Controversial One Piece's Politics
- Thread starter Monkey D. Luffy
- Start date
This is highly debatable. There is also no set direction a swastika has to face. It also has the same meaning as a swastika. Good fortune/luck/auspiciousness. Historically both symbols are used in the same way. There is no good reason to differentiate.
I did not write that. Oda implies that the winners were not necessarily the good guys.
The smartest person in the manga can not tell which side was right or wrong.
The opinion around the OP world is that pirates (JoyBoys faction) were evil. Now we learned that its ambiguous or straight up bullshit.
In the same way its a very infantile way to view world history in terms of evil and good.
I did not write that. Oda implies that the winners were not necessarily the good guys.
The smartest person in the manga can not tell which side was right or wrong.
The opinion around the OP world is that pirates (JoyBoys faction) were evil. Now we learned that its ambiguous or straight up bullshit.
In the same way its a very infantile way to view world history in terms of evil and good.
There is a problem with your poll. Woke/leftist radical people are the political ennemies of liberals.
In other word the third sentence should not be "No, but there are liberal values also" but "Yes, but there are liberal valu also" which is what One Piece really is. There are indeed woke stuff, but there are liberal values also, hence why it's so big in term of range of audience.
But I'm surprised that your thread was accepted.
I won't complain tho
In other word the third sentence should not be "No, but there are liberal values also" but "Yes, but there are liberal valu also" which is what One Piece really is. There are indeed woke stuff, but there are liberal values also, hence why it's so big in term of range of audience.
But I'm surprised that your thread was accepted.
I won't complain tho
Morj made a video about this a long time ago. He does a much better job explaining his reasoning than I ever could, so if you're interested you should give it a watch.
That being said, if you can't distinguish between having good monarchs in a high-fantasy setting and Oda's real opinion about monarchy then idk what to tell you. It's clear that Oda does idealize a world of equal opportunity that guarantees basic necessities such as food, housing, etc.
One Piece is also massively anti-racist.
That being said, if you can't distinguish between having good monarchs in a high-fantasy setting and Oda's real opinion about monarchy then idk what to tell you. It's clear that Oda does idealize a world of equal opportunity that guarantees basic necessities such as food, housing, etc.
One Piece is also massively anti-racist.
I agree with that. That's also why Illogiko made this comment during the great glitch:
I have never seen this video. I'm impressed that someone picked up the meritocratic and libertarian aspect of One Piece. Morj is very strong when it come to analysis.
And indeed One Piece is massively on the progressive spectrum. Now, I don't fully agree with the analysis of Morj.
I often say that Oda is woke, but that's not really the case in reality. You could say that Oda is more of an idealist that never made the full transition toward materialism, he proposes a lot of very coherent materialist beliefs about the world (those things can be seen during Fishmen Island but overall in many flashbacks and their consequences of people) but he also show a very liberatarian and meritocratic vision of seeing the world. A libertarianism strictly based on values but still here.
Oda might indeed propose the vision of an idealist world where both visions coexist but I got reserves on the the complete analysis. Because while yes I agree that Oda promotes a fairer society on lands without class, he is still individualizing and thus depoliticizing the problem.
This is one of the limit I have with One Piece as a political story. And we have to ask ourselves the viability of the vision proposed.
Elections are one things, but electing a good king doesn't change the problem of ressources in the hands of the few, the propriety of the means of production and therefore the presence of class of citizens.
At the same time and in reverse, while Morj talks about a meritocratic and libertarian societies on the sea, what we see most of the time are real anarchic groups of society. The strawhats for example are an exemple of horizontal hierarchy (yes, even if Luffy is the captain).
So the question we have to ask ourselve is "is a world where everyone can choose their own path for society viable ?". I'd say yes, at two conditions that:
- Those vision of society are clearly separated by long distances
- There are NO link or interactions between those societies.
Because - and now we have to look at the reality of those systems - a libertarian society and an anarchic one (I'm considering that we moved passed communism) are different not only because they are different vision of the economy of the social values but because they are also perfectly antagonistic to each others by nature.
With what we know of meritocracy and liberatarianism, we understand that those society, while exciting, are also very dangerous, very unstable and completely inequal on ALL sides. Some people will be treated poorly or worse and other will have all the wealth. And the ratio will most likely be 99.5 to 0.5.
No one, aside from the 0.5 who will have all the wealth, will want to remain in such society, even if it's exciting. MEritocracy is just not viable on the very long term.
This means also that any interaction with a completely equal and classless society would result in a war and the destruction of both system. The solution is therefore to avoid creating such libertarian society to begin with.
The idea that such system can coexist is therefore perfectly idealistic. It's a nice thought, but we must not take it as a solution for our world.
But it's ok, overall, One Piece has great ideas.
Right ? In a place where Royalty is hegemonic, it should be easy to get democracy... right ?
And indeed One Piece is massively on the progressive spectrum. Now, I don't fully agree with the analysis of Morj.
I often say that Oda is woke, but that's not really the case in reality. You could say that Oda is more of an idealist that never made the full transition toward materialism, he proposes a lot of very coherent materialist beliefs about the world (those things can be seen during Fishmen Island but overall in many flashbacks and their consequences of people) but he also show a very liberatarian and meritocratic vision of seeing the world. A libertarianism strictly based on values but still here.
Oda might indeed propose the vision of an idealist world where both visions coexist but I got reserves on the the complete analysis. Because while yes I agree that Oda promotes a fairer society on lands without class, he is still individualizing and thus depoliticizing the problem.
This is one of the limit I have with One Piece as a political story. And we have to ask ourselves the viability of the vision proposed.
Elections are one things, but electing a good king doesn't change the problem of ressources in the hands of the few, the propriety of the means of production and therefore the presence of class of citizens.
At the same time and in reverse, while Morj talks about a meritocratic and libertarian societies on the sea, what we see most of the time are real anarchic groups of society. The strawhats for example are an exemple of horizontal hierarchy (yes, even if Luffy is the captain).
So the question we have to ask ourselve is "is a world where everyone can choose their own path for society viable ?". I'd say yes, at two conditions that:
- Those vision of society are clearly separated by long distances
- There are NO link or interactions between those societies.
Because - and now we have to look at the reality of those systems - a libertarian society and an anarchic one (I'm considering that we moved passed communism) are different not only because they are different vision of the economy of the social values but because they are also perfectly antagonistic to each others by nature.
With what we know of meritocracy and liberatarianism, we understand that those society, while exciting, are also very dangerous, very unstable and completely inequal on ALL sides. Some people will be treated poorly or worse and other will have all the wealth. And the ratio will most likely be 99.5 to 0.5.
No one, aside from the 0.5 who will have all the wealth, will want to remain in such society, even if it's exciting. MEritocracy is just not viable on the very long term.
This means also that any interaction with a completely equal and classless society would result in a war and the destruction of both system. The solution is therefore to avoid creating such libertarian society to begin with.
The idea that such system can coexist is therefore perfectly idealistic. It's a nice thought, but we must not take it as a solution for our world.
But it's ok, overall, One Piece has great ideas.
