Is Houken a complete fraud or what?

[Extravlad]

I'm in the Koku You arc (and really enjoying it so far) and I dont have all the elements yet but man ...

Houken's resumee so far

-Got bodied by Ouki not once but TWICE

-Almost lost to Duke Hyou who spent two weeks fighting a war every day while Houken was fully fresh

-Was clowned by Shin who stated he has no weight and his strikes arent shit compared to Renpa's

-Proceeds to get clowned retroactively when Gaimou's strikes make Shin remember the one he took from Renpa

Like is this Bushin guy a fraud or what? It seems his ultimate strength is worth nothing on a battlefield as long as the enemy is a great general who specializes in martial prowess

From what I've seen he aint beating any of Ouki,Renpa or Gaimou let alone Kanmei and Moubu who are the two strongest I've seen so far

 

[NikaInParis]

Houken and Kyoukai's magic bs are the worst part about Kingdom

 

[lee33]

Houken and Kyoukai's magic bs are the worst part about Kingdom

Yea it feels out of place from the series.

 

[Rumble]

Not a fraud, just a misguided, violent, fragile individual. A victim in his own right, who could not break from him dogma.

From what I've seen he aint beating any of Ouki,Renpa or Gaimou let alone Kanmei and Moubu who are the two strongest I've seen so far

Feats wise, no one comes close.

The man attacked enemy HQs by himself on numerous occasions.

Yea it feels out of place from the series.

Why do people say this? The supernatural aspects of Kingdom have always been there.

 

[lee33]

Why do people say this? The supernatural aspects of Kingdom have always been there.

For me, the supernatural doesn't really fit into the story. The breathe control is cool but the magic I wasn't a fan of. I understand if you like it since it will give the story another element but for me I just don't think the story needs it.

 

[Owl Ki]

I'm in the Koku You arc (and really enjoying it so far) and I dont have all the elements yet but man ...

Houken's resumee so far

-Got bodied by Ouki not once but TWICE

-Almost lost to Duke Hyou who spent two weeks fighting a war every day while Houken was fully fresh

-Was clowned by Shin who stated he has no weight and his strikes arent shit compared to Renpa's

-Proceeds to get clowned retroactively when Gaimou's strikes make Shin remember the one he took from Renpa

Like is this Bushin guy a fraud or what? It seems his ultimate strength is worth nothing on a battlefield as long as the enemy is a great general who specializes in martial prowess

From what I've seen he aint beating any of Ouki,Renpa or Gaimou let alone Kanmei and Moubu who are the two strongest I've seen so far

It is not that Houken is a fraud but that Houken is a contradiction. It is a deliberate part of his character that he seeks ultimate strength but refuses to acknowledge the source of strength that others draw from (Weight) because it clashes with his beliefs.

The fact that he is a Top Tier in Kingdom without Weight means that Houken is exceptionally remarkable. It would be like a character in One Piece physically matching Yonko/Admirals blow for blow without any haki.

 

[Rumble]

For me, the supernatural doesn't really fit into the story. The breathe control is cool but the magic I wasn't a fan of. I understand if you like it since it will give the story another element but for me I just don't think the story needs it.

I agree the story doesn't need the supernatural elements either, but it's always been a part of Kingdom, is my point.

Remember when Ran Kai smushed a grown ass man with one hand? Crazy.

 

[lee33]

I agree the story doesn't need the supernatural elements either, but it's always been a part of Kingdom, is my point.

Remember when Ran Kai smushed a grown ass man with one hand? Crazy.

But wasn't that supernatural strength rather than super natural magic like chi?

 

[MarineHQ]

Quite the opossite actually. Houken is stronger, faster and more technical than all of the others but without weight there is only so much he can do.

 

[Rumble]

But wasn't that supernatural strength rather than super natural magic like chi?

Does it make a difference when Ran Kai is a literal man-ape with One Piece like proportions?

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

If anything, the "Weight" is a plot armor employed by Hara to signify certain characters.

Remove "Weight" from every Kingdom characters and Houken would solos the verse.

And Houken wasn't "almost lost" to Duke Hyou wtf? Houken was clearly destroying Duke.

 

[DoflaMihawk]

I'm catching up and am a little farther ahead than you so I won't spoil, but as for your points:

- Ouki was stronger in their first fight, but admitted Houken could have won the second if he didn't have ptsd from the first fight.

- Doubt Duke was that tired when he never fought someone even close to him strength-wise in those 2 weeks.

- That's right, Houken doesn't have any 'weight' that a General has, but that's not a knock against him, it's just the path he chose.

- Gaimou gets mid-diffed by Houken lol

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

- Gaimou gets mid-diffed by Houken lol

Nah, Gaimou wouldn't get mid diffed lol. Gaimou is not weak. He's the strongest Wei general right now.

Houken vs Gaimou would be extreme diff win in Houken's favor.

 

[Hiragaro]

Houken is the real G, as HE is, The Bushin!

He simply doesn't have plot armor as the others do

 

[Cichy]

The problem with Houken is that he represents philosophy opposite to the one that the author is trying to convey (that carrying the burden of the dead makes you stronger) so one way or the other he is destined to fail, even tho technically he's the most skilled fighter in the series.

If Houken was written by a different author like Masashi Kishimoto, he might have been unstoppable. He's basically the Rock Lee / Might Guy of Kingdom, the hardest worker. Someone who dedicated his life to a single goal of becoming the strongest. That is why in many ways watching him fail is so frustrating. Because if you don't agree with Hara's philosophy of carrying the weight of the dead then it's easy to see Houken as someone who deserves to be strongest.

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

The problem with Houken is that he represents philosophy opposite to the one that the author is trying to convey (that carrying the burden of the dead makes you stronger) so one way or the other he is destined to fail, even tho technically he's the most skilled fighter in the series.

If Houken was written by a different author like Masashi Kishimoto, he might have been unstoppable. He's basically the Rock Lee / Might Guy of Kingdom, the hardest worker. Someone who dedicated his life to a single goal of becoming the strongest. That is why in many ways watching him fail is so frustrating. Because if you don't agree with Hara's philosophy of carrying the weight of the dead then it's easy to see Houken as someone who deserves to be strongest.

How do you feel about Houken's character btw? Do you think he was a good villain?

 

[Cichy]

How do you feel about Houken's character btw? Do you think he was a good villain?

I think Hara made a decent job conveying his worldview, he is also a pretty unique character all things considered.

But with that said... it's hard to take him seriously after the disrespect this guy received.

Spoiler

First geting pushed and wounded by 1k commander Shin at Sai, then dying to 5k commander Shin who apparently already had enough weight to compensate the huge gap in skill. None of that should have happened. If I was the one to write Houken then Shin should not be able to do anything to him until reaching the rank of great general. And then, ONLY THEN being able to defeat him in a duel.

Even Mouten's old adjutant was able to wound him, like WTF Hara. This is not the way to treat your antagonist.

 

[Killerj]

Its called plot armor, this is how kaido was defeated also even tho he did like 5x the damage luffy did to him till the final clash, when its time to lose you lose. Welcome to manga verse.

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

I think Hara made a decent job conveying his worldview, he is also a pretty unique character all things considered.

But with that said... it's hard to take him seriously after the disrespect this guy received.

Spoiler

First geting pushed and wounded by 1k commander Shin at Sai, then dying to 5k commander Shin who apparently already had enough weight to compensate the huge gap in skill. None of that should have happened. If I was the one to write Houken then Shin should not be able to do anything to him until reaching the rank of great general. And then, ONLY THEN being able to defeat him in a duel.

Even Mouten's old adjutant was able to wound him, like WTF Hara. This is not the way to treat your antagonist.

Spoiler

Yeah agreed 100%. Houken should have been saved as one of Shin's final villains to defeat in a 1v1.

Shin defeated Houken and rose to Six Great General rank would have been much better writing.

 

[JoNdule]

Hating on Kaido
Hating on Houken