Shibashou: Zhao's Sleeping Tiger - Predictions

#1

Shibashou is one of the most hyped characters in Kingdom right now. He was nominated to become Zhao's Third Great Heaven, but he rejected the appointment because he hates the Zhao Monarchy. Hara has gone out of the way to hype the sheer size of this madlad multiple times, not only does he stand head and shoulders above his Elite Soldiers during his reveal, but Hara even drew him in comparison to a "normal" Zhao soldier to emphasize how massive he is:


During his initial "silhouette" reveal, Hara also drew him oozing a similar "martial aura" to other characters who have received similar hype:


It is pretty clear imo that Hara really wants us to understand that Shibashou is going to be one of the strongest warriors in all of Kingdom, but what other expectations do you have for him and his reveal? Is this character going to be the character who Shin "defeats" in order to reach the rank of Great General? Or does Hara have some other plans for him?

Discuss some ideas below, and make sure to spoiler-tag Historical Spoilers.

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#5

Shibashou is one of the most hyped characters in Kingdom right now. He was nominated to become Zhao's Third Great Heaven, but he rejected the appointment because he hates the Zhao Monarchy. Hara has gone out of the way to hype the sheer size of this madlad multiple times, not only does he stand head and shoulders above his Elite Soldiers during his reveal, but Hara even drew him in comparison to a "normal" Zhao soldier to emphasize how massive he is:


During his initial "silhouette" reveal, Hara also drew him oozing a similar "martial aura" to other characters who have received similar hype:


It is pretty clear imo that Hara really wants us to understand that Shibashou is going to be one of the strongest warriors in all of Kingdom, but what other expectations do you have for him and his reveal? Is this character going to be the character who Shin "defeats" in order to reach the rank of Great General? Or does Hara have some other plans for him?

Discuss some ideas below, and make sure to spoiler-tag Historical Spoilers.

@Owl Ki
@Patryipe
@Blackbeard
@Bullet
@Shanks
@Dark Admiral
@Guan Yu
@Dovahkiin
@Greenbeard
@dizzy2341
@PuckTheGreat
@MarineHQ62
@RayanOO
@Ninjashadow0209
@Arara
@Hiragaro
@Yo Tan Wa
@FaradaySloth
@ranady
@Dragomir
@Den_Den_Mushi
@Fiji
@Xione
@Jailer
@Bepo
Shibashou/Seika remind me of Kisui/Rigan V2. Perhaps SBS is going to show us that Kanki's psychological warfare trick won't work twice, lmfao? All for SBS being a bigger martial beast than Houken.
 
#6
Shibashou/Seika remind me of Kisui/Rigan V2.
you sir, take it back. Shibashou should be Tiers ahead of Kisui of Rigan.
Perhaps SBS is going to show us that Kanki's psychological warfare trick won't work twice, lmfao? All for SBS being a bigger martial beast than Houken.
I agree and disagree. SBS too cares for his citizens which is why he chased Ordo away so he won't abandon his men just like Kisui but yes, he will out perform Kanki perhaps. Beat him on his own game.
 
#8
And, No Shin should not beat him. He has too much of hype behind him. Last time Shin fought a fighter of such caliber, he had to be brought back from his afterlife.
Well, first off, Houken was the strongest character in the Manga lol. Shibashou won’t be as strong as him, Shibashou will probably be more akin to Gyou’Un/Gaimou/Man’U in strength. Somewhere around that spectrum.

But second, Shin will have to grow in strength if he wants to become a Great General, yes? What’s wrong with Shibashou being the opponent that Shin defeats in order to attain that rank?

Riboku can still use Shibasou to overwhelm Kanki, Shin would just be the one in the end to ultimately slay Shibashou.
 
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RayanOO

Lazy is the way
.
#9
Shiba seems to be a powerhouse.

But I don't want Shiba to be just brawn, Riboku doesn't need an other Houken to use as hammer. I want Shibashou to be smart too, to have his own history with Seika, his own goal etc.

Shibashou managed to protect his city for years so I think he can handle himself as a general and can think too.

As for who will defeat him I have no idea.
 
#10
Well, first off, Houken was the strongest character in the Manga lol. Shibashou won’t be as strong as him, Shibashou will probably be more akin to Gyou’Un/Gaimou/Man’U in strength. Somewhere around that spectrum.
Houken was already nerfed while fighting Shin, he lost fingers from his dominant hand or so, lol. To beat the men you listed, Shin must have out of the world growth in terms of raw physical strength. Shibashou has been hyped too much for him to be just a stepping stone on Shin's journey to GG.
But second, Shin will have to grow in strength if he wants to become a Great General, yes? What’s wrong with Shibashou being the opponent that Shin defeats in order to attain that rank?

Riboku can still use Shibasou to overwhelm Kanki, Shin would just be the one in the end to ultimately slay Shibashou.
Shin is probably the only character (apart from Guts) whom I'm always rooting for. So, him slaying Shibashou will be really an amazing moment for me cause it would mean Shin has outgrown Riboku himself. By beating SBS he would have beaten Riboku twice. Will be interesting to see how Hara will pull it off though.

p.s. Now I'm thinking, it's highly probable. Zhao shall fall and it would mean all of it's Top Generals too so why not Shin get the glory out of it.
 

RayanOO

Lazy is the way
.
#11
Houken was already nerfed while fighting Shin, he lost fingers from his dominant hand or so, lol. To beat the men you listed, Shin must have out of the world growth in terms of raw physical strength. Shibashou has been hyped too much for him to be just a stepping stone on Shin's journey to GG.

Shin is probably the only character (apart from Guts) whom I'm always rooting for. So, him slaying Shibashou will be really an amazing moment for me cause it would mean Shin has outgrown Riboku himself. By beating SBS he would have beaten Riboku twice. Will be interesting to see how Hara will pull it off though.

p.s. Now I'm thinking, it's highly probable. Zhao shall fall and it would mean all of it's Top Generals too so why not Shin get the glory out of it.
Shibashou seems interesting. It can be good for Shin to fight him.

I want an interesting opponent and rival for Shin. Rinko believes impacted Shin a lot; same for Man Goku rage toward Qin. I want something like that again.
 
#12
Houken was already nerfed while fighting Shin, he lost fingers from his dominant hand or so, lol.
Shin himself was more wounded an exhausted than Houken was lol. I don’t think it’s necessary to try and discredit Shin’s victory over Houken. Martially, Shin is low Great General level.

lol. To beat the men you listed, Shin must have out of the world growth in terms of raw physical strength.
Not really. Before Shin even picked up Ouki’s Glaive, he was thrashing Gaimou quite hard. After picking up Ouki’s Glaive, he fought on par with Gyou’Un for an entire afternoon. In terms of brute strength, Shin is ready for anybody in Kingdom right now.

So, him slaying Shibashou will be really an amazing moment for me cause it would mean Shin has outgrown Riboku himself.
Riboku is a General of an unprecedented level as stated by Ouki. He was also called the most dangerous man in China by Renpa. If there is such thing as “above Great General level”, that is Riboku. So Shin defeating Shibashou would not necessarily mean he has surpassed Riboku.
 
#14
So we know Shibashou teams up with Riboku as the two main Zhao heads in the Final Invasion of Zhao which took place in 229 BCE to 228 BCE. We know however the three main Qin Commanders were Ousen, Yotanwa, and actually Kyoukai. Now it's definitely confirmed that Shin will play a role due to 1) the woman he wishes to bone will be there 2) the dude he wishes to kill the most will be there 3) Zhao has pretty much been the main antagonistic force for the past 550 chapters.

BUT, I do not think Shin will be the one to slay or fight against Shibashou. He holds no beef nor gain against a character like Shibashou, hell, I don't even think any of the Qin Cast know who Shibashou is atm. I wouldn't think it'd be accurate or right to have Shin be the one to slay Shibashou, it's not his historical moment to shine but rather Kyoukai.

Like seriously, Qiang Lei (Kyoukai) is only mentioned for the Zhao Invasion against Riboku & Shibashou in 229 BCE IIRC, if anything this would be Kyoukai's biggest moment in the series historically speaking and rather have Shin become a Great General by defeating Shibashou (which can be totally reserved for the Yan Campaign) let this be the moment where Kyoukai goes from being an Assassin jumping around cutting people's heads off to rather, well, actually be a General (or Great General) in her own right, which is what it seems Hara is heading to (based only on appearance, I know, weak, but eh):

I mean shit guys, who wouldn't want Kyoukai to actually be like 99% of everyone else in her series?!?!? So that's what I want, a Kyoukai vs Shibashou match, but also wouldn't mind a Yotanwa vs Shibashou match as she was totally ready to throw hands against Houken of all people:


And I don't think Yotanwa ever had a good duel with anyone in the series which I consider to be a crime. Moubu, Ouki, Tou, shit dude Mougou all had duels but not our girl Yotanwa...and she been here since the start! And Hara can create beef anyway, by having Shibashou probably decimate her subordinates like Shunmen, Tajifu, and god forbid not her Bajio.

So overall, if we're going by duels, I think with how Shibashou has been portrayed so far + historical sense + logic it should be YTW's & Kyoukai's mountain to climb instead of Shin, who has plenty of history waiting for him (literally 3 countries after Zhao Shin is apart of)

However this is assuming Hara won't strictly follow History, in which case Shin never slays Riboku and Shibashou is never slayed period. Oof.
As for his strength, he's definitely a mix of instinctual but he's very much so smart. I feel as if he's going to be a combination of Kisui, Gyou'un, and Keisha.
TLDR: For him being an obstacle, it's much better if he goes up against Kyoukai, and just to satisfy my demands I want him to go up against Yotanwa as well. Shin's there for Riboku, not some dude who went up against Ordo for a couple minutes.
 
#15
BUT, I do not think Shin will be the one to slay or fight against Shibashou. He holds no beef nor gain against a character like Shibashou, hell, I don't even think any of the Qin Cast know who Shibashou is atm
Just had to respond to this briefly lol:

What? Did Shin know who Rinko was before fighting against him? No, Shin found out who Rinko was and then decided he wanted to surpass him.

Did Shin know who Chou Garyuu was before slaying him? No, Shin found out who Chou Garyuu was during Shukai Plains and slayed him because that was the most optimal course of the battle.

Hell Shin committed himself to slaying Renpa just after hearing Renpa's name for the first time lol. Shin was like "he's a Great General and therefore I'm going to slay him."

Shin does not need to have any prior knowledge of who Shibashou is in order to fight him, nor does he need any complex motivation to do so. Literally the motive could be as simple as: Shin sees Shibashou's strength for himself, decides that he will never be the Greatest General under Heaven if he cannot surpass someone like Shibashou, and resolves to defeat him because of that.
 
#16
Just had to respond to this briefly lol:

What? Did Shin know who Rinko was before fighting against him? No, Shin found out who Rinko was and then decided he wanted to surpass him.

Did Shin know who Chou Garyuu was before slaying him? No, Shin found out who Chou Garyuu was during Shukai Plains and slayed him because that was the most optimal course of the battle.

Hell Shin committed himself to slaying Renpa just after hearing Renpa's name for the first time lol. Shin was like "he's a Great General and therefore I'm going to slay him."

Shin does not need to have any prior knowledge of who Shibashou is in order to fight him, nor does he need any complex motivation to do so. Literally the motive could be as simple as: Shin sees Shibashou's strength for himself, decides that he will never be the Greatest General under Heaven if he cannot surpass someone like Shibashou, and resolves to defeat him because of that.
This is my problem however, as well as I think you mistook what I said.
For the comparisons I'll address them briefly as they don't hold as much relevance to this discussion:
-Rinko was important as he was the first big obstacle where Shin needed to evolve from being dependent on his superiors or jumping head first into battle and face a situation in which he himself alone needs to surpass. Likewise Rinko means a lot to Shin's Journey, being portrayed as one of the people pushing him onwards in his journey for a couple instances.
-Chougaryuu held no significance to the grand scheme of Shin's adventures though admittedly he holds some responsibility for the first major death in the Hi Shin Unit since the Bayou Arc. Also, Shin killing CGR is like you said, was the most optimal course in the battle. Shibashou is a way larger threat then just CGR on the 14th Day at Shukai Plains.
-Renpa is like a final boss for Shin, yeah you're not wrong with how they met but Hara has been slowly building up to that as an official torch passing for the Old Gen to the New Gen. Shibashou has just been chilling in Seika this entire time.

So moving on to Shibashou being a requirement for Great General, it isn't needed in my opinion.
Firstly, as I have already went over it'd be wrong and just plain "MC-wank" by the author to have Shin take down a character that historically is another's characters moment to shine. Not only is this a major character, but as others claim she is practically the tritagonist at this point, being Kyoukai. In which we know that her personal goal is to also become a Great General:

And from the King Magax profile of Qiang Lei, here's what it states:
2.Activities in History
Qiang Lei, like Xin, was a pretty unknown general of their era. Nothing much was mentioned about him(yes him, will explain about this later) in ShiJi. His name only appeared a total of 2 times in ShiJi during the invasion of Zhao in the unification war as far as i know but if anyone do know or find out more information about him, do share it lol.
From ShiJi: Annals of Qin Shi Huang:
Original text: 十八年,大兴兵攻赵,王翦将上地,下井陉,端和将河内,羌瘣伐赵,端和围邯郸城。十九年,王翦、羌瘣尽定取 赵地东阳,得赵王。
Rough translation: 18th year(of Ying Zheng’s rule), a huge army was formed to invade Zhao. Generals Wang Jian, (Yang)DuanHe, Qiang Lei invaded Zhao and DuanHe sieged HanDan(the capital of Zhao). 19th year(of Ying Zheng’s rule), Wang Jian and Qiang Lei captured the remaining lands of Zhao and captured the king of Zhao.
Likewise, Sima Shang's profile:
2.Activities in History

Sima Shang, similar to many generals of his time, had little records of his achievements in history. While not the most renowned general of his time, he had the honor to be Li Mu’s deputy. His one and only appearance, which was repeated a few times in Shiji, was during the final war between Zhao and Qin.
Shi Ji–Book of Zhao Aristocratic Family:
七年,秦人攻赵,赵大将李牧、将军司马尚将,击之。李牧诛,司马尚免,赵怱及齐将颜聚代之。赵怱军破,颜聚 亡去。
Translation:
7th year of the King Qian of Zhao (229BC), Qin attacked Zhao. Great General Li Mu and and General Sima Shang were tasked to defend against the attack. Riboku was then executed while Sima Shang was stripped off his duties. (General) Zhao Cong and the Qi general, Yan Ju, was tasked to replace them. Zhao Cong was defeated and Yan Ju fled.

Shi Ji–Biographies of Lian Po and Lin Xiangru:
赵王迁七年,秦使王翦攻赵,赵使李牧、司马尚御之。秦多与赵王宠臣郭开金,为反间,言李牧、司马尚欲反。赵 王乃使赵葱及齐将颜聚代李牧。李牧不受命,赵使人微捕得李牧,斩之。废司马尚。后三月,王翦因急击赵,大破 杀赵葱,虏赵王迁及其将颜聚,遂灭赵。
Translation:
7th year of King Qian of Zhao(229 BC), the King of Qin instructed Wang Jian to attack Zhao. Zhao had Li Mu and Sima Shang defend against the attack. Qin bribed Guo Kai, a minister who was liked by the King of Zhao, with gold to spread news of Li Mu and Sima Shang having plans to rebel. The king of Zhao sent Zhao Cong and Qi general Yan Ju to replace Li Mu. Li Mu refused but was captured by Zhao men and later executed. Sima Shang was also stripped off his duties. 3 months later, Wang Jian struck swiftly against Zhao and killed Zhao Cong, capturing King Qian of Zhao and Yan Ju, destroying Zhao.
Shibashou and Kyoukai are tied in a direct conflict, with both (most importantly, Kyoukai) being their sole appearance in the Shiji. So really, if Hara's goals are to make Kyoukai a Great General which is credible based on evidence, then wouldn't that be in her Zhao Invasion?
Secondly, why would Shibashou of all people be the last obstacle (if you're not claiming he is, then even less reason to have Shin go up against Shibashou.) Shin is a major face in the Yan, Chu, Dai, and Qi Invasions, if Shin is becoming a Great General in the Qin Six, it's not going to be through Zhao and definitely not through Shibashou. Way too early, especially since Shibashou's presence in the manga will be over with probably still hundreds and hundreds of chapters left to be written.
Lastly, I also already explained this but Riboku is the obstacle to Shin that's already been addressed and shown, not Shibashou. Riboku is responsible for equally the amount of damage Shin has had in his career, they've met on numerous occasions as foes (Diplomatic meetings, duel in the forest, Riboku trolling Shin while running away, etc.), him being the biggest obstacle Qin would ever face in unification, etc. if your point here is that Shin wants to become a Great General, then he'll go for Riboku, not Shibashou. Else, it just feels like a random, forced confrontation used to promote "look how strong Shin is" not nearly the same character growth Kyoukai would receive.

That's my take, my whole premise isn't that Shin vs Shibashou would be bad because Shin doesn't know who Shibashou is, but rather it wouldn't work nearly as well as the other possibilities that have already been set.
 
#17
Thanks for the Tag!

My predictions for Shibashou + upcoming Zhao army:

Riboku will have two prominent generals in the upcoming war(s):

- Shibashou, Tiger of Seika
- Bananji, Demon of Ganmon

Bananji's reaction after hearing about Shibashou joining up with them:

Based on this panel below, I'm curious if Bananji himself knows Shibashou or not:

My estimate is that these two combined with Riboku will sort of be the last version of the Zhao 3 before Zhao's eventual fall. With Shibashou we have the historical facts about him to determine his future in Zhao 3 and what not. With Bananji it's more a guess based on Hara making sure to hype him at the end of Shukai Plains, then showing how he has a similar thinking process as the Guardian of Kantan. Even predicting how long Zhao could manage to hold out (based on historical facts, he was spot on). And just his interaction with Riboku from the Shukai plains to now.

-

I think Shin's main martial fight will be against Riboku, this will be continuing the duel they had pre-Coalition War. Shibashou might clash with him at one point or even Bananji. But the big 1v1 for Shin is gonna be Riboku. It's possible either Yotanwa/Kyoukai/Ouhon end up fighting Shibashou for Shibashou's main 1v1. There's also the deal with Bananji & Ouhon, with them having some unsettled business from the Shukai Plains, so maybe Ouhon's will be Bananji. It's also very much possible we don't get any conclusive 1v1s that go to the end result, simply because of the tragic situation(s) involving Riboku. Futei could also see some huge development by then, and eventually be a fighter who would serve as the big fight for Ouhon or Kyoukai. There's also the possibility of a Futei vs Shin rematch.

I think Yotanwa vs Shibashou would arguably be the most epic thing so far, just based off of their character designs.

-

My ranking for Shibashou as a general is up in the air now, but I would like him to be superior to Rinshoujou and just under Renpa in terms of talent. I doubt he'd be able to catch up to them in experience, unless he part takes in on going battles after Riboku's return to the fall of Zhao. I expect the man to be a "natural genius" type of a guy when it comes to warfare, so expect him to use some nice strategies.
 
#18
I've said this before, but I think Shibashou will specialize in martial might, but will also be a capable strategist, just like how Riboku specializes in strategy but is also a martial beast.

I think he'll be Riboku's right hand for the remaining Zhao campaigns.
He'll probably play a big role in the defeat of Kanki too.

Historically, Ka, Prince of Zhao formed a short lived state called Dia that was captured by Ouhon. He also allied with the King of Yan after a resident of Yan failed to assassinate Sei. I can see Shibashou surviving and going with Ka and being the final boss of a mini Dia Arc.

However, I think he's most likely to die during the final invasion at the hands of Shin.
 
#19
I read somewhere that Shiba was the last GG of Zhao after Riboku and never died in battle. As from what we have seen , he don't seem bad person to me. And yes he gonna slay Kanki for sure. From all GG , i want Yo Ta Na Wa to fight him
Post automatically merged:

Didn't know Kyoukai was actually an historical figure ? I thought Yo Tan Wa was based on that character..
 
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