Character Discussion Kid's character growth in Wano

#1
I think Kid has had one of the best character arcs in wano and so I figure I'd make this thread to break down exactly what Oda is doing with his character, and hopefully dispel any misconceptions people might have.

At the beginning of the arc, Kid was portrayed as this selfish asshole. Honestly, it kinda reminded me of Guts from the black swordsman arc. Kid had been destroyed by Kaido and tortured by him. His best friend, Killer, was fed a failed smile and was humiliated by the beast pirates. All Kid cared about was getting revenge on kaido and taking all the fame and glory of beating kaido for himself.

In Udon, Kid rejected Luffy's offer to form an alliance. Betrayed by Apoo and Hawkins, Kid was unwilling to trust others and wanted to do things his own way.

Then on the rooftop, something changed. First, Kid acknowledged Luffy's strength. He saw the damage Luffy was able to put on kaido and was impressed. Yet this damage ultimate wasn't enough as in chapter 1008, the yonko both looked near fresh. In that chapter, Kid made the comment:
It doesn't feel like our attacks are doing anything!
Luffy:
They are working!! There's no way all these hits could have no effect!! They are just as human as we are!!
Then when they are talking about separating kaido and big mom, Kid remarks that fighting 2 yonko at once is like hell. To which Luffy exclaims that its fine because he's been to hell and back. Kaido makes a comment about how the light never leaves Luffy's eyes.

Subsequently we see Kid working in a team with Law, Killer, and Zoro to send linlin flying. After this, to our surprise, Kid leaves the rooftop to go after Linlin. Why? I believe this is due to the impression Luffy had on Kid. Luffy showed Kid he was better equipped to deal with kaido and his perseverance in the face of what Kid himself described as "hell" made Kid entrust his vengeance to Luffy as he put his ego aside and went after Big Mom. Like is often the case, another character entrusted their dreams to Luffy.

But we're not done. Kid was still going after Linlin for selfish reasons. Beating an emperor was one of his dreams, as Hawkins said, and this was finally his opportunity to do so. In 1031, Linlin even makes this inference. However in 1038, we see yet another change from Kid.

Linlin:
guess you kids are hell bent on taking my head
Kid:
Hahaha... Its weird, I feel like I have a new reason to keep fighting!! I bet you anything, Kaido is reaching his limits up there... If you give it long enough, even mountains can be worn down by rain! They say you emperors are invincible? What a joke. There's no such thing!
A lot of Kid haters interpret this line to mean that Kid has changed his objective and that he no longer is trying to beat linlin, just stall her. But this makes no sense as stalling linlin is useless since the alliance will be destroyed unless she is defeated. Kid didn't talk about getting new objectives, rather he said his motives for fighting have changed. His goal is still the same, to beat linlin, but he now has a new reason to do so.

Now Kid isn't just fighting for himself, as he has been for all of wano, now he is fighting to help Luffy beat Kaido. Luffy got Kid to entrust his dreams onto him and as a result, caused Kid to fight for something greater than himself, which is something Kid has never done. As a result, this has strengthened Kid's resolve to a completely different level.

Whereas before, Kid questioned if their attacks were even effective against the emperors, now Kid is confident that each attack is chipping away at them and that with enough effort, Luffy, Kid, and Law can all defeat their respective yonkos. imo Kid now has a massive chance of unlocking ACoC due to this strengthened resolve. He just parroted Luffy's line from 1008, which was only 2 chapters before Luffy unlocked ACoC.

I think 1039 will likely parallel 1009, with big mom using a massive attack and going all out, with linlin ultimately falling in 1040, which will parallel 1010 by Kid awakening ACoC.
 

KiriNigiri

The Road To Harmony
#3
Kid certainly developed more as a character in Wano, but I don't think his story was as good as it could've been thus far. My main issue is how little he actually appeared throughout Wano. We get some nice spotlight of him opening up to Luffy and gang, but just bits. It feels like we're missing some pieces. His biggest character growth occurred on the Roof when he and Killer finally accepted the others as allies and agreed to handle Linlin for them. But that moment could've been a lot stronger if we got more antagonism between him and Luffy.

To me, Kid served best as Luffy's foil. He has the same determination and willpower Luffy possesses, but his pitfalls highlight the qualities which separate him and Luffy. Luffy's strength and progression are due to bonds he had achieved throughout his journey, and notably in Wano. That was his willingness to work with others that led to it. While he fights Kaido, it's for the sake of all the friends he who've helped him along the way.

Kid's character does come full circle, openly working alongside Law to defeat Linlin, not for some single minded pursuit of glory, but for someone else.
 
H

Herrera95

#10
What you call development I call destroyed. Kid's character got destroyed at Wano too quickly.

We have Law turning into Luffy's cheerleader but he had a development for that. Started way back at Sabaody, Kid kind of started there too, both seeing Luffy punching a celestial dragon and calling Luffy's DF to be the weirdest of them(really Law?). Then at Marineford Law had a plan including Luffy. Punk Hazard Law started that plan and executed at Dressrosa. Law had much more development with Luffy to become his cheerleader.

But Kid? He didn't had any. He was rivalling him at Udon and worked together during sometimes of the raid. Nothing that justify he becoming what he became.

And Kid is selfish? He was the one giving away his pride in order to make an alliance with Apoo and Hawkins. Luffy is much more selfish than him.
 
#11
Saying he has one of the best character growths in Wano is cap imo but I agree that he’s matured as a character throughout the course of the arc in that he’s now able rely on others when he needs to. That said, I think Oda assassinated his character this chapter. The whole ‘I feel like I’m fighting for an entirely different reason ting’ was character regression imo. One of the major characteristics of Kidd & I’d argue the most appealing ting about his character was his reckless ambition & his willingness to die for it & that was the main distinctive difference btw him & Law but that is gone now with this chapter.
 
#13
Most One Piece characters eventually give up their dream and turn into Luffy's cheerleader due to his artificial charisma.

I am not sure if I can call this as a character growth and make Kid stand out...

:seriously:
 

Finalbeta

Hero of Albion
#14
Wano is about characters becoming who they are.
Robin becoming a devil.
Yamato herself and not Oden.
Kanjuro a true retainer.
Momo an adult and a leader.
Kaido joyboy.
Sanji becomes his true self and not a germa member.
Zoro becomes a king.
And kidd becomes luffy's cheerleader.
Momo the next Shogun :cheers:
 
#16
I think Kid has had one of the best character arcs in wano and so I figure I'd make this thread to break down exactly what Oda is doing with his character, and hopefully dispel any misconceptions people might have.

At the beginning of the arc, Kid was portrayed as this selfish asshole. Honestly, it kinda reminded me of Guts from the black swordsman arc. Kid had been destroyed by Kaido and tortured by him. His best friend, Killer, was fed a failed smile and was humiliated by the beast pirates. All Kid cared about was getting revenge on kaido and taking all the fame and glory of beating kaido for himself.

In Udon, Kid rejected Luffy's offer to form an alliance. Betrayed by Apoo and Hawkins, Kid was unwilling to trust others and wanted to do things his own way.

Then on the rooftop, something changed. First, Kid acknowledged Luffy's strength. He saw the damage Luffy was able to put on kaido and was impressed. Yet this damage ultimate wasn't enough as in chapter 1008, the yonko both looked near fresh. In that chapter, Kid made the comment:


Luffy:


Then when they are talking about separating kaido and big mom, Kid remarks that fighting 2 yonko at once is like hell. To which Luffy exclaims that its fine because he's been to hell and back. Kaido makes a comment about how the light never leaves Luffy's eyes.

Subsequently we see Kid working in a team with Law, Killer, and Zoro to send linlin flying. After this, to our surprise, Kid leaves the rooftop to go after Linlin. Why? I believe this is due to the impression Luffy had on Kid. Luffy showed Kid he was better equipped to deal with kaido and his perseverance in the face of what Kid himself described as "hell" made Kid entrust his vengeance to Luffy as he put his ego aside and went after Big Mom. Like is often the case, another character entrusted their dreams to Luffy.

But we're not done. Kid was still going after Linlin for selfish reasons. Beating an emperor was one of his dreams, as Hawkins said, and this was finally his opportunity to do so. In 1031, Linlin even makes this inference. However in 1038, we see yet another change from Kid.

Linlin:


Kid:


A lot of Kid haters interpret this line to mean that Kid has changed his objective and that he no longer is trying to beat linlin, just stall her. But this makes no sense as stalling linlin is useless since the alliance will be destroyed unless she is defeated. Kid didn't talk about getting new objectives, rather he said his motives for fighting have changed. His goal is still the same, to beat linlin, but he now has a new reason to do so.

Now Kid isn't just fighting for himself, as he has been for all of wano, now he is fighting to help Luffy beat Kaido. Luffy got Kid to entrust his dreams onto him and as a result, caused Kid to fight for something greater than himself, which is something Kid has never done. As a result, this has strengthened Kid's resolve to a completely different level.

Whereas before, Kid questioned if their attacks were even effective against the emperors, now Kid is confident that each attack is chipping away at them and that with enough effort, Luffy, Kid, and Law can all defeat their respective yonkos. imo Kid now has a massive chance of unlocking ACoC due to this strengthened resolve. He just parroted Luffy's line from 1008, which was only 2 chapters before Luffy unlocked ACoC.

I think 1039 will likely parallel 1009, with big mom using a massive attack and going all out, with linlin ultimately falling in 1040, which will parallel 1010 by Kid awakening ACoC.
BM isn't falling in ch 1040
Orochi will be done before BM and Kaido fall
Fuku and Karen both stuff too
Emperors are falling last.

Anyway you are right about Kidd
People are just hellbent on trashing him
He isn't fighting for himself anymore, he's fighting for himself and the whole alliance by stopping Bm from going to the roof and beating her

1038 : 1008 where Luffy says attacks are working just like Kidd said here.
1039 or 1040 : 1010 where BM will finally use adcoc againsy them on screen , Kidd will dee it and use CoC and unlock adcoc too
We will get Kidd flashbacks here
1043-45 : end of the fight
[automerge]1643450078[/automerge]
Saying he has one of the best character growths in Wano is cap imo but I agree that he’s matured as a character throughout the course of the arc in that he’s now able rely on others when he needs to. That said, I think Oda assassinated his character this chapter. The whole ‘I feel like I’m fighting for an entirely different reason ting’ was character regression imo. One of the major characteristics of Kidd & I’d argue the most appealing ting about his character was his reckless ambition & his willingness to die for it & that was the main distinctive difference btw him & Law but that is gone now with this chapter.
Oda gonna butcher anyone's character to wank Luffy
That's why OP isn't great when it comes to character development
 
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