Controversial General Political Discussion
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@Elder Lee Hung
To reply to your post
>>
1 -
While in Nazism there is an essentialist belief about a master race in which some people are born better than others, the Nazi ideologie also has an extrem (and rigged) form of meritocracy in place for the members within the state.
There is a glorification of the figure of perfect citizen for the movement. A system that is meant to give incentive to all to rise above the rest and atteint perfection. It is, of course, a complete scam to push people to justify the system and will turn against them the moment they divert. You can see that in the show Invincible for ex.
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In One Piece, Haki is far more complex that something you "have" and something you "don't have". In reality, and this chapters shows it very well : Haki is a manifestation of one's will and presence. This means that conqueror Haki can be created if your will is strong enough.
The real question that you must ask yourself is : are will and presences things that characters in One Piece are born with ?
- Presence ? Yes. All things in One Piece have a presence, it is the result of life. But a presence is just a presence, it doesn't means it strong on get go.
- Will ? No. Noone is born with a strong "will" in One Piece (and in real life too).
Does this mean that some people are born with a stronger haki on birth ? From my interpretation, NO. But they are all potentially born with Haki indeed. This also means that all characters are born with the POTENTIAL to develop said Haki and make it stronger.
But not all people live a life that can unlock it.
For most characters, a strong will and presence (Haki) requires pure confidence. So.. Why do you think Aisa developped a strong observation haki ? The answer is in the details:
Aisa is a children of war. She lived all her life worrying about her people going to war and said war impacting her own safety. When a child live in a context where conflict (hardcore or just interpersonnal) is omnipresent, they develop a form of hyper perception of their environment that can allow them detect any rise of conflictuality and any form of animosity. Sometimes so triggering that it will make them even jump in the middle of the conflict to stop the fight. They might also be better at reading others and sensing their presence through subtle shift of pressure, noise or smell. They will also have an attraction for conflicts themselves. I should know. This is how I grew up.
Haki, in One Piece can be seen a basic form of materialist take on the results of the condition of growth of a person impacted by the idealist belief of the presence of a "will" that trenscends matter. So you'll get - as it is fashion in One Piece - a bit of both. Haki will start to develop outside of the will of the character (Aisa, Koby) BUT it will be impacted the presence of said "will" and "presence". (the Haki of Luffy for ex).
Now, I said that for most people haki (will+presence) required a strong confidence. But I believe that what this chapter proves and overall what Zoro's character arc in One Piece proves... is that presence and will can be impacted by obsination and perserverance too.
Zoro always question himself. Like Sanji, he is always pushing himself down, thinking that he is never enough (I explained why in details in other threads). But he also have spikes of strenght and growth, which is why is Haki is always oscilating. Sometimes strong, sometimes low. As you can see, he will develop King's Haki despite of that. Mostly because his will and presence are not based on his confidence, but his obstination to keep a promise. That's why Zoro could develop Haki so early.
His obstination is overpowering himself is what makes Zoro so strong but also what pushes him in a constant state of anxiety. Something that will probably only be resolved at the end of the story. (melontee made a great video about that)
So no, One Piece is not fascist, that would be a very poor level reading of then story. Characters are not born strong in One Piece (outside of the few random exceptions and evolutionnary anomalies like Big Mom or Oden). Characters are born with the potential for becoming strong and getting strong haki, presence and will in a world that can trigger all of them at any moments.
To reply to your post
>>
1 -
While in Nazism there is an essentialist belief about a master race in which some people are born better than others, the Nazi ideologie also has an extrem (and rigged) form of meritocracy in place for the members within the state.
There is a glorification of the figure of perfect citizen for the movement. A system that is meant to give incentive to all to rise above the rest and atteint perfection. It is, of course, a complete scam to push people to justify the system and will turn against them the moment they divert. You can see that in the show Invincible for ex.
2 -
In One Piece, Haki is far more complex that something you "have" and something you "don't have". In reality, and this chapters shows it very well : Haki is a manifestation of one's will and presence. This means that conqueror Haki can be created if your will is strong enough.
The real question that you must ask yourself is : are will and presences things that characters in One Piece are born with ?
- Presence ? Yes. All things in One Piece have a presence, it is the result of life. But a presence is just a presence, it doesn't means it strong on get go.
- Will ? No. Noone is born with a strong "will" in One Piece (and in real life too).
Does this mean that some people are born with a stronger haki on birth ? From my interpretation, NO. But they are all potentially born with Haki indeed. This also means that all characters are born with the POTENTIAL to develop said Haki and make it stronger.
But not all people live a life that can unlock it.
For most characters, a strong will and presence (Haki) requires pure confidence. So.. Why do you think Aisa developped a strong observation haki ? The answer is in the details:
Aisa is a children of war. She lived all her life worrying about her people going to war and said war impacting her own safety. When a child live in a context where conflict (hardcore or just interpersonnal) is omnipresent, they develop a form of hyper perception of their environment that can allow them detect any rise of conflictuality and any form of animosity. Sometimes so triggering that it will make them even jump in the middle of the conflict to stop the fight. They might also be better at reading others and sensing their presence through subtle shift of pressure, noise or smell. They will also have an attraction for conflicts themselves. I should know. This is how I grew up.
Haki, in One Piece can be seen a basic form of materialist take on the results of the condition of growth of a person impacted by the idealist belief of the presence of a "will" that trenscends matter. So you'll get - as it is fashion in One Piece - a bit of both. Haki will start to develop outside of the will of the character (Aisa, Koby) BUT it will be impacted the presence of said "will" and "presence". (the Haki of Luffy for ex).
Now, I said that for most people haki (will+presence) required a strong confidence. But I believe that what this chapter proves and overall what Zoro's character arc in One Piece proves... is that presence and will can be impacted by obsination and perserverance too.
Zoro always question himself. Like Sanji, he is always pushing himself down, thinking that he is never enough (I explained why in details in other threads). But he also have spikes of strenght and growth, which is why is Haki is always oscilating. Sometimes strong, sometimes low. As you can see, he will develop King's Haki despite of that. Mostly because his will and presence are not based on his confidence, but his obstination to keep a promise. That's why Zoro could develop Haki so early.
His obstination is overpowering himself is what makes Zoro so strong but also what pushes him in a constant state of anxiety. Something that will probably only be resolved at the end of the story. (melontee made a great video about that)
So no, One Piece is not fascist, that would be a very poor level reading of then story. Characters are not born strong in One Piece (outside of the few random exceptions and evolutionnary anomalies like Big Mom or Oden). Characters are born with the potential for becoming strong and getting strong haki, presence and will in a world that can trigger all of them at any moments.
That’s not how Oda defines CoC in the manga is it? In the manga you have to be born with CoC no? How is this not a geneticist writing decision? Oda wrote a manga where truly exceptional people are simply born, and if you aren’t born with CoC, you will never stand among the strongest characters in the series. Unless Oda makes it to where people born without CoC can also become that strong, which doesn’t look likely at the present lol.
We need to be careful not to confuse what the characters or Oda say and what the story say. A character might say "only a person in a million are born with the quality of a king" or "you can't work on your King's haki", but it is only real in context of their ignorance of what it takes to be "a King" in the One Piece world and the hardship that come with it.
In reality, the story shows that Haki developps through pressure, even King's Haki. The story do not completely exclude the possibility for Haki to be favorized through genetic markers passed down generations (after all, Ace developped King's Haki a lot faster than other characters in OP). It's possible that while all characters are born with it, some are born with the capacity to developp it faster than others.
But it is only a potential. If said potential is never triggered, it won't work. There might be some evolutionnary anomalies here and there but the story makes a point (especially in this chapter) in telling us that conqueror Haki can grow with the presence. The more will, the more presence, and the more presence, the more haki.
Ace was already a highly willed boy when he developped Haki. He was already battling with himself and the laugh of others. He had to build condidence at a very early age. At one point, his own brother was about to get murdered. This created an immense pressure and his only solution at the time, was for his will and presence to stop the situation, he had no other alternative. So his Haki bloomed.
Like most things in One Piece, characters are more than just boxes of will, they are the result of their material conditions. Which is why Haki is so interesting. It mixes the idealist right wing idea of the will, with the real life materialists notion of environmental pressure to create something in between.
In One Piece, pressure creates strenght.
Haki is a direct results of the intense environment that is the new world and the strong will for people to survive in said environment. But it is also the result of the idea that those who have enough obstination and will to survive will keep growing, those who don't will not.
Now, you could question the ideology of will itself. "is will real?" and to that a materialist like me will tell you : "No, it is not". It more complex. So there is indeed a point of critic to have of One Piece about this idealistic notion. but this is something that can be said about pretty much all stories on the planet. One Piece is actually on the lower end as it is partly materialist too.
Meritocracy does not exist, we can't really become better because we wish to be, and we don't really have a will. We are the product of our environemental pressure which can be defined as our "material conditions of existence". This is pretty much it. You won't bend matter or make people pass out just with your spirit in this universe, maybe in another, but not ours.
So no, One Piece is not fascist.
In reality, the story shows that Haki developps through pressure, even King's Haki. The story do not completely exclude the possibility for Haki to be favorized through genetic markers passed down generations (after all, Ace developped King's Haki a lot faster than other characters in OP). It's possible that while all characters are born with it, some are born with the capacity to developp it faster than others.
But it is only a potential. If said potential is never triggered, it won't work. There might be some evolutionnary anomalies here and there but the story makes a point (especially in this chapter) in telling us that conqueror Haki can grow with the presence. The more will, the more presence, and the more presence, the more haki.
Ace was already a highly willed boy when he developped Haki. He was already battling with himself and the laugh of others. He had to build condidence at a very early age. At one point, his own brother was about to get murdered. This created an immense pressure and his only solution at the time, was for his will and presence to stop the situation, he had no other alternative. So his Haki bloomed.
Like most things in One Piece, characters are more than just boxes of will, they are the result of their material conditions. Which is why Haki is so interesting. It mixes the idealist right wing idea of the will, with the real life materialists notion of environmental pressure to create something in between.
In One Piece, pressure creates strenght.
Haki is a direct results of the intense environment that is the new world and the strong will for people to survive in said environment. But it is also the result of the idea that those who have enough obstination and will to survive will keep growing, those who don't will not.
Now, you could question the ideology of will itself. "is will real?" and to that a materialist like me will tell you : "No, it is not". It more complex. So there is indeed a point of critic to have of One Piece about this idealistic notion. but this is something that can be said about pretty much all stories on the planet. One Piece is actually on the lower end as it is partly materialist too.
Meritocracy does not exist, we can't really become better because we wish to be, and we don't really have a will. We are the product of our environemental pressure which can be defined as our "material conditions of existence". This is pretty much it. You won't bend matter or make people pass out just with your spirit in this universe, maybe in another, but not ours.
So no, One Piece is not fascist.
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