Everyone starts shouting that Kioraku has a bankai.... So what? Then, according to this logic, he kills Yamamoto, which is fucking nonsense, secondly, the bleach decides the level of reatsu. The Kenpachi reatsu in bankai is at the colossal level and there is a huge chance that bankai keraku simply won't work on it. Otherwise, Kioraku is just an insect compared to Zaraki
Versus Battle Why is trash like Kioraku often put above Zaraki?
- Thread starter Artem
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Well yeah, Kyoraku's Bankai is absolutely broken and is a 100% certain kill unless the opponent can resurrect/cheat death. And that's just the one iteration we've seen - Kubo explained his Bankai can follow the storyline of any Japanese play, so Shunsui can completely customise how his Bankai works
Kyoraku's physical stats put his strength at >base Kenpachi and only slightly lower than Shikai Kenny
His speed is the greatest amongst all Shinigami, and above even Soi Fon's
He's also arguably the smartest Shinigami besides Mayuri and Kisuke
The guy is a monster - a total fucking monster. It's easy to understand why people would underestimate him given he's so laid back and understated but that's what makes his character so great
Of the Shinigami themselves (not counting Ichigo) Kyoraku is the third strongest by feats we've seen behind only Ichibe and Yamamoto.
Kyoraku's physical stats put his strength at >base Kenpachi and only slightly lower than Shikai Kenny
His speed is the greatest amongst all Shinigami, and above even Soi Fon's
He's also arguably the smartest Shinigami besides Mayuri and Kisuke
The guy is a monster - a total fucking monster. It's easy to understand why people would underestimate him given he's so laid back and understated but that's what makes his character so great
Of the Shinigami themselves (not counting Ichigo) Kyoraku is the third strongest by feats we've seen behind only Ichibe and Yamamoto.
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Kyoraku casualed Starrk (who's mere presence could kill Adjuchas - which by the way is a feat that none of the Quincy come close to besides Yhwach) - and it was prerequisite that to even withstand his presence (let alone completely neg diff in combat) you needed monstrous Reaitsu of your own, and you're here pretending Kyoraku isn't a Reiatsu monster as well... jfc people love to retcon things for the agenda don't they?
The way Kyoraku's Bankai works is it plays out scenes of a play. The are un-negatable. If a play has a murder in it, then Kyoraku's opponent will die unless his opponent can kill Kyoraku first. The only characters in the entire verse I'd be confident in saying could do that are Yhwach, Ichibe, Ichigo, Yama and Hogyoku Aizen. His Bankai would though, work on every character that wasn't a Schutzstaffel or Yhwach.
Kenpachi's reiatsu doesn't even compare to the top tiers though - let's stop pretending it does. He was clearly portrayed to be nothing out of the ordinary amongst even the captains during the fight with Gerard, which by the way was an 11 v 1 with captain class fighters across the board, while Kyoraku on his own was fighting Lille who was approx the same power as Gerard. If we're putting Reiatsu into tiers Kenpachi's sits on the same tier as Zero Division (besides Ichibe), whereas Kyoraku's by feats is in that tier at it's absolute lowest estimate but probably sits inbetween ZD and the top tiers.
The way Kyoraku's Bankai works is it plays out scenes of a play. The are un-negatable. If a play has a murder in it, then Kyoraku's opponent will die unless his opponent can kill Kyoraku first. The only characters in the entire verse I'd be confident in saying could do that are Yhwach, Ichibe, Ichigo, Yama and Hogyoku Aizen. His Bankai would though, work on every character that wasn't a Schutzstaffel or Yhwach.
Kenpachi's reiatsu doesn't even compare to the top tiers though - let's stop pretending it does. He was clearly portrayed to be nothing out of the ordinary amongst even the captains during the fight with Gerard, which by the way was an 11 v 1 with captain class fighters across the board, while Kyoraku on his own was fighting Lille who was approx the same power as Gerard. If we're putting Reiatsu into tiers Kenpachi's sits on the same tier as Zero Division (besides Ichibe), whereas Kyoraku's by feats is in that tier at it's absolute lowest estimate but probably sits inbetween ZD and the top tiers.
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What? Kioraku in shikai was beaten by ROBERT and knocked out his eye (a middle-level sterniritter). Kenpachi easily killed three of them before training. If we compare strength and physical characteristics, then. Bankai Kenpachi>>Kenpachi Shikai>Kenpachi base>Unohana>>Kioraku. Gerard, in the form of a giant, practically does not feel the reatsu of Byakui and Toshiro (because the stronger the creature, the weaker it feels the reatsu of the weaker ones). But he feels a huge amount of kenpachi reatsu in the bankai. Bankai kenpachi = an incredible amount of reatsu (most likely number 3 after Bach and Eisen). Most likely, bankai kiraku will not work on bankai kenpachi due to too much difference in reatsu. But if it works, it will all end in Act 3. Because of the huge amount of Kenpachi reatsu, he will not drown, Kioraku will drown and that will be the end of it.
Gerard's physical characteristics are the strongest of all Quincy's. He is the heart of the King of Souls. Any captain could stand Stark's reatsu, lol. You claim that Bankai Kioraku is killing kenpachi. OK. Why doesn't Bankai Kioraku kill Yamamoto or Ichigo? The first generation of Captains was the strongest. 1 Pit. Unohan's number 2. Kenpachi base>Unohana Bankai. In terms of Unohan's physical characteristics>>Kioraku
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Gerard's physical characteristics are the strongest of all Quincy's. He is the heart of the King of Souls. Any captain could stand Stark's reatsu, lol. You claim that Bankai Kioraku is killing kenpachi. OK. Why doesn't Bankai Kioraku kill Yamamoto or Ichigo? The first generation of Captains was the strongest. 1 Pit. Unohan's number 2. Kenpachi base>Unohana Bankai. In terms of Unohan's physical characteristics>>Kioraku
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lol cause he is....
Kenpachi gets shit on by Kyoraku.
Zaraki needed special training and killing off an entire character for him to compete on a level that Shunsui has been at for 100s of years already lol
Shunsuis bankai is essentially a Domain Expansion it is a sure hit kill.
what exactly puts Zaraki above him?
SS - Kenpachi fought and lost to pre-bankai Ichigo the same Ichi who was barely able to beat Ikkaku
Shunsui neg diffed Chad then had to go against Yama
HM/FKT - Kenpachi beat Espada 5 then had to 3v1 Yammy
Shunsui low diffed Espada 1 without the use of his Bankai while not even taking the fight seriously....
TYBW - Kenpachi fought Gerard in a 6545454 v 1 and wasnt even the reason why he fall
Shunsui fought Lillie in a 1v1 and nearly solo'd him
Shunsui Captain of Gotei 13
Kenpachi a Captain of the Gotei 13
Kenpachi gets shit on by Kyoraku.
Zaraki needed special training and killing off an entire character for him to compete on a level that Shunsui has been at for 100s of years already lol
Shunsuis bankai is essentially a Domain Expansion it is a sure hit kill.
what exactly puts Zaraki above him?
SS - Kenpachi fought and lost to pre-bankai Ichigo the same Ichi who was barely able to beat Ikkaku
Shunsui neg diffed Chad then had to go against Yama
HM/FKT - Kenpachi beat Espada 5 then had to 3v1 Yammy
Shunsui low diffed Espada 1 without the use of his Bankai while not even taking the fight seriously....
TYBW - Kenpachi fought Gerard in a 6545454 v 1 and wasnt even the reason why he fall
Shunsui fought Lillie in a 1v1 and nearly solo'd him
Shunsui Captain of Gotei 13
Kenpachi a Captain of the Gotei 13
Match up wise Kyoraku has more ways of winning over Kenpachi than the latter does over Kyoraku. But in terms of who’s stronger overall I mean it’s been made pretty clear:
Yhwach considers him the only war threat in the Gotei 13, the only other guy he would’ve considered was Yamamoto. Kyoraku was not even on Yhwach’s radar in any similar fashion. By the time Kenpachi unlocked his power he already cemented his place as the strongest in the Gotei 13.
Yhwach considers him the only war threat in the Gotei 13, the only other guy he would’ve considered was Yamamoto. Kyoraku was not even on Yhwach’s radar in any similar fashion. By the time Kenpachi unlocked his power he already cemented his place as the strongest in the Gotei 13.
having players on Ywachs radar were all special reasons come on now hao ive known you long enough to at least know you dont really believe Kanpachi is actually stronger than Kyoraku the same guy who has been considered the strongest after old man Yama. in terms of raw strength and power yes Kenpachi excels but overall Shunsui still outshines him.
Besides Urahara who was placed there for being the Batman of Bleach and Ichibe for his experience, the rest were on there solely due to their combat abilities/power. Yamamoto wasn’t going to be considered because of some special ability, Yhwach had the intel that he lost an arm and so he promptly removed him from the list just for that.
Kyoraku was the strongest for the longest time after Yama but we can’t argue with the portrayal towards the end. Look at how much Kubo had other characters reiterating the fact that if the Sternritter were able to kill Kenpachi the odds would be in the favor of the Quincies rather than the Gotei. Nothing of the sort for Kyoraku. Even when we look at the feats Kenpachi was the only one who completely decimated a Quincy RG in a 1v1 with Gerard, had it not been for Gerard having like the 2nd most haxed ability in the verse Bankai Kenpachi would’ve gotten the job done by himself before he broke down.
I haven’t read the novels but I’m pretty sure all of this is just reinforced. Kyoraku is the better overall fighter if we’re comparing their abilities, like if both were to match up Kyoraku has more ways of dealing with Kenpachi than vice versa. But if we’re talking who’s stronger then the answer is obvious. If Kyoraku isn’t on his A-game in a fight Bankai Kenpachi has the requisite superior reiatsu output to potentially cancel out some of the hax if not all of it.
Unohana vs Kyoraku is a closer case. That’s one where I’m not sure who’s stronger, Kyoraku has better feats in Bankai but idk I would have look into it.
Kyoraku was the strongest for the longest time after Yama but we can’t argue with the portrayal towards the end. Look at how much Kubo had other characters reiterating the fact that if the Sternritter were able to kill Kenpachi the odds would be in the favor of the Quincies rather than the Gotei. Nothing of the sort for Kyoraku. Even when we look at the feats Kenpachi was the only one who completely decimated a Quincy RG in a 1v1 with Gerard, had it not been for Gerard having like the 2nd most haxed ability in the verse Bankai Kenpachi would’ve gotten the job done by himself before he broke down.
I haven’t read the novels but I’m pretty sure all of this is just reinforced. Kyoraku is the better overall fighter if we’re comparing their abilities, like if both were to match up Kyoraku has more ways of dealing with Kenpachi than vice versa. But if we’re talking who’s stronger then the answer is obvious. If Kyoraku isn’t on his A-game in a fight Bankai Kenpachi has the requisite superior reiatsu output to potentially cancel out some of the hax if not all of it.
Unohana vs Kyoraku is a closer case. That’s one where I’m not sure who’s stronger, Kyoraku has better feats in Bankai but idk I would have look into it.
