Versus Battle Hakuki vs Gakuki

[God Buggy]

So, as @Sanji D Goat wanted, here we are.

Hakuki

The leader of the famous Qin 6, a man who simply terrorized China. Renpa considered him the hardest of the Qin 6 to deal with, in real life he was undefeated. Like I also said in the Hakuki vs Ouki thread, @Fleet Admiral Lee Hung has a nice thread on the man where he pretty much goes through what we know of his abilities, as of now. He was a truly terrifying individual.

Gakuki

He was called the "Military god". He saved the state of Yan which was nearly wiped out by a superstate and turned the tide completely, pushing the Qi forces all the way back. He then led the first coalition army against Qi, destroying most of it.

Both get 150k soldiers, equalized forces. Share your thoughts.

@Fleet Admiral Lee Hung @Owl Ki @Blackbeard
@Jailer @TheKnightOfTheSea @Topi Jerami @Shanks @RayanOO @MarineHQ62 @Seth
@Da evil Who @Arara etc.

 

[Seth]

So, as @Sanji D Goat wanted, here we are.

Hakuki

The leader of the famous Qin 6, a man who simply terrorized China. Renpa considered him the hardest of the Qin 6 to deal with, in real life he was undefeated. Like I also said in the Hakuki vs Ouki thread, @Fleet Admiral Lee Hung has a nice thread on the man where he pretty much goes through what we know of his abilities, as of now. He was a truly terrifying individual.

Gakuki

He was called the "Military god". He saved the state of Yan which was nearly wiped out by a superstate and turned the tide completely, pushing the Qi forces all the way back. He then led the first coalition army against Qi, destroying most of it.

Both get 150k soldiers, equalized forces. Share your thoughts.

@Fleet Admiral Lee Hung @Owl Ki @Blackbeard
@Jailer @TheKnightOfTheSea @Topi Jerami @Shanks @RayanOO @MarineHQ62 @Seth
@Da evil Who @Arara etc.

I put my money on Hakuki. Even martial might based Generals thought of him as the biggest obstacle which should tell you much. Only concern for that would be the Generals serving under Hakuki but I think he is pulling a W without too much trouble.

Kingdom tells you time and time again. Okay martial might cool and that but the strategy is what wins. Martial might can only push you as far as raising the morale of ur fighters thru killing enemy.

The best strategist beats the best Martial artist in a battle of equal numbers.

 

[Jailer]

Would be a close one, but with equalized forces I have to give the win to Hakuki in the end.

I know people say stats don't mean much but Hara clearly values Gakuki, he remains as the general with the highest overall stats and SS expetience as a general, not even Hakuki has an SS experience.

But in regards to stat Hara values also Hakuki in that regard at 99 intelligence.

Let's say out of 10 times Hakuki wins 5 times.

 

[God Buggy]

Would be a close one, but with equalized forces I have to give the win to Hakuki in the end.

I know people say stats don't mean much but Hara clearly values Gakuki, he remains as the general with the highest overall stats and SS expetience as a general, not even Hakuki has an SS experience.

But in regards to stat Hara values also Hakuki in that regard at 99 intelligence.

Let's say out of 10 times Hakuki wins 5 times.

I don't factor in those stats in confrontations, matches etc. but I have always been at least a bit curious of this SS on Gakuki.

 

[Blackbeard]

So, as @Sanji D Goat wanted, here we are.

Hakuki

The leader of the famous Qin 6, a man who simply terrorized China. Renpa considered him the hardest of the Qin 6 to deal with, in real life he was undefeated. Like I also said in the Hakuki vs Ouki thread, @Fleet Admiral Lee Hung has a nice thread on the man where he pretty much goes through what we know of his abilities, as of now. He was a truly terrifying individual.

Gakuki

He was called the "Military god". He saved the state of Yan which was nearly wiped out by a superstate and turned the tide completely, pushing the Qi forces all the way back. He then led the first coalition army against Qi, destroying most of it.

Both get 150k soldiers, equalized forces. Share your thoughts.

@Fleet Admiral Lee Hung @Owl Ki @Blackbeard
@Jailer @TheKnightOfTheSea @Topi Jerami @Shanks @RayanOO @MarineHQ62 @Seth
@Da evil Who @Arara etc.

Whomever assigned these guidebook numbers for Hakuki was high on something so i would exempt stats and focus on story portrayal in which i still can't decide between the two, each one of them is a military deity in his own right with a good case can be made for the two being the undisputed top two generals known so far.

But i still to this day think Gakuki had it more difficult, if we look at their states and the resources both sides has, Yan is absolutely no match for Qin during King Shou's time with the 6GG system intact, yet it's said Gakuki single-handedly kept the balance of power across China alone. His subordinate also had the potential to become one of the Three Great Heavens, cornering and almost killing Riboku himself with a reproduced version of Gakuki's warfare.

 

[God Buggy]

Whomever assigned these guidebook numbers for Hakuki was high on something so i would exempt stats and focus on story portrayal in which i still can't decide between the two, each one of them is a military deity in his own right with a good case can be made for the two being the undisputed top two generals known so far.

But i still to this day think Gakuki had it more difficult, if we look at their states and the resources both sides has, Yan is absolutely no match for Qin during King Shou's time with the 6GG system intact, yet it's said Gakuki single-handedly kept the balance of power across China alone. His subordinate also had the potential to become one of the Three Great Heavens, cornering and almost killing Riboku himself with a reproduced version of Gakuki's warfare.

It's hard, we are looking at two absolute monsters. What is your top 5 all time generals?

P.S. My Gakuki vs Riboku thread still lies there, almost completely ignored for some reason

 

[Jailer]

Whomever assigned these guidebook numbers for Hakuki was high on something so i would exempt stats and focus on story portrayal in which i still can't decide between the two, each one of them is a military deity in his own right with a good case can be made for the two being the undisputed top two generals known so far.

But i still to this day think Gakuki had it more difficult, if we look at their states and the resources both sides has, Yan is absolutely no match for Qin during King Shou's time with the 6GG system intact, yet it's said Gakuki single-handedly kept the balance of power across China alone. His subordinate also had the potential to become one of the Three Great Heavens, cornering and almost killing Riboku himself with a reproduced version of Gakuki's warfare.

Honestly I might be even willing to change to Gakuki winning 6 out of 10 times in this battle, here it's a fair fight with equalized forces and resources.

 

[God Buggy]

Would be a close one, but with equalized forces I have to give the win to Hakuki in the end.

Let's say out of 10 times Hakuki wins 5 times

Honestly I might be even willing to change to Gakuki winning 6 times out of 10 in this battle, here it's a fair fight with equalized forces

The hardship of a decision

 

[Jailer]

The hardship of a decision

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

Aye. Thanks for the thread ^^

Both are absolute monsters on their own (although I have bias against Hakuki lol) but that aside, this will be a very close one. Gakuki is the only general with SS experience, I'm guessing that it's about his overall capability as a general. And man's probably a strong martial warrior (I mean look how bulky and chonky this dude is Lmao). If we were to compares both of them in stats.

Gakuki
- Strength: 93
- Leadership: 100
- Intelligence: 98
- Experience: SS
- Great General Factor: 100

Hakuki
- Strength: 86
- Leadership: 92
- Intelligence: 99
- Experience: S

So like I said, Gakuki is a strong warrior with stat of 93, leadership of 100 which is expected, intelligence is only 1 below Hakuki. Hakuki is a combo of Ousen and Kanki (both are comparable according to Renpa and have that ruthless nature of Kanki) so I'll say that Gakuki would win 6/10 times due to his leadership and experience. And if they engaged in a duel then Gakuki would slaps Hakuki across China.

 

[Blackbeard]

It's hard, we are looking at two absolute monsters. What is your top 5 all time generals?

P.S. My Gakuki vs Riboku thread still lies there, almost completely ignored for some reason

Up until this point in story and in no order:

Hakuki
Gakuki
Renpa
Ousen
Riboku

Basically Gakuki + the 4 notorious warring states period Generals. Last 3 are replaceable with Ouki.

 

[God Buggy]

Up until this point in story and in no order:

Hakuki
Gakuki
Renpa
Ousen
Riboku

Basically Gakuki + the 4 notorious warring states period Generals. Last 3 are replaceable with Ouki.

Imo the top 5 are (in no order) Ousen, Gakuki, Kouen, Riboku and Hakuki.

 

[Ninjashadow0209]

So, for me Hakuki is the greatest General in History of Warring states.All generals has fear of this man.

Gakuki doed what Riboku was about to do with coalisition army.

I going with Hakuki High diffs, same as Hakuki will doed to Riboku.

Post automatically merged: Feb 20, 2022

Up until this point in story and in no order:

Hakuki
Gakuki
Renpa
Ousen
Riboku

Basically Gakuki + the 4 notorious warring states period Generals. Last 3 are replaceable with Ouki.

1-Hakuki.
2-Renpa.
3-Gakuki.
4-Ouki.
5-Riboku.

 

[Xlaw]

I will go with Gakuki . As per guide book he has edge love Hakuki...Not only that but as per manga if you take their background in consideration.
Gakuki had much challenging environment and struggle to pull what he did..
Compared Qin Yan was small state , had limitated resources . On top of that his state was on verge of collapse...Yet he did 180° with whatever limited resources he had available that time...
Not only he defended Yan but also destroyed the superpower..
To pull that off one need intelligence , leadership quality and also strong subordinates..

And I do believe that he had stronger subordinate than Hakuki

 

[Ninjashadow0209]

I will go with Gakuki . As per guide book he has edge love Hakuki...Not only that but as per manga if you take their background in consideration.
Gakuki had much challenging environment and struggle to pull what he did..
Compared Qin Yan was small state , had limitated resources . On top of that his state was on verge of collapse...Yet he did 180° with whatever limited resources he had available that time...
Not only he defended Yan but also destroyed the superpower..
To pull that off one need intelligence , leadership quality and also strong subordinates..

And I do believe that he had stronger subordinate than Hakuki

Having a stronger Subordinate don't make him automatically above Hakuki, Hakuki was feared all of china for every General.


Renpa himself who have stats above Gakuki, said that Hakuki was the most difficult to face off in China.

 

[Red Admiral]

So, as @Sanji D Goat wanted, here we are.

Hakuki

The leader of the famous Qin 6, a man who simply terrorized China. Renpa considered him the hardest of the Qin 6 to deal with, in real life he was undefeated. Like I also said in the Hakuki vs Ouki thread, @Fleet Admiral Lee Hung has a nice thread on the man where he pretty much goes through what we know of his abilities, as of now. He was a truly terrifying individual.

Gakuki

He was called the "Military god". He saved the state of Yan which was nearly wiped out by a superstate and turned the tide completely, pushing the Qi forces all the way back. He then led the first coalition army against Qi, destroying most of it.

Both get 150k soldiers, equalized forces. Share your thoughts.

@Fleet Admiral Lee Hung @Owl Ki @Blackbeard
@Jailer @TheKnightOfTheSea @Topi Jerami @Shanks @RayanOO @MarineHQ62 @Seth
@Da evil Who @Arara etc.

one of the hardest battels
but I still favor the Military God over anyone dead or alive
the man who shook the very earth
the equivalent to Qin's Six Great Generals in the west
the man with best stats in the story so far

Gakuki feat of saving a dead state of Yan from a super state of Qi and later on destroying that super state is off chart and above any feat

Maybe EoS Ousen can take him down since taking down Chu is as good as a feat as beating Qi


p.s
tho I respect Hakuki more now ...

 

[Phoenix]

one of the hardest battels
but I still favor the Military God over anyone dead or alive
the man who shook the very earth
the equivalent to Qin's Six Great Generals in the west
the man with best stats in the story so far

Gakuki feat of saving a dead state of Yan from a super state of Qi and later on destroying that super state is off chart and above any feat

Maybe EoS Ousen can take him down since taking down Chu is as good as a feat as beating Qi


p.s
tho I respect Hakuki more now ...

I disagree. Renpa has the same stats as Gakuki and Hakuki always had the upper hand on Renpa as Renpa himself admitted.
Stats tell a story but not the whole story.

As for Qi. It was a coalition. That's like saying if they beat Qin than Shunshinkun would've been an untouchable general. Of course he gets the experience of leading such a large army but beating Qi isn't Gakuki's achievement on his lonesome.

And

Spoiler: Historical spoiler

Gakuki isn't considered among the best like Hakuki

He was the leader of the Qin 6 and the best among them.

I'd bet on Hakuki

 

[Red Admiral]

I disagree. Renpa has the same stats as Gakuki and Hakuki always had the upper hand on Renpa as Renpa himself admitted.

by stats I'm implying Hara made him the top dog so that alone means much

yea but it is Gakuki that have that SS tier Experience level unlike Renpa
now I don't know that SS means. but since NO other General in the story have that SS it should means something big

and not to mention points in Intelligence and Leadership means more than merely Strength
cause a great General is more defined by Intelligence and Leadership rather than his power

Intelligence and Leadership points of Renpa : 194 (he got wiser and better leader in time like all characters I assume)
Intelligence and Leadership points of Gakuki : 198

the only other man who can surpass Gakuki in these term is Riboku
but even Riboku got bested by a copy of Gakuki strategy ...
without Hou Ken he would've lost that battel as far as strategy goes

so yes ... stats ... SADLY ... aren't the best argument but Gakuki rock this game

As for Qi. It was a coalition. That's like saying if they beat Qin than Shunshinkun would've been an untouchable general. Of course he gets the experience of leading such a large army but beating Qi isn't Gakuki's achievement on his lonesome.

I think you are just mentioning only half of story.
Gakuki saved Yan state from the edge of destruction and THAN went and destroyed Qi
so it's not like Shunshinkun from Qin cause Qin is already 2nd strongest
while Yan was abvioulsy the weakest who overcame the strongest all because of 1 man


p.s
I don't know if you know it but in fact winning by a large army is among HARDEST jobs
yes people think "that guy have more army so he should win easily"
but in fact VAST MAJOROITY of coalition armies or armies over 500k lost to a much weaker army (all around the world/history)
even the best general of all times Napoleon lost for the very same reasons .... raising a large army instead of sending many small armies

providing food for army alone is bigger enemy than the real enemy
if you can't win in a short time ... you are defeated yourself
MOST coalition armies in the china end up in defeat
Kong Ming defeated one simply by sending few men and few massages
trust and unity in any coalition armies is weak and easily breakable as well

and I'm not sure about it but story implied Gakuki was the FIRST man who created a coalition army for the very first time in history of china ... if this be true ... that alone is a god tier feat of hype

 

[Phoenix]

but even Riboku got bested by a copy of Gakuki strategy ...
without Hou Ken he would've lost that battel as far as strategy goes

He wasn't. That was a trap, he lured Gekishin there. Riboku wasn't even surprised. And Riboku could've beat him himself

Also even if he was then you're disproving yourself about Intel + Leadership being the "most important thing"

I think you are just mentioning only half of story.
Gakuki saved Yan state from the edge of destruction and THAN went and destroyed Qi
so it's not like Shunshinkun from Qin cause Qin is already 2nd strongest
while Yan was abvioulsy the weakest who overcame the strongest all because of 1 man

Like how Han is surviving rn against Qin. You are also mentioning half of it. The other states wouldn't just let Qi get Yan.

And again there is a reason why Gakuki isn't in the history books as one of the best

 

[Red Admiral]

He wasn't. That was a trap, he lured Gekishin there. Riboku wasn't even surprised. And Riboku could've beat him himself

Also even if he was then you're disproving yourself about Intel + Leadership being the "most important thing"

not really ... he didn't "trap" him ... Gekishin CAME UP with that ... there is zero way for him to trap Gekishin other than mind control or something.

Riboku being the best strategist in the story is arguable ... I just don't consider him the best general
btw Gakuki and Riboku have 1 point of difference and SS experience is enough to cover this gap
while Gakuki and Hakuki have 7 points gap AND Gakuki have SS experience

so once more ... Gakuki obviously win this types of debate

Like how Han is surviving rn against Qin. You are also mentioning half of it. The other states wouldn't just let Qi get Yan.
And again there is a reason why Gakuki isn't in the history books as one of the best

yes ... like Han going from weakest state to the one who ruled china for over 400 years
and the general who did that is now hailed as the greatest general in chinses history
meaning Han Xin

Kong Ming ... the man who is hailed as the smartest man on china history ... hailed Gakuki as the GOAT
so I'm not sure why you are mentioning history
cause Kong Ming opinion is 1 million times more canon than us

in the story ... no General has a feat comparable or even close to Gakuki ...