Questions & Mysteries Why Kaido Didn’t Put Rayleigh (Also Figarland) in His List?

Why Kaido didn't put Prime Rayleigh in his list?


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#1
We know Kaido knew Roger's power from Xebec fights,



So Kaido considers Roger's power at the top alongside with Whitebeard.

There is no way Rayleigh didn't play a huge part in this battle, they still were already heavily outnumbered against the Rocks Pirates, even with Garp's and other marines help, logically thinking, Rayleigh should've played a huge part in this battle, but Kaido puts Oden in his list,



Where the people who can fight equally with him but not Prime Rayleigh,



If we assume that Kaido was only talking about the ''pirates'' since it was Luffy that he was facing, and Luffy is a pirate, and he was talking about the how high Luffy's ceiling will go as a pirate, then puttting a marine like Garp wouldn't be necessary, so that can be made up as an excuse. But there is absolutely no excuse for Prime Rayleigh to be not there.

We know how famous Rayleigh was;



Even an Admiral isn't enough to capture an Old Rayleigh; they needed more than 1 Admiral + ''certain preparations'' for capturing Old Rayleigh.



Kizaru: ''But if we tried to capture you here... Even we would need to make certain preparations...''

As for the people who were saying that Big mom isn't in that list too, at that moment, Big mom was Kaido's ally and official partner, not even his underling, she was not his opponent/enemy, so it's not necessary for Kaido to put Big mom in that list when Kaido himself accepted Big mom's power by agreeing her offer to join forces as ''equals'' after fighting with her for 3 days. So it was obvious that Big mom was his equal. There was no need for more hype about Big mom already and as I said, she was his ally at the moment, so this can be an excuse for her lack of absence in Kaido's list.

As for Blackbeard not being in that list, I think it's obvious that Blackbeard and Kaido never fought, so of course he wouldn't consider Blackbeard in his own list, if he never see Yonko Blackbeard fighting.

But, Kaido should've seen Rayleigh, when Roger pirates fought Rocks Pirates at the God Valley incident, so for me this is a big disrespect for Rayleigh, even though Oden might be slightly stronger than Rayleigh, the difference shouldn't be big enough.

If we think about ''no underling'' rule, then again, Oden was an underling for Whitebeard, but then when Oden faced Kaido, Oden was no longer an underling of Whitebeard, even though WB pirates didn't put anyone on 2nd division leadership for years because they considered the fact Oden could return.

But Oda still can make an excuse for this,

What if Rayleigh, and other Roger pirates like Gaban fought the other pirates that Sengoku mentioned? While Roger and Garp + other marines were fighting Kaido, Big mom, Xebec and Whitebeard?



If Rayleigh and the rest of the Roger pirates fought these guys (Shiki, Silver Axe, Captain John, Wang Zhi), + Big mom too, then Kaido might not know how powerful Rayleigh is.

So the match-ups could be;

-Roger, Garp + marine forces vs. Xebec, Whitebeard and Kaido
-Rayleigh, Gaban + rest of the Roger pirates vs. Big mom, Shiki, Silver Axe, Captain John, Wang Zhi

Then Kaido not adding Rayleigh in his list would make sense since he never fought Prime Rayleigh, or see how powerful Rayleigh was.

What's your opinion about Prime Rayleigh not being in Kaido's list but Oden is?

Edit: Another new Question is, Kaido should possibly know how powerful Holy Knight Leader Figarland as well since they invaded Figarland's God Valley, same question for Figarland.

 
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TheKnightOfTheSea

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#3
I don't think they fought/interacted in God Valley. Kaido was an apprentice back then, probably only in his late teens and without his devil fruit. Rayleigh is the first mate of the Roger Pirates, Garp called him a legend and even an admiral struggled to get past him. Rayleigh wouldn't fight a small fry like young Kaido. It would be like if Oden fought Buggy. Rayleigh probably took on Shiki or Big Mom.

Besides, Rayleigh really doesn't really have a connection to Kaido, like other strong characters who were excluded from from the "Ceiling" panel.

IMO Kaido > Prime Rayleigh >> Prime Oden.
 
#9
Kaido most likely placed Oden instead of Rayleigh due a subjective perception based off what he had experienced compared to what he presumably had failed to experienced about Prime Rayleigh.

Overall he doesn't place Marines also and this in all likelihood means he was referring to the Grand Pirates here.
I think 99% of people are reading that panel wrong tho, I just think that Oda put them there as a symbol, not Kaido seeing them.
 
#10
KAIDO, although he was a newbie and got his DF on the same day of the confrontation, Kaido not recognized Rayleigh as superior, as you demonstrated, Rayleigh is a person of popular knowledge, is even in the books, and kaido for sure when he is going to make his TOP , of people he considers strong in terms of equality, he logically takes into account all the great figures (great pirates) and Rayleigh was not someone that KAIDO wanted to include, and this is quite embarrassing for Rayleigh and even for SHIKI and the others members of the ROCKS, so much so that 20 years ago, Kaido mentions the powerful pirates, and Rayleigh is not included, remembering, these were the pirates that KAIDO considered powerful 20 years ago, and that logically had the same trait of "kindness, softness", and Ryaligh may not fit this role, and you can use that as an argument against.

So like this, ODEN he was only on Roger and WB's ship for pure plot, at some point he would get on a ship, because he had the 0 talent to sail, and needed to make Roger the Pk.
And on top of that, he was the SHOGUN of a country, so he didn't just have a boat and a person to serve as Rayleigh, he had a place to go back and a country to govern.
Rayleigh spent his whole life in Roger's skirt.
So there is no reason why KAIDO is putting RAYLEIGH, if the great figure of the ship is always the captain.
 
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#15
There is no way Rayleigh didn't play a huge part in this battle, they still were already heavily outnumbered against the Rocks Pirates, even with Garp's and other marines help, logically thinking, Rayleigh should've played a huge part in this battle, but Kaido puts Oden in his list,
Because Rayleigh wasn't strong enough for Kaido's list! Sure, I'm sure Rayleigh and Scopper Gaban fought against Wang Zi and Silver axe, and it actually makes sense since one of them is a swordsmen while the other is using axe–just like Gaban.


And we also know that someone scarred Rayleigh, and that someone had to be a strong enough swordsmen to be able to pull that off. But, Rayleigh wasn't strong enough for Kaido, Meme and especially Whitbeard.
Kizaru: ''But if we tried to capture you here... Even we would need to make certain preparations...''
Because back then they were at war with Whitbeard, they needed all their Admirals to be in Marinford at standby. In order to capture Rayleigh you need an Admiral, that means that they have to send an Admiral to fight against Rayleigh, but they can't since Whitbeard was on his way to free/save Ace. What Kizaru means there, is that they need to change their plans if they want to capture Rayleigh.
But, Kaido should've seen Rayleigh, when Roger pirates fought Rocks Pirates at the God Valley incident, so for me this is a big disrespect for Rayleigh, even though Oden might be slightly stronger than Rayleigh, the difference shouldn't be big enough.
The difference is big! Whitbeard had only Oden in his crew, unlike Roger who also had Scopper Gaban on top of Rayleigh. Oden by himself was spoused to compensate the absence of the second strongest for Scopper Gaban, and hence, he was made strong enough to be able to fight against both Rayleigh and Scopper Gaban.

We can actually see Rayleigh and Scopper Gaban teaming up against Oden after seeing him in action and sensing his haki. On top of that, Roger himself stopped them from fighting against Oden since they would be harmed if they continued. Also, Oden didn't react to Rayleigh or Gaban, he wasn't impressed at all, while in comparison he reacted to Roger saying "I sense a beast."
 
#17
..... saying prime Rayleigh is not strong enough just doesn't make sense.
And yes he used advanced CoC against Marco. He stopped Marco's attack without touching him.... You need to re-read the chapters for the fight between WB crew and Rogers crew.
no that was obviously Ryu aka Ad.CoA not CoC
chapters are really empty and show NOTHING important ... anime showed much more ... and he used Ad.CoA

Oden is a Shogun of Wano ... it make sense for him to grow beyond right hand man of Prime Beard

Oden > Dark King
 
#18
no that was obviously Ryu aka Ad.CoA not CoC
chapters are really empty and show NOTHING important ... anime showed much more ... and he used Ad.CoA

Oden is a Shogun of Wano ... it make sense for him to grow beyond right hand man of Prime Beard

Oden > Dark King
nope. Ryuo is an attack amplifier. No one ever blocks an attack with Ryuo.
and most importantly, buggy has stated that Bullet = only to Rayleigh in Rogers's crew.
So that automatically makes Ray > Oden.
 
#20
nope. Ryuo is an attack amplifier. No one ever blocks an attack with Ryuo.
and most importantly, buggy has stated that Bullet = only to Rayleigh in Rogers's crew.
So that automatically makes Ray > Oden.
dude

1- he said "when he was part of the crew" he was equal to Dark King
2- Bullet was a member of Roger pirates 4 years before Oden joined (or 3)
3- an 18 years old Bullet with no DF being equal to Prime Dark King ain't helping Dark King's hype
4- Bullet is fucking filler

so this argument of yours is DEAD ...

if you have any PANEL or even ANIME to prove Dark King have Ad.CoC show it please
 
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