Versus Battle Gaku Ki and Gekishin vs Ouki and Tou

[RayanOO]

The version of the characters are :

- Bayou Ouki
- Great General Tou / Current Tou
- Great General Gekishin when he fought against Houken
- Gaku Ki

They all have 50K standard army (we don't know Gaku Ki commanders so its unfair to given Ouki and Tou their named commanders).

Area : Shukai plains

@Fleet Admiral Lee Hung
@Owl Ki
@Blackbeard
@Patryipe
@Bullet
@Shanks
@Dark Admiral
@Guan Yu
@PuckTheGreat
@RayanOO
@Ninjashadow0209
@Arara
@Hiragaro
@Yo Tan Wa
@FaradaySloth
@ranady
@Dragomir
@Den_Den_Mushi
@Fiji
@Xione
@Jailer
@Bepo
@Desolate Smaug
@NidaiKitetsu
@Red Admiral
@Admiral Mou Bu

 

[Lee Ba Shou]

I’m fine to give it to Gakuki and Gekishin, extreme diff lol.

 

[Red Admiral]

it would be a hard fight for Gakuki cause he have a fake general with him :)

but he will win ...

 

[MarineHQ]

This can go either way. If we give both the same level of subordinates then Gakuki will have the upper hand because he seems like the best strategist out here but Tou and Ouki have superior individual might, especially Ouki.

Ouki was destroying Houken with his GG factor alone.

 

[Blackbeard]

it would be a hard fight for Gakuki cause he have a fake general with him :)

but he will win ...

To be fair though Gekishin was considered a 3 Heavens-candidate by Saitaku, he was just unlucky to face the god-tiers of both martial/tactical generals in the same army.

His battlefield insight and warfare experience allowed him to locate Riboku's HQ and stop his surprise ambush by solely observing his forces' movements while experienced trackers like the poison cats failed to. The narrator basically confirmed that Gekishin utilized a disadvantageous situation to his advantage which is the backbone of Gakuki's method.

Spoiler

Gekishin's background of slaying fodder Bushins is what made him arrogant enough to recklessly attack Houken who he thought was as strong as the weak path seekers he was used to stomp back in his village, with full intel he could have tried a hundred different strategies without charging by himself like a fool. Not saying he wouldn't have lost, but he wouldn't have lost that easily.

 

[Lee Ba Shou]

To be fair though Gekishin was considered a 3 Heavens-candidate by Saitaku, he was just unlucky to face the god-tiers of both martial/tactical generals in the same army.

His battlefield insight and warfare experience allowed him to locate Riboku's HQ and stop his surprise ambush by solely observing his forces' movements while experienced trackers like the poison cats failed to. The narrator basically confirmed that Gekishin utilized a disadvantageous situation to his advantage which is the backbone of Gakuki's method.

Spoiler

Gekishin's background of slaying fodder Bushins is what made him arrogant enough to recklessly attack Houken who he thought was as strong as the weak path seekers he was used to stomp back in his village, with full intel he could have tried a hundred different strategies without charging by himself like a fool. Not saying he wouldn't have lost, but he wouldn't have lose that easily.

My man Red still thinks Gaku Ki was tiers away from Gekishin when in reality they are about equal lol.

 

[Blackbeard]

My man Red still thinks Gaku Ki was tiers away from Gekishin when in reality they are about equal lol.

If there's indeed a difference, it lies within their personality which affects Hara's plot armor general weight, we know that with Gekishin's treacherous and greedy nature he's no burden to carry and is more like a full-time mercenary fighting for whomever pays more while historically, Gakuki seemingly cared about Yan since he only left the state when the new king demoted and forced him to leave just like how Toujou stripped Renpa of his rank. That's all about it lol.

 

[Red Admiral]

My man Red still thinks Gaku Ki was tiers away from Gekishin when in reality they are about equal lol.

yes ... so silly of me to think an A tier general isn't on same level as a SS ...

the only SS character who have highest numbers (equal to Ren Pa but Ren is S tier) and best achievement list in kingdom who is hailed by Kong Ming as top 2 of China history and a Military God (Kong Ming comment is part of Kingdom story as well not just history)

Gekishin is CEALRY comparable to Gaku Ki :yasu:

 

[Lee Ba Shou]

yes ... so silly of me to think an A tier general isn't on same level as a SS ...

These are experience stats, not strength stats lol.

the only SS character who have highest numbers (equal to Ren Pa but Ren is S tier) and best achievement list in kingdom who is hailed by Kong Ming as top 2 of China history and a Military God

None of this is canon though.

Gekishin is CEALRY comparable to Gaku Ki :yasu:

Gekishin literally used Gaku Ki’s exact style of warfare, so yes they are almost identical as generals, slight advantage to Gaku Ki.

Gekishin pushed Riboku to around a mid diff, Gaku Ki would push Riboku to about a high diff.

 

[MarineHQ]

Gekishin pushed Riboku to around a mid diff, Gaku Ki would push Riboku to about a high diff.

Would've loved to see what would've happened if Houken never intervened in that battle.

 

[Red Admiral]

Would've loved to see what would've happened if Houken never intervened in that battle.

Gaku ki tell us knowing the style and using it is not the same thing but some people don't get it somehow
And most likely riboku would run away

Post automatically merged: Jul 11, 2021

These are experience stats, not strength stats lol.



None of this is canon though.



Gekishin literally used Gaku Ki’s exact style of warfare, so yes they are almost identical as generals, slight advantage to Gaku Ki.

Gekishin pushed Riboku to around a mid diff, Gaku Ki would push Riboku to about a high diff.

LoL all of that is canon
And you have no right guessing what a SS tier man would have done after low diffing riboku plan ... Not to mention riboku would have lost without houken

He is just no match to military GOD

 

[RayanOO]

Gekishin maybe was better than he showed but he is not and never was Gaku ki equal

 

[Lee Ba Shou]

LoL all of that is canon

Not one ounce of what you said is canon lol. Kong Ming has never appeared within Kingdom or commented on any generals within, so I have no idea why you keep bringing this up.

And you have no right guessing what a SS tier man would have done after low diffing riboku plan ... Not to mention riboku would have lost without houken

In my experience, those who say “Riboku wouldn’t have won without Houken” lack imagination or basic understandings of Kingdom. Riboku had ac variety of tactics that he could’ve used to defeat Gekishin. Whether that be the Ryuudou, a retreat using Riboku’s fastest cavalry in China, or hell for all we know Riboku could’ve just straight up charged Gekishin and bested him 1v1 since Riboku’s actual fighting strength is still unknown and Gekishin is fearless aside from getting negged by Riboku’s subordinate.

And again Red, we do know what Gakuki would’ve done. Gekishin uses his exact tactics. Gakuki would’ve been bodied by Riboku just as Gekishin was.

He is just no match to military GOD

Whom Riboku was already confirmed to have surpassed by Ouki lol. Gakuki was a god of nothing and no one, King Shou got his title without even being a battlefield General.

Gakuki is a has-been who’s greatest honor would be to push Riboku to Gekishin diff.

 

[Owl Ki]

Not one ounce of what you said is canon lol. Kong Ming has never appeared within Kingdom or commented on any generals within, so I have no idea why you keep bringing this up.

If you are wondering, this is the Kong Ming bit that Red is referring to;

Spoiler: Chapter 194

https://mangasee123.com/read-online/Kingdom-chapter-194-page-6.html

 

[Red Admiral]

If you are wondering, this is the Kong Ming bit that Red is referring to;

Spoiler: Chapter 194

https://mangasee123.com/read-online/Kingdom-chapter-194-page-6.html

and also THIS PANEL

Spoiler

and since I'm kinda sure Lee missed it ... Zhuge Liang IS Kong Ming
2 times in the canon story Hara referred to Kong Ming comments ... so I don't even understand what can be even MORE canon

I mean this is a history tale not a fiction ... even if we didn't had this 2 panels ...
the assumption should be that Gaku Ki from Kingdom is the same man here as he is in history

some one like Riboku is top 4 in HIS OWN generation
some one like Gakuki is a GOAT of CHINA HISTORY

debating with this is debating with the smartest scholar/man and greatest strategist in china history
something I don't DARE to do
not sure about Lee

 

[Blackbeard]

Would've loved to see what would've happened if Houken never intervened in that battle.

A 15k led by a GG vs 8k battle with a portion of these 15k consisting of elite Quan Rong poison dogs whose cavalry's speed was so fast Riboku couldn't even assume formations in time

Riboku had absolutely no counter measures, he was mostly leeching off Houken's historical achievements since he wasn't even the supreme commander in the war that led to the capture of 20k Yan soldiers both in manga/real life

So yes, Gekishin would've technically killed Riboku on spot was it not for Hara's biggest blunder that's Houken lol

 

[Red Admiral]

A 15k led by a GG vs 8k battle with a portion of these 15k consisting of elite Quan Rong poison dogs whose cavalry's speed was so fast Riboku couldn't even assume formations in time

Riboku had absolutely no counter measures, he was mostly leeching off Houken's historical achievements since he wasn't even the supreme commander in the war that led to the capture of 20k Yan soldiers both in manga/real life

So yes, Gekishin would've technically killed Riboku on spot was it not for Hara's biggest blunder that's Houken lol

Riboku as a GENEARL was a failure

- without Houken distraction he couldn't defeat Ouki
- without Houken he couldn't defeat Gekishin
- without Houken he would've lost to Duke hue
- he lost the coalition war
- and he lost to Ousen while Ousen had around 20K less man power

Post automatically merged: Jul 12, 2021

we do know what Gakuki would’ve done. Gekishin uses his exact tactics. Gakuki would’ve been bodied by Riboku just as Gekishin was.

LOOOL

sure a man with Intelligence of 92 and exp of A tier would've done the same as a man with Intelligence of 98 and SS tier exp

LOOOL

for all we know Gaku ki strategy would low diff RIboku
and he was aware about Houken so he wouldn't charge head's on

if he would've done THIS he would kill both Riboku and Houken with ease .... and I'm making this strategy ...
a god tier character would've done something 10 times better

p.s
where is Kong Ming comment?
I'm disappointed at you Lee for missing this

accept Gaku Ki supremacy and we can talk about Riboku among ALIVE characters

 

[God Buggy]

I'm going with Ouki and Tou here.

I give Gakuki the edge as the best general here but Ouki is up there with him.

When it comes to who they have with them, I think this is what gives the Qin guys the edge.

I don't think low of Gekishin at all: it was said that the guy very well could have climbed his way up to even one of the Three Great Heavens, he had the talent to reproduce Gakuki's warfare and gave a very impressive showing against Riboku (aside from him getting stomped by Houken lol). Impressive guy, I sure don't think he was ever meant to be Gakuki's equal but he was for sure a very strong general.

When it comes to Tou, his abilities were outright compared to those of Ouki by Ouki himself, Wei considered him the Qin General they should have dealt with before anyone else and he is currently one of the new Qin Six generals. Now I don't consider him the best Qin General currently because I think that's Ousen but there's no denying that the hype around the guy is big lol.

So : Gakuki and Ouki up there in terms of overall level with Gakuki having the edge, Tou > Gekishin though Gekishin is putting up a fight for sure.

Ouki and Tou form a phenomenal team. As outstanding as Gakuki and Gekishin are, I'm going with Qin.

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

I agree with @God Buggy for this one, while Gakuki and Gekishin are superior generals when it comes to strategies and tactics, the teamwork and martial might of Ouki and Tou will prove to be a hindrance for both of them. It will be a extreme diff battle and no less than that.

 

[Shanks]

Extreme diff battle that could go either way. Though i think Ouki and Tou has the edge here just because of monstrous strength along tactics experience that could bypass any defense strategy.

GakuKi and Gekishin are definitely one of the top strategist and would definitely be able to make it too difficult for Ouki but as mentioned in first post that both sides has normal 50K soldiers other than themselves, i believe Ouki and Tou can make big difference just because of there raw power.

As for all the bashing of Gekishin in this thread. Just going to add one thing about Gekishin even though clearly and precisely elaborated by @Blackbeard , Gekishin was someone of the same caliber as Ouki or GakuKi, whom if Riboku leave alive, no one would be able to put himself equal or above him to lead Coalition army. Same goes to the formation of Coalition as Riboku’s stature wasn't big enough with just the achievement of killing Ouki and having support of ShunShinKun.

Here :

As for the confrontation between GekiShin and Riboku. Riboku definitely got upperhand in the beginning but within few minutes/hour GekiShin prepared counter and one that was so blasting that Riboku’s defense strategy got thoroughly destroyed and Gekishin didn't even leave a place and moment for Riboku to counter or save himself. And that's where Houken comes to save his ass.