Speculations Was Rocks D. Xebec betrayed/abandoned his subordinates in God Valley?

[Extravlad]

We are first explicitly told by Sengoku that most of the members of the ROCKS Pirates could NOT stand each other. They weren't friends and didn't like each other at all, which could imply that they refused to help each other out including their captain in the face of adversity

Spoiler

Secondly we have Whitebeard who comments on what happens when "a bunch of guys who can't serve under someone" are lumped together, and he says "never again"

Spoiler

Whitebeard clearly implies that ROCKS wasn't able to command enough RESPECT for his subordinates to listen to him, they were too wild and wouldn't take orders from him.

Was Rocks betrayed? Indirectly? Directly? Did he lose fair and square?

 

[Gargo]

If he was not for Kaidou having so much esteem for Rocks, I would think that Rocks was possibly a joke character like Buggy the Clown.

But he was probably very strong.
The difference between him and Kaidou is that Rocks was probably just slightly stronger than Big Mom, Kaidou, Whitebeard and Shiki ( each of them got different morals ) while Kaidou is far stronger than King and Queen.

I don't think Kaidou, Shiki and Big Mom betrayed him. They were planning something big with their captain.

Probably that Whitebeard did not really fight ( like Mihawk in Marineford ), and that Garp and Roger were just that strong.

🐦👁️😑

 

[I'mTired]

I think the fight was a pretty close call for both side but Roger's and Garp's teams just had a better hand at teamwork as a result of them facing each other many times. Like when you clash with someone for so long to call them your rival then you'd be accustomed to how the other party fights.

On the other hand as told by Oda through various characters, Rocks Pirate was one hot mess of a crew, where they'd try to kill their mates just because. So ye involuntary sabotage by the crew dynamics for me.

 

[vikas]

They probably chose to not get involved maybe after some clashes, we know they were not a loyal crew or anything, interests did not lie in that fight so they may not have fought, it is posible BM and weak kaido might have tried to back him up, but BM probably chose save others or maybe rocks himself might have told to leave him. We know BM gave kaido the DF at that time and it probably played important role in kaidos survival, she even said she saw him as a little brother, pretty rare for someone who only thinks of blood relatives as family.

 

[Just a member]

It is also implied they are just like BB crew and when they appeared at Marineford they clearly suggested that if BB failed to take WB's gura gura they would have disbanded aka if you show any weakness, if your crew mates smell blood, you will be attacked.

So it could have just been that the 2 crews (3 considering Roger+Garp vs Xebec) were fighting evenly but when Roger and Garp were about to win / had win over Xebec the whole crew escaped (maybe while laughing like the BB vs Akainu moment), it is also possible it was indeed a Xebec crewmate to kill him. But while this sits well with guys like BM, Kaido etc. It doesn't with WB, maybe he fought along with Xebec vs Garp amd Roger until he could or he witnessed so much atrocities that decided to switch sides or simply not help Xebec or something like that.

 

[Red Admiral]

even if Shiki and Prime Beard didn't had their DF yet (VERY FUCKING UNLIKELY)

Roger ~ Xebec
Shiki + WB + Big Mom > Garp

WITHOUT A DOUBT
and Rocks Pirates still had many more big name on their side so don't bring me Ray won the war argument

so even in a nightmare case for Rocks Pirates ... they still should've win

both Kaido and Prime Beard stated their last crew had too many strong people and it caused major problems
people need to be really ignorant to assume Roger and Garp won fairly


Rocks crew failed to function as a team
I'm guessing Prime Beard betrayed him
Shiki , Big Mom and Kaido abandoned him when shit got dark
so
Rocks lost a 1 Vs 2 fight

 

[Date]

Since Law and Luffy formed the Alliance the theme of "pirate alliances end in betray" has been present in the story, i wouldnt doubt that Rocks end was because the crew betrayed him, would for very well if all this theme that have been part of most of the New World.

 

[Blackbeard]

The implications make it very obvious that they didn't fight seriously alongside him at God Valley.

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

Xebec probably got betrayed by his own crewmates.

 

[Luffy bin Dragon]

 

[Celestial D. Dragon]

It is also implied they are just like BB crew and when they appeared at Marineford they clearly suggested that if BB failed to take WB's gura gura they would have disbanded aka if you show any weakness, if your crew mates smell blood, you will be attacked.

So it could have just been that the 2 crews (3 considering Roger+Garp vs Xebec) were fighting evenly but when Roger and Garp were about to win / had win over Xebec the whole crew escaped (maybe while laughing like the BB vs Akainu moment), it is also possible it was indeed a Xebec crewmate to kill him. But while this sits well with guys like BM, Kaido etc. It doesn't with WB, maybe he fought along with Xebec vs Garp amd Roger until he could or he witnessed so much atrocities that decided to switch sides or simply not help Xebec or something like that.

I'm fairly positive they just meant if BB failed to consume two devil fruits, he would die, and that it would be the end of the Blackbeard Pirates. Not that if he failed to eat two devil fruits that means he's weak.

As far as Rocks being betrayed or abandoned, it's possible, but I would rather that not be the case. If he wasn't charismatic and strong enough in the first place, he wouldn't have all those people as subordinates. They might have not gotten along, but whatever the case may be, Rocks seemed to keep them together somehow. It'd be rather underwhelming if the only reason he lost was because he was betrayed in the end. Would be a pretty shitty way for Roger's "Greatest Foe" to have gone down imo.

 

[Tejas]

LMAO, ExtravLLLad literally shot himself in the leg going by the poll results

 

[Just a member]

I'm fairly positive they just meant if BB failed to consume two devil fruits, he would die, and that it would be the end of the Blackbeard Pirates. Not that if he failed to eat two devil fruits that means he's weak.

As far as Rocks being betrayed or abandoned, it's possible, but I would rather that not be the case. If he wasn't charismatic and strong enough in the first place, he wouldn't have all those people as subordinates. They might have not gotten along, but whatever the case may be, Rocks seemed to keep them together somehow. It'd be rather underwhelming if the only reason he lost was because he was betrayed in the end. Would be a pretty shitty way for Roger's "Greatest Foe" to have gone down imo.

As I see it that crew was a tank of sharks where the biggest one ruled over the others (even if regardless they were ruthless and fighting among themselves, they most likely never tried Xebec simply because he was not even reachable, same as nobody going vs old WB for his title despite everuthing). It is possible (one theory among many others, it is not this has any particular weight but like the others it is still possible given the characters we are discussing) that after Xebec fought with Garp and Roger he somewhat managed to escape at the end (or even spared if Oda plays by his usual book) and at that moment a young Kaido or BM could have found an heavily injured Xebec and instead of helping he/she finished the job. Then if Oda does this there should be a meaning behind it (like underline even more the predatory behavior of this crew) but at the moment I either don't see why Oda should play this gray area of the story in this way (yet it is possible even if not probable it was like this among many other theories).

For sure Oda will not rob Roger and Garp's greatest glory (probably, for Garp for sure at least at this point) to make shine WB (he already shines enough with the Roger comparison) or young Kaido and Linlin, they have their own hype as well coming from other sources and that is already enough imo.

 

[Roronoa-sama]

roger, garp and ray>>rocks pirates

 

[SakazOuki]

Traitorbeard definitely took off
That's why he was hesitant when Ace wanted to go after Blackbeard, he knew his history

 

[thedarkdragon11]

Leaning towards the third poll option...

 

[Finalbeta]

Maybe they left his crew too soon yeah