to play the same role for Luffy that Garp did for Roger. In just the second cover story in One Piece history, we get to see Koby under the tutelage of perhaps the Marines’ most famous vice admiral. For the little we’ve really seen of him, Koby is a very important figure in the series - the first person Luffy meets on his journey, the first person he considers a friend, and the first person he inspired to follow their dreams, even though said dreams indirectly involves putting them at odds. Therefore, it’s no coincidence that the author decided he should study the way of the Navy with Garp as his teacher...Koby will likely surpass his mentor in rank one day, but there is no one else in the organization quite as suitable to guide him there. Hell, in the few months between that fated meeting and when Garp is revealed to the audience, Koby has become a completely different (and visibly more powerful/mature) person.


So, not only is Garp responsible for the life of our protagonist, he’s also directly in charge of the guy who will likely stand as his most formidable nemesis by the conclusion of the series. From beginning to end, there simply is no way the story of One Piece can be told without this man’s comprehensive inclusion, or at least respecting his presence as a driving force for many important people therein.

Second, the love he has for his family is both a great strength and perhaps one of his very few weaknesses. It’s an accepted shonen trope for the main character(s) to go through some sort of hellish training as part of their development; Garp provided this in spades with Luffy, Ace, Sabo, Koby, Helmeppo, and scores of Marine recruits we’ve never even met. However, unlike some franchises, Garp’s involvement in the lives of those he claims as his own doesn’t end there. Even after he punches Luffy upon their reunion in Water 7, it’s evident they share a comical (if necessarily strained) relationship built on love and understanding. Garp clearly cares for his grandson, openly stating his regret that Luffy did not follow what the elder Monkey thought was the right path.


Moreover, he holds the same wishes for Ace, who isn’t even his biological descendant. A lot is made in this series of the fact that blood doesn’t make you family; rather, a shared sense of morality, or at the very least what’s “right” under an oppressive autocracy, runs deeper than any genetic connections. Garp did his best to provide Roger’s son with guidance, a sense of purpose, and the confidence to decide whether or not he deserved to live.


I can’t think of any other rivalry, fictional or otherwise, where one member agreed to hide the other’s unborn child so they wouldn’t have a difficult life, but Garp felt a strong enough connection to Roger that the latter knew he’d do as the Pirate King asked. Even to the most notorious criminal in the world, Garp was more of a wholly reliable friend than his parallel on the side of justice. By the same token, Garp speaks of Roger as if he knows/understands the man quite well...because arguably, he does more than anyone outside of Rayleigh and Whitebeard. Their bond seems to go much deeper than your typical “most powerful pirate in the world and the monster Marine tasked with hunting him down” dynamic.



He casually reveals Dragon’s identity as well as the fact that he keeps some form of correspondence with/is aware of the activities of his son, indicating that his own flesh and blood being the most wanted man in the world is more of a pure and basic fact than a source of shame. While the nature of their relationship is still largely unknown, the fact that Garp trusts Dragon enough not to chase him down tells us a lot about how the less-than-doting father perceives personal freedom.

He could have easily (and likely with little physical effort) compelled a young Dragon into naval service, or at least made it his duty to chase after his progeny after the Revolutionaries became known; as far as we can tell, he saw that his son held his own strong set of beliefs, and he felt it would be in poor taste to fight his child over his dream, even if Garp didn’t agree with the path he chose. There are some bad dads in (or contextually absent from) One Piece, and an argument can be made for Garp without much trouble, but to do so would ignore the visible, palpable love he truly feels for anyone he views as part of his family, and moreover, the trust he has tacitly placed in them to handle their chosen undertakings.

It’s this same attribute that informs his behavior at Marineford - he feels conflicted about siding with the Marines and against Ace to the degree that he will show up as is required by his superiors, but he will not watch idly as the blade falls. When Luffy comes to rescue his brother, Garp decides at the last moment not to try stopping him. He tells Sengoku that if he is not restrained after Ace is murdered, he’s liable to visit the same fate upon Akainu. It’s a testament to Garp’s devotion that the former fleet admiral knew to take this threat seriously.



Third, and perhaps least salient to a discussion about his overall character, Garp was and is one of the strongest characters in One Piece. I can already hear the powerscalers gnashing their teeth, so I’ll get right to the heart of this particular matter.

When we first meet Garp, he tanks a slash to the chest from Morgan’s giant axe hand and literally laughs it off. He claims his narcolepsy kicked in, and apparently, his routine upon waking up includes smashing a cannon with his bare hands. You know, like we all do after returning to consciousness after a peaceful rest.



When we first learn his true identity, he bursts into a house and punches Luffy with “love” (spelled C-O-A, providing us with a then-unrecognized first glimpse at that particular type of Haki), something that shocks everyone who knows about his bouncy body. A few chapters later, we see him throw - yes, THROW - cannonballs with the same exertion one of us may throw a wiffleball, and they EXPLODE ON CONTACT like they had been propelled in the intended fashion. This insane display is so rote for Garp, his subordinates know the name of what’s coming before it actually happens. As if that wasn’t stressful enough for the weakened Straw Hats who were simply trying to depart from Water 7, he then busts out a gigantic mace that literally outmatches their brand new ship by several degrees of magnitude. If not for the craftsmanship of a certain cyborg carpenter, Garp would have ended their journey there (and likely concussed multiple Sea Kings in the process).



Moreover, of all the 70+ year old men who came to Marineford, he arguably took the least amount of damage; no more than a scratch (read: his grandson’s most powerful punch at the time). When Marco, the World’s Strongest Man’s first mate and the user of the Tori Tori no Mi, Model: Phoenix, a Mythical Zoan Devil Fruit specifically stated to be in its own class of power, flew in to save Ace, Garp (acting more out of duty than a genuine desire to thwart Ace’s would-be savior) knocked him back with a single blow. Additionally, after Blackbeard swooped in and stole his former captain’s Gura Gura no Mi before challenging the Marines to face him, Sengoku activates his own Mythical Zoan powers while Garp, visibly unshaken, stands his ground. All of this would be enough to solidify him as a top tier, to borrow a parlance of the time and place.


More impressive than his current strength is how terrifyingly powerful he was in his younger days. We know how Roger and Whitebeard, by consensus two of the strongest (if not THE strongest) motherfuckers in the world, consider him one of only two people on the other side of the moral divide worthy of facing them:

As well the fact that Shakky was considered notorious enough for someone of Garp’s repute to chase her down:

And best of all, we learned in Dressrosa that Garp was so strong, he was able to fully alter Don Chinjao’s cranial structure with a single blow (honed, as he said, by reducing *eight* God damn mountains to rubble). Keep in mind that Chinjao himself split a continent of ice with his head, and his drill top was fully coated in CoA when he went up against Garp...and yet, it didn’t matter one bit in the face of the vice admiral’s sheer might:



As I said above, even if this were all we knew about his triumphs in the past, it still outstrips the stated accomplishments of nearly every other fighter in the series. Then, less than a year ago, we finally learned about Rocks. Sure, Garp had mentioned it as Wano began - was it a crew? A person? - but in a single inter-missionary chapter, the truth was revealed.

Rocks was composed of younger but still incredibly mighty versions of the Yonko, by and large the strongest individual group in the series for many years, and led by a man with the same name whose tenacity and vigor rivaled those of Roger himself. Although we were only given the politically washed version of the story by Sengoku, it’s safe to say that Xebec represented a truly existential threat to the World Government in terms of power and knowledge. Nobody here thinks that Garp and Roger took the Rocks Pirates down all alone, but it’s significant that Garp is the only notable Marine involved in their defeat. Again, we hear this story from Sengoku; it’s possible he and Tsuru, the other two of the great Marine triumvirate of their time, were there, and he purposefully didn’t mention the part he played for unknown reasons. Even so, the fact that Garp earned the singular epithet “Hero of the Marines” as a result of the battle places him in truly rarefied air; none of the currently known admirals or fleet admirals (past or present) have been lauded in this way, and certainly nobody with the same rank as him could hold a candle to his reputation. Garp earned that title 40 years ago and it remains his alone even after the timeskip.

What makes Garp truly special, at least to me, is the attitude he maintains as a stubborn criticizer of his employer, a verbally conscientious objector who tells the king of his own country to shut up without fear of reprisal, a man who values personal integrity as highly as honor and duty. It’s clear on several occasions that Garp will set aside his feelings so as to uphold the Marines, but this is not a steadfast rule. Foremost, we see him routinely showing great joy in hearing of Luffy’s misadventures:

Additionally, organizations like the World Government and the Marines, and people with power like the Gorosei and all the other Celestial Dragons, have public policies of dealing with dissenters in a swift, cruel manner. You don’t get to be a part of the club and still mock it...that is, unless your abilities are so far ahead of anyone else that you remain valuable in spite of your petulance.

Here’s what we knew about Garp’s naval service prior to the timeskip:

  • Mouthed off to several people who outrank him and generally caused a ton of trouble for his fellow recruits
  • Consistently turned down a promotion to the position of admiral because he explicitly didn’t want the people in charge of the WG to hold any more sway over him than they already did
  • Allowed both his son AND his grandson to become world famous criminals without ever seriously taking responsibility for their actions
  • Honored the last wishes of his longtime adversary by concealing the guy’s son from his own commanding officers
  • Refused to fully participate in the son’s eventual execution
  • Made no effort to stop his grandson from reaching the damned, in a clear and willful display of dereliction of duty
  • Retired of his own volition after becoming totally disillusioned with the organization to which he’d given most of his life

After all this, we learn that Garp STILL retains his rank, the title of instructor, and the worldwide recognition as the greatest weapon in the Marine arsenal which he earned over those preceding decades. Christ, he even got to attend the most recent Reverie as an inactive soldier! Who leaves a job they hate and then gets an invitation to the shareholders meeting two years later?

I believe all of the above demonstrates the merits of Monkey D. Garp on his own; now, onto how he compares to Kaido. Before I dive in, I should note I’ll only be comparing them as characters, not determining who would win if they fought. Outside of physical strength, their opposite personalities is the biggest difference between the two; even as a Marine, Garp is theoretically less restrictive on the freedom of pirates than the other guy.

Kaido has long been a person of interest in this fandom, and that only increases the more we see of him. However, his portrayal cannot rightfully be compared to Garp’s because Kaido is meant to represent an even greater evil from Luffy’s point of view. Our protagonist’s main goal isn’t to upend the Marines and World Government; if anything, they are simply a nuisance more than an obstacle. Luffy doesn’t want to change the world, he simply wants to be the freest man in it. To that end, the government isn’t oppressing him as directly as other pirates vying for the crown - he doesn’t think of people like Koby and Smoker as the bad guys, but he has stated multiple times that Blackbeard, Big Mom, and the World’s Strongest Creature himself are his true enemies. In Luffy’s eyes, his grandfather has given him a wider berth in terms of doing what he wants than someone like Kaido has.

Kaido is reckless, torturous, and manic; his alcoholism has been presented every time we’ve seen him, he treats subordinates and slaves alike with extremely violent impunity, and he kept his own daughter trapped on Onigashima for 20 years, presumably out of fear or paranoia that she would rebel. He neither realizes that he creates his own worst enemies, nor thinks twice about crushing them when they defy him. Even as a Marine with a virtual license to kill, Garp clearly has reservations when it comes to family or those he doesn’t perceive as deserving of Absolute Justice; if anything, Kaido’s outlook aligns much more closely with that ideology held by the Marines than Garp’s does.

Yes, Kaido is known as the WSC, and for a lot of people around here, that automatically places him above everyone else, including Garp. If this competition were solely about who would come out victorious in a fight, even I won’t pretend that my guy could win handily (or at all). I know he’d push Kaido pretty damn far and make the Yonko work for it, but that likely wouldn’t be enough at his current age. Still, this is only one small part of what makes a fictional character interesting - we want them to have strength beyond our wildest dreams, but we want them to reflect ourselves back at us in an emotional sense. Representation in works of art is crucial to connecting with the parts of our psyche that we hold most dear, and in that way, Garp’s gregarious personality is a better model than Kaido’s cruelty, his displeasure with an employer whose beliefs clash with his own more resonant than Kaido’s penchant for both the death of his enemies and his own.

Perhaps the greatest difference between these two is how they handle disrespect from their children. Garp is 0-4 when it comes to his son/biological and adopted grandchildren joining the Marines (two pirates, two Revolutionaries), and yet, any efforts he’s made in the series to rein in their baser instincts have either been half assed or nonexistent. He has no desire to fully control the destiny of his offspring even as they spit in the face of his otherwise impeccable legacy. However, Kaido’s only child that we know of has been a captive for most of her life simply because he didn’t approve of her choice to live in a different manner than he set out for her. Yamato draws inspiration from Oden because he is so unlike her father (and in this way, much more similar to Garp and Luffy); in response, he keeps her stashed away from the world she’s so desperate to see. This kind of overbearing micromanagement of someone’s life is completely antithetical to the message of One Piece, and in direct contrast to Garp’s own methods of allowing family to do what they wish.


In conclusion, there is simply no way to look at Garp’s body of work, both in the context of his professional duties and the abilities of those he raised/trained, and not recognize him as an absolutely paramount figure in One Piece. As you can see, he plays a far more important role than his relatively limited panel time would leave a casual observer to believe. I look forward to hearing KKG15’s response to what I’ve presented, and I thank you all for taking as much time to read this as I spent writing it! :kata:
 

KINGKONGGUN15

The Soul King
.
#3
Alright, Since Kaido isnt a character that Oda has gone into depth with. I'll have to make some assumptions on his character, and I'll have to mix that in with the things we do know about him. So I hope you enjoy it and be gentle this is the firs time ive done something like this



To start, what does Kaido mean to the story as a whole. When Kaido was first introduced he was seen as the most indomitable force the entire One Piece world has ever seen. In the first moments we saw him, he gave off a tremendous force. We saw that he was suicidal, but we didn't know why. and why couldn't he die. Is he immortal? Or is it something else? All these questions kept on piling up with no answer and we probably wouldn't get an answer until Wano. So, we waited. and as of writing this..... we havent really learned much if I'm being honest, but we have learned a bit on Kaido's personality and ambitions in life. Some things that caused me to like him more and more as a character.

HONOR AND RESPECT

lets start with what we are most likely right on with Kaido. Honor and respect. ever since we since we have been introduced to Kaido and heard his speech about destroying the world with the greatest war, we thought of him as a big meathead brute whose only goal is to destroy and conquer. but, since then we have seen that Kaido is more level headed than we originally expected. We rarely see him with anger on his face, or the fact that he is shouting nonsense. instead, Kaido seems to be smarter and cooler than we had thought of him.

Kaido (as far as we know) started on the Rocks crew and was a rookie on that ship. After being defeated by the combined forces of the marines and Gol D. Roger, he departed and made his own crew. He was doing fine until he came to Wano. here he met Oden. who in chapter 970 gave him his life-lasting scar, but he still won. And ever since that chapter we have seen that Kaido feels about Oden and about his near defeat. but, as far as we know Kaido was already defeated by the marines and Roger. So why does this affect him so much?


Well, it wasn't due to the initial scar that he gained this affection towards oden. was during the legendary 1-hour execution. Here, we saw Kaido going from arrogant and spiteful, to silent and serious. after oden lasted in oil pot for one hour, something changed inside of Kaido. He didn't kill of oden at the end of the execution because he was afraid of him standing back up, he was doing it out of respect for oden, to give him an honor full death. he gained so much respect even that he killed the old hag that caused him to win in the first place. this shows me that Kaido is a man that doesn't like to fight when red herrings or distractions are involved. He wants to Honor fully and if he dies, he dies. This alone makes Kaido one of the most respectable characters in One piece.


but the respect doesn't end there. after these events, he went to the burning castle and found Momo. he was disappointed that the crying boy was the son of the man who almost defeated him. Kaido could have killed Momo right there and the events in the future would have played out much different into his favor, but instead he didn't. Kaido hoped that Momo would be the man that could one day bring him to the point of defeat like how Oden did, he risked an entire empire over one man. That shows how much respect is important to Kaido.

Then, the the disappointment came when he saw that Momo hadn't changed a bit and was instead the same scrawny boy from 20 years ago. you can see the sheer disappointment on Kaido's face. but, despite that he remained honorable and respectful and even offered Momo to go free, if he said he wasn't a kozuki. I'm going full prediction mode now since we don't know what this signifies for Kaido, but I hope that Kaido sees a grain of Oden inside of momo and shows him the same respect as he did for Oden.


Kaido's role as a captain

since I have already gone in-depth how Kaido values respect. lets see how we see it in his crew. Kaido's crew is composed of former power crews he acquired after defeating said pirate crews. But, interestingly enough none of the crews he has conquered has any kind of remorse or hate against him. In fact, they seem to adore and respect him. You can see this especially with the flying six, where they have no respect for the calamities, but they adore Kaido and want to be as close to him as possible.


Kaido and the rest of his crew seem to be a lot more closer to each other than other crews in the past. Kaido lets his Commanders sit next to him and drink, and he invites his crew to party and have a fun night. the relationship with his crew really reminds me of white beard in that sense. In a similar way, WB also defeated Ace's crew and took him as a crewmate. the people in Kaido's crew see him more than just a boss, they see him as a father figure that will lead them to victory. this just adds to his character and how he values respect and comradery inside of his own crew.

compare this to big mom. she uses her children as toys and even says to her strongest child that he is just a mere child to her and shouldn't get in her way.

Some Closure and Predictions for the Future

Like I said at the beginning of this post, we don't know much about Kaido's backstory. There is probably a lot more depth to his character, but as of now this is what we know.

Lastly, id like to make some predictions for the future. in the last chapter Kaido talked about Betrayal between pirates. he mentioned how pirates will betray you at some point and how you can never fully trust them. this leads me to believe that Kaido has had to deal with betrayal in the past. I think this happened while he was at the rocks. Where Xebec maybe betrayed the entire crew in his favor, but that is just me speculating.


there are still many questions unanswered with this man. where was he born? what is his age? how did he become the strongest? what is his debt with big mom?

I hope I was able to show you why I like Kaido so much, for me he is the epitome of respect and there is so much depth to his charachter that people dont give him credit for. I await your response Jew

PS

Kaido is pro-trans and is supportive father, while Garp beats his own kids. just saying :kayneshrug::myman:





''In a 1 on 1 battle between debaters, always bet on KingKongGun15''
- Narrator

 

Jew D. Boy

I Can Go Lower
.
#4
Welcome back for another, less punishingly lengthy installment in the limited series “Garp Is The Best, And You All Agree With Me”!! For this post, I want to focus on two specific things before answering some of the points made by my friend @KINGKONGGUN15

In the course of writing my first post, I had to take out a few lines because a) I reached the image limit for the panels they were referencing, and b) after removing them, I realized they could be expanded upon to further exemplify why Garp deserves more respect than he is given. I ask y’all to bear with me as some of this is speculative, but what is a discussion about why your favorite character is the best without a heavy dose of headcanon?

Garp is from somewhere in the Goa Kingdom, likely Windmill Village as this is where we meet Luffy in chapter 1...it seems that the entire Monkey family has been based for a significant amount of time in this part of East Blue seeing as mayor Woop Slap (dark horse candidate for Best Name in One Piece) mentions “all three generations” of said clan. Considering that Dragon’s true identity was a secret to virtually everyone in the world except Garp and a few others - Luffy was nonplussed to learn his father was the most wanted criminal in the world - it seems safe to say that Slappy is only privy to this knowledge because, as he appears to be a similar age, he has known Garp and descendants for quite some time.

The familiarity with what goes on in this particular kingdom leads me to believe that Garp and Dadan share a closer connection than we’ve been told thus far. Garp has been a Marine for 50 something years, meaning for half a century, it’s been his responsibility to corral nefarious pirates on the sea; Dadan, however, seems to exclusively be a mountain bandit. When we first meet her, Garp mentions overlooking her crimes to allow her to remain free...which is odd, since what official powers would he have to take her in? He’s certainly nigh unbeatable on land, but his jurisdiction is the sea. Something tells me Dadan doesn’t take this into account when the Fist is threatening to take her in or knock her out.

So, is it just fear that keeps Dadan under Garp’s thumb? After the tragedy at Marineford when he returns to Windmill Village, she has no reservations with immediately assaulting him for not saving Ace. Whether she put aside her trepidation because it was supplanted by anger or she was always prepared to engage Garp physically if it came to blows, she races out of Makino’s bar and wastes absolutely no time in going berserk on him. He’s bloodied but uninjured, and he makes absolutely no defensive moves to counter her offensive slaughter, even telling his men not to intervene. Dadan’s willingness to take her sorrow out on the Hero of the Marines after what’s technically a win for them shows that she at least feels comfortable expressing her true feelings in front of Garp. These are not the typical actions of a bandit when facing off against a government enforcer, but more like an old friend taking out their frustrations with another.


All of this demonstrates that Garp and Dadan respect each other beyond their professional differences, and we haven’t even gotten to her raising his grandchildren. Dadan isn’t some sort of upstanding citizen; she’s a bandit, a malcontent. Other than the chance of reprisal, there’s really nothing that prevents her and her followers from abandoning Luffy and Ace by relocating elsewhere. She knows for a fact that at least the former has tremendous survival skills...thanks to Garp’s purposeful neglect and training via one-sided beatings, Luffy can handle himself in rough terrains with little stated trouble, another testament to his grandfather’s tactics.


If the fear of doing time for her crimes was palpable enough, Dadan could have easily committed another one, this time specifically against Garp, and escaped without him knowing. So if it’s not the intimidation, why does she do his bidding? The simple answer is that she feels the same way about him as she does the children he leaves in her care - Garp and company may be tremendous nuisances who cause her a great deal of stress and strife, but she truly loves each of them, and they feel the same about her in turn. She’s not a violent offender with zero redeeming qualities, or a troublemaker in Windmill Village; even old Woopie and Makino know her and treat her like anyone else. Knowing this, while Garp holds the specter of retribution over her head, it’s reasonable to say he never had any intention of bringing her to the WG as she never had any designs on rejecting his wishes. Once again, we see a Marine of stature make an exception for someone who isn’t rotten to the core but has done some things the hypocritical leader have deemed immoral...Garp’s sense of justice is perhaps the most lenient among his coworkers, and he’s the most respected one as a result. These things are not unconnected.

Now, as a high ranking Marine, Garp has an obligation to show the requisite amount of respect not only to the Celestial Dragons - something we’ve established he hates doing to the point that it affects his standing in the organization - but he is also bound by duty to be deferential to the king of his home country. Unfortunately, after some subterfuge that may or may not have involved some serious regicide, the current ruler as of this most recent Reverie is none other than Stelly, a miserable imp of a Noble who sleazed his way to the throne.
Sabo’s family adopts Stelly under shady circumstances, and it’s through a similar operational model that he swindles and poisons his way to the highest position of political power in the Goa Kingdom. Regardless of how he got there, Garp is expected to show him deference both as a Marine and a native citizen of the same land over which Stelly rules. His position demands that he escort Stelly through the holy land of Mariejois, protect him from any threats, and do whatever is in his bidding.

Instead, Garp does this almost instantly upon meeting his presumptive liege:

Of course, the cowardly Stelly only reacts to this with exaggerated shock, unable to accept that a man of Garp’s stature has no respect for a man of his own unearned reputation. Still, he has a mission when it comes to Garp - use his connections to finally achieve his selfish goal of becoming a Celestial Dragon. Outside of Mjosgard, every CD we’ve met is a cruel, lazy, arrogant, worthless waste of oxygen; based on his conniving behavior and his utter disregard for anything that doesn’t directly benefit him, Stelly’s already got the right attitude. He just needs a good word from Garp, a man the CDs don’t care for but see as a necessary evil for their own protection, to talk him up and get him in good with that crowd. It’s a tense relationship, to be sure, but the best chance Stelly has - a legend vouching for the king of his homeland could travel a long way towards his goal, the thinking goes.

Here’s Garp’s response to his ruler’s request:

The greatest hero the Marines have ever seen, a man uniquely positioned to defend the Celestial Dragons against mighty threats, calls them scumbags, out loud, *while he is in their homeland* for a meeting of all the royalty in the world. I mean, the balls on Stelly for his behavior, but the fuckin’ BALLS on Garp...who totally gets away with his insolence as always! Stelly is so amazed that Garp could even dare to say those things to or about ANYONE, let alone nearly everyone with the political sway to have him assassinated, that he can’t even muster the courage to report the eldest Monkey to his superiors. We have people in this series who’ve eaten Devil Fruits that make their bodies invulnerable to all types of damage, but nobody is made of Teflon like this fuckin’ guy.

Once again, we see the man commit what in the OP world amounts to an objectionable offense tantamount to treason, and he just skates by once again on his mammoth reputation. There is not a single other character in this series who could consistently and openly insult the ruling class without suffering any consequences. Wherever Garp goes, we see him do nothing but whatever the hell he wants, and everyone loves/admires the shit out of him for it. The Marines, both those who outrank him and follow his orders; pirates from fodder all the way up to Roger and the Yonko; people from his hometown who he keeps safe, as well as those who are forced to raise the children he brings them; his son and grandson, who continuously muddy their family name...by words, action, or implication, each one of them sees Garp as an unassailable force of nature. The fandom should recognize him as such in turn.

lets start with what we are most likely right on with Kaido. Honor and respect. ever since we since we have been introduced to Kaido and heard his speech about destroying the world with the greatest war, we thought of him as a big meathead brute whose only goal is to destroy and conquer. but, since then we have seen that Kaido is more level headed than we originally expected. We rarely see him with anger on his face, or the fact that he is shouting nonsense. instead, Kaido seems to be smarter and cooler than we had thought of him.
We rarely see him angry? I think we rarely see him happy...he’s always grimacing or frowning as hard as any other mean mugging character in this series, and that’s not even taking his actual behavior into consideration. Just in this arc, we’ve seen him shoot Oden in the head after making him boil for an hour, behead Orochi after a 20 year partnership, set Yamato’s bracelets to explode if he ever left, and kicked the shit out of several Supernovae. Yep, sounds like a gregarious, respectable guy to me...

Well, it wasn't due to the initial scar that he gained this affection towards oden. was during the legendary 1-hour execution. Here, we saw Kaido going from arrogant and spiteful, to silent and serious. after oden lasted in oil pot for one hour, something changed inside of Kaido. He didn't kill of oden at the end of the execution because he was afraid of him standing back up, he was doing it out of respect for oden, to give him an honor full death. he gained so much respect even that he killed the old hag that caused him to win in the first place. this shows me that Kaido is a man that doesn't like to fight when red herrings or distractions are involved. He wants to Honor fully and if he dies, he dies. This alone makes Kaido one of the most respectable characters in One piece.
Those are some impressive mental gymnastics...Kaido is a good guy because he shot someone he grew to respect in the fucking head after torturing them for an hour? Garp shows respect by allowing his grandson, a rascal of a world-famous criminal, to punch him in the face and rescue a man they both love and care for; imagine if Garp beheaded Ace himself out of “honor,” the same thing that SHOULD have compelled him to not even take guardianship of Roger’s kid in the first place.

As far as your corresponding point about Momo...he was set to crucify an eight year old literally two chapters ago because, what, he respected the kid’s daddy so much? The same father he murdered in front of the child? He wants to fully wipe out the Kozuki bloodline because he admires them too much for them to exist? Kaido’s a parent himself, and yet, nothing has stopped him from singlehandedly destroying the most noteworthy family in Wano over the course of multiple decades. Again, for frame of reference:

Garp and Roger - mutual respect, neither left the other with any lasting injuries, viewed each other as equals, the one who died left his child in the other’s care and that second one raised him like one of his own
Kaido and Oden - natural enemies, the former ruined the latter’s homeland and sided with his nemesis, tortured the man he supposedly “respects,” KILLED HIM IN COLD BLOOD, then chased his son for 20 years before trying to murder him as well

You tell me which duo seems to have a relationship built on honor and understanding...

Kaido and the rest of his crew seem to be a lot more closer to each other than other crews in the past. Kaido lets his Commanders sit next to him and drink, and he invites his crew to party and have a fun night. the relationship with his crew really reminds me of white beard in that sense. In a similar way, WB also defeated Ace's crew and took him as a crewmate. the people in Kaido's crew see him more than just a boss, they see him as a father figure that will lead them to victory. this just adds to his character and how he values respect and comradery inside of his own crew.



Kaido is pro-trans and is supportive father, while Garp beats his own kids. just saying :kayneshrug::myman:
Another way of looking at it - Kaido abused his trans son for 20 years and threatened to kill him if he ever left, whereas Garp raised several formidable criminals and shows them nothing but support and compassion throughout the series despite the fact that their respective jobs put them in direct conflict:luuh:
 
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