Worstgen

Cinera

> just goes to show that in Oda’s world, there is Never a Self Made Woman.

Yeah, Oda is really sexist. This is one of my major grievances with One Piece (it's also part of why Monet, Yamato and Ulti were relatively breaths of fresh air).

Cinera

Oda's story is pretty steepled in anachronistic, chauvinistic and sexist stereotypes.

Den_Den_Mushi

Chopper had agency, he went off and tried to cure Hiruluk on his own. Brook got stuck in TB for years but before that, he was briefly the captain of the Rumbar Pirates. That means something. Sanji’s backstory is another generic sad daddy beat me backstory but his attempts to cook and feed animals was his own way of exercising agency against Judge.

Den_Den_Mushi

I don’t think either befriending Ace or destroying the statue were meaningful choices. Nothing came of it and they meant nothing in the end. Is she different in any way because of what happened? Not really, she just put her faith in a different set of princes to rescue her.

Den_Den_Mushi

I don’t find her so-called attempts to fight back an exercise of agency either. We see nothing, it’s just what we’re told and she’s accomplished nothing. She’s embodying the definition of insanity by doing the same thing over and over again and achieving the same result.

Den_Den_Mushi

Again, Yamato is not a character. A character is someone who exists independent of the MCs and whose character exists beyond their relationship with other established characters. Who is Yamato without the straw hats? Oden cosplayer and Laido’s daughter. That’s it. Nothing else. Rebecca is the undefeated woman, Hancock is empress, Yamato is nothing.

Den_Den_Mushi

Sanji not having the greatest agency is due to his age. Brook had a whole life before the TB incident we don’t know about and was briefly captain. Yamato has spent her whole entire life achieving zip zero nada. Brook, Sanji and Chopper also exist beyond their relationships to Luffy and their families. Hell we don’t even know Chopper’s or Brook’s parents, and Sanji’s parents were hidden until very recently.

Den_Den_Mushi

Also Yamato joining bad boy to wreck one of Daddy’s ornaments is... not what I’d call anything. It’s... nothing. It’s just nothing. Of all the character moments that have defined and shaped other characters in the series; that is by far the most pathetic. I’m supposed to think of this as carthatic? No I don’t.

Den_Den_Mushi

Ace’s character works since he was introduced not as Roger’s son, he had his own little plotline with Blackbeard that had nothing to do with the crew, and his relationship with his famous father was actually deconstructed properly. Ace is a decent ‘son of X’ character. Yamato is not.

Den_Den_Mushi

It’s ok to be inspired by another character, but Yamato takes it far beyond the pale of acceptability. She’s obnoxious, inauthentic and can’t even method act straight, saying things like oh I’m Oden so i can call Momo my son. Like wtf? Luffy is inspired by Shanks but he wanted to be a pirate even before he met Shanks. He doesn’t pretend to be Shanks and without Shanks he’s more than Luffy, son of Dragon.

Den_Den_Mushi

Also I don’t think Brook is a character for the record. He is nothing. Not even a fan service device. Just nothing. Replace him with a robot that mindlessly repeats skull and panty jokes and there’s no difference. His dream is a meaningless token, he has no character struggles or anything that gets treated remotely like a growth opportunity by the plot. He’s nothing.

Den_Den_Mushi

The ‘I’m going to sit still and make token attempts to rebel against Daddy knowing someone else will save me’ is not a character. It’s a mishmash of tropes, archetypes and something that’s supposed to resemble character traits. Kind of like Kaido himself. He ain’t a character either. Just a stereotype and a confused ass one at that.

Den_Den_Mushi

I hate Ulti, so obnoxious and annoying as well. The Pay-Pay shtick is grating as hell. I think all the F6 are throwaway archetypes though. OP hasn’t had a decent minor antagonist for me in ages, at least not nearly on the level of CP9 or Hannyabal.

At the end of the day though, bad writers make bad characters. Oda sucks and that’s why his current characters are all Holdems and Urashimas and not Kakus and Luccis.

Cinera

> Is she different in any way because of what happened? Not really, she just put her faith in a different set of princes to rescue her.

@Den_Den_Mushi: I think so. Before she met Ace, she had given up on escaping. She had given up on getting to leave Wano and seeing the outside world. She was both physically and psychologically imprisoned. Ace removed the psychological shackles.

Cinera

If not for Ace, Yamato wouldn't even have been able to ask Luffy to remove her cuffs. She would have just accepted it as the way things are.

Cinera

Befriending Ace was the first major decision Yamato made IMO.

Cinera

Destroying Kaido's statue was the second. It signified her rejection of Kaido's authority and dominance over her. Kaido's statue was the symbol of his power and Yamato broke off its head.

Cinera

It reaffirmed Yamato's commitment to resist Kaido.

Den_Den_Mushi

If she really had given up on escaping, then she’s an even more pathetic character than I thought. So she’s gone 20 odd years achieving nothing, did nothing, needs someone else to come and say ‘aww poor babe, you can do it!’ Before that point in time she was an amorphous blob of zero life direction and utter uselessness.

Den_Den_Mushi

Like it’s just so pathetic. Destroying one piece of daddy’s stuff is a grand act of rebellion? Miss me with that. Being useless for 30 years when Ace in only one visit snuck into Onigashima to free kidnapped children? There were bad things going on in Onigashima and until Ace arrived she sat there derp useless sack of shit and did nothing.