Current Events The Supernova Have Been Fighting Hybrid Kaido and Mama for a While

How long have the Supernova been fighting Hybrid Kaido and Mama?


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Cinera

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#1
Disclaimer
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Introduction
There seems to be a lot of confusion regarding the events of the Rooftop battle, so I thought to offer my best interpretation of it.


Ten Minutes
First things first, the 10 minutes has long since concluded. In fact, the Supernova continued to fiercely fight the Yonkou while all the events under the Rooftop were ongoing. This is made clear in the below scene from Chapter 1006:


But Luffy Didn't Use Haki
Some people claim that the ten minutes cannot have run out yet, because Luffy was supposedly still unable to use haki. As far as I'm aware, that argument is based on faulty premises.

Luffy's Haki Usage(?)
When Luffy struck Kaido, we see black lightning:


Black lightning isn't always indicative of haki usage, but it's commonly seen in haki clashes.


Hakiless Luffy
This is Luffy after he ran out of G4 against Kaido:


He couldn't even dodge Mama's attack by himself and had to be carried by Zoro:

He's once again carried away from danger by Zoro:

Zoro once again carries Luffy and Luffy is helpless in Kaido's tornado:

He can't even prevent himself from being bitten:

Luffy is once again dead weight that can't do anything by himself:

Zoro has to once again carry Luffy and dodge Kaido's attacks:

Luffy is once again utterly spent:


Current Luffy
Compare the Luffy I just showed you (post-Boundman cooldown), to Luffy in this chapter.

He attacks Kaido head-on:

He gets rejected:

After getting rejected, he attacks Kaido again, stating that he believes their attacks should be working:

He's once again rejected:

Notice how Zoro isn't literally carrying him around like he's a sack of potatoes? How Zoro is instead cautioning him to think before brashly attacking the Yonkou?

Luffy still has the energy to scream and shout:

In contrast to his utter exhaustion in 1003, he defiantly smiles in 1008:


The Difference




















Luffy in Chapter 1003 Luffy in Chapter 1008
He could not do anything by himself He was the most energetic of the Rooftop Supernova.
Zoro had to save him five times in the chapter. He attacked Kaido by himself twice.
Zoro was worried for his safety. Zoro was chastising him to think before brashly attacking the Yonkou.
He had a look of utter exhaustion when he saw Kaido. He had a defiant grin when he locked eyes with Kaido.


The fact is that Post Boundman Luffy was a sack of potatoes that could not even lift a single finger by himself and was constantly carried around by Zoro. In this chapter we see him attack Kaido head-on twice. To claim that Luffy went from being a sack of potatoes to the most energetic of the Supernova while he still can't use haki is unfathomably stupid.


Timeskip
Momonosuke and Shinobu's dialogue confirms that what we see of the Rooftop battle is what is currently happening, and not a snapshot of the past:

Momonosuke talks about Luffy's current condition. This suggests that there has been a lengthy timeskip between Chapter 1003 and Chapter 1008. Here are some events that happened in the interim:
  • The mystery woman treated the Scabbards and helped them recover
  • Franky vs Sasaki
  • Jinbe vs Who's Who
  • Sanji's release from Black Maria
  • Usopp and Tama's Gifter Revolution
  • Perospero defeating Carrot and making it to the dome
  • Marco's battle against King and Queen
    • The battle has gone on for so long that Marco is tired
  • Onigashima approaches the Flower Capital
    • We see Mt. Fujiyama in the background
  • Hyougoro clearing out the Live Floor
  • Chopper preparing the antidote and saving Hyougoro
    • The Pleasures and Waiters turning on Queen
    • Chopper bitchslapping Queen
  • Scabbards drama with Fake Oden

Between when we first see Hybrid Kaido's Silhouette in Chapter 1003 and Momonosuke reassuring Shinobu that Luffy is still in high spirits, a lot has happened. And the Supernova were fighting a serious Hybrid Kaido and Mama for the entirety of that time.


A Protracted Battle
While all the events under the Rooftop were happening, the Supernova continued to bravely face the two Yonkou.

This becomes obvious in what we see of this short scene:
  • Kidd's massive robot has been completely destroyed and he's moved to just using two arms as weaponry.
  • Zoro has ditched Santoryu and has been fighting with just one sword for a while.
    • Perhaps he's conserving his stamina for the long haul.
  • Several of the Supernova are shown to be panting indicating their exhaustion.
    • Zoro
    • Killer
    • Luffy
    • Coincidentally, these three are the Supernova whose fighting style requires significant physical exertion.
    • They are also the only ones to have done damage to Kaido. Zoro and Luffy moreso than Killer.

Zoro and Kidd's words in the earlier scene suggest that Hybrid Kaido is substantially more durable than his Dragon form. The first 4 chapters of the Rooftop established that Luffy and Zoro had the arsenal to properly damage Dragon Kaido, but now Kidd says that none of their attacks are working, and Zoro questions how they can win against them. Either that, or Hybrid Kaido's regeneration is on an entirely different level.

Even Luffy is no better, just stubbornly insisting that they must be feeling it as they are the same humans as them:

Luffy's choice of wording in particular: "we've hit them so many times" further indicates just how long they've been fighting the Yonkou since Luffy recovered.


Luffy affirms himself that his stubborn insistence that they can prevail is just taking the right attitude:

Killer's words further suggest that the battle has been going on for a long time:
Killer said:
Honestly, after all this, I'm surprised he still considers them human.

All the above events paint the scenario that the Supernova have been fighting Hybrid Kaido and Mama for a long time (several tens of minutes? A few hours? Who knows, at the very least, we seem to have picked up as Luffy just exited yet another round of G4). Over the duration of the fight, victory has seemed impossible as the Yonkou showed themselves to be inhuman monsters.


A Serious Confrontation
The idea that the Yonkou were playing around for the entirety of the battle is completely unfounded. There is no indication that the Yonkou were just playing around while they were fighting the Supernova. In fact, at the end of Chapter 1001, they declare their intention to kill the Supernova:

At the end of Chapter 1003, they indicate that they are having fun and have started taking things seriously:

Furthermore, we can see that Mama has changed her offensive strategy:
  • For the first time ever, we see her using all three homies.
  • She's switched from riding Zeus to riding Prometheus.
  • She now wields Zeus in her right arm.
  • Perhaps she moved away from Prometheus' fire-based attacks because of Zoro neutralising them?

Kaido also seems pretty roughed up in what we see of his face:


The Yonkou weren't fooling around, they were simply not capable of defeating the Supernova.


Conclusions
The Supernova fought against the Yonkou for a while (at least several tens of minutes, potentially up to a few hours). For the duration of the battle, the Yonkou were unable to defeat the Supernova.


Summary
To summarise my arguments and claims above:
  • The Rooftop Battle in Chapter 1008 picks up at the current time of the story.
    • It starts after Momonosuke informs Shinobu of Luffy's current condition.
  • The Supernova have been fighting the Yonkou for the entirety of the duration between the appearance of Kaido's silhouette in Chapter 1003 and Momo's conversation with Shinobu in Chapter 1008.
  • Many events happened in the interim, and the minimum duration of the battle is several tens of minutes.
  • There are several reliable indicators that the Supernova's battle with Hybrid Kaido and Mama have continued for a while:
    • Kidd's massive robot has been completely destroyed and he's moved to just using two arms as weaponry.
    • Zoro has ditched Santoryu and has been fighting with just one sword for a while.
    • The Supernova are shown to be panting, indicating how much they've had to exert themselves.
  • The Yonkou were serious when they fought the Supernova but were simply unable to defeat them in that time period.


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Cinera

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#10
Luffy still doesnโ€™t even have his Haki back yet and two Yonko canโ€™t defeat him. At this rate the Supernova will surely will separate the Yonko and defeat them individually.
I think he has fully recovered his haki. We even see the black lightning indicative of haki clashes when Luffy launches his attack:


It also looks like Luffy just finished another round of Boundman:



Between 10 and 30 minutes. Law's words might indicate Luffy had nap 2 times off screen.
Oh, I didn't catch that, what scene are you referring to?
 
#12
Stop underrating those 5...

Time they fought full power BM and hybrid Kaido? Between 10 minutes and 30-40 minutes, leaning on the latter...
Since when Luffy drained, a few minutes passed before Kaido turned hybrid. After that Luffy got back up so they fought for 15 minutes minimum imo, depends if Luffy used G4 again and was drained again, in that case we could easily reach 45 minutes of battle
 
#15
Maybe for 9 or 10 minutes, Luffy reached his limits when Kaido was in dragon form Zoro saved him 2 times then we saw the CP0 talking about the war Kaido went hybrid after that
Don't forget that Law's ability is very useful and even with that they got injured and tired admitting that they can't win
 
#16
Even more time passed than just 10 minutes. G4 alone takes away 10 minutes, add how much more Haki is getting drained by two forms of Advanced Haki.

Luffy could move and attack after 10 minutes, but needs more time to be 100% ready again.
It also looks like Luffy just finished another round of Boundman:
Nah disagree. He was shown attacking in Base and we would've known if he used up another round of G4. Luffy attacked in Base.
 

Fleet Admiral Lee Hung

Conqueror of the Stars
โ€Ž
#18
I think he has fully recovered his haki. We even see the black lightning indicative of haki clashes when Luffy launches his attack:


It also looks like Luffy just finished another round of Boundman:




Oh, I didn't catch that, what scene are you referring to?
Black Lightning does not indicate Haki, it indicates critical strikes:


Hybrid Kaido is critically striking Haki-less Luffy and failing to defeat him.
 
#19
Yeah, they keep fighting since we last saw them.

Still, clearly now that Kaido is also defending himself with his club landing attacks is becoming more difficult. Neither side is going all out but restricted Yonko can still do more damage than restricted SNs, so they have the upper hand.

If it were 5v1 with the SN not having to worry about BM Kaido would be fucked. Let's see if they manage to Olin BM and get rid of her.

Otherwise even a 2v1 + 3v1 split would help a bit. At least you can just go all out focusing on a single yonko w/o having to worry about the second one sneak attacking you from the back.

Let's see how it goes.
 
#20
Let's be honest, no matter how you look at it, it doesn't make any sense. This can't be the exact moment Kaido went hybrid form for what they say in the latest chapter but the 5SN can't even be able to hold two emperors for a bunch of minutes. Human Kaido destroyed the scabbards (sulong dukes included) and oneshotted G4 Luffy at the beginning of Wano, and that Luffy is clearly above any version of the other 4 supernova.

Now they are against hybrid Kaido and Big Mom, can you imagine thinking hakiless Luffy, no asura Zoro, Kid, Killer and Law are so much stronger than 18 scabbards (twice the emperors, twice the scabbards)?


If it were 5v1 with the SN not having to worry about BM Kaido would be fucked.
:gokulaugh:


BM is going elsewhere, they are going down to Kaido alone. Then the other fighters are going to help them.
 
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