General & Others Zabuza and Kiri second coup

[RayanOO]

We know that Zabuza hated the reign of the 4th Mizukage Kagura Karatachi and opposed him.

He tried a first coup to kill him but failed, then left the village with Haku. After that he spent years collecting money to prepare a second coup and kill Yagura.

What do you think would have happened if Zabuza had lived after meeting Naruto and co and killed the 4th ?

Would he became the new Mizukage ? and what kind of reign he will have (dictator/good/middle ground) ? relationships with other villages / Naruto ? What about Mei Ao or Chojuro, the other strong ninjas of Kiri, would they follow him ?
Which one between Mei or Zabuza would have become Mizukage ?

What do you think he will change or not change about Kiri ? change the death exam ? the class ? the kekei genkai hunt ? a more military Kiri ? etc

What do you think about all this ?

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[Seth]

We know that Zabuza hated the reign of the 4th Mizukage Kagura Karatachi and opposed him.

He tried a first coup to kill him but failed, then left the village with Haku. After that he spent years collecting money to prepare a second coup and kill Yagura.

What do you think would have happened if Zabuza had lived after meeting Naruto and co and killed the 4th ?

Would he became the new Mizukage ? and what kind of reign he will have (dictator/good/middle ground) ? relationships with other villages / Naruto ? What about Mei Ao or Chojuro, the other strong ninjas of Kiri, would they follow him ?
Which one between Mei or Zabuza would have become Mizukage ?

What do you think he will change or not change about Kiri ? change the death exam ? the class ? the kenkei kekkai hunt ? a more military Kiri ? etc

What do you think about all this ?

tags : @LuthonTheDragDown @Jiihad @Draco @Bogard @Seth @silverfire @Van @Shiroyru @Vlad D. Impaler @Yoshioka Seijuro @FloriGlori @Cinera @Enma @Seraphoenix @Marimo_420 @LANJI CUCKSMOKE @Sentinel @Ice devil slayer @comrade @HA001 @Haoshoku @Inflamed Haki @ShishioIsBack @symbiote etc

Mei.

She is an overall better character and her Jutsu techniques are way more dangerous than Zabuza's. I also think Zabuza would struggle with a leading role whereas Mei attracts people and makes use of them.

Zabuza is kinda meh in the grand scheme of things for me. I like him as a character but once Shippuuden starts it is clear that he is not that big of a deal for the Shippuuden standards. Even Kisame calls him a kid or shit like that doesn't he?

 

[RayanOO]

Mei.

She is an overall better character and her Jutsu techniques are way more dangerous than Zabuza's. I also think Zabuza would struggle with a leading role whereas Mei attracts people and makes use of them.

Zabuza is kinda meh in the grand scheme of things for me. I like him as a character but once Shippuuden starts it is clear that he is not that big of a deal for the Shippuuden standards. Even Kisame calls him a kid or shit like that doesn't he?

I agree that from what we've seen Mei is likely stronger than Zabuza.

But Zabuza is not a scrubs. He was an elite jonin, was ANBU, was one of the legendary generation of the 7 swordsmen etc.

He is also a leader : he is one of the leader against the 4th Mizukage and seemingly the one who activerly tried to free Kiri from him.
If he had managed that, the people who hated Yagara would have likely welcomed Zabuza as a hero.

The only thing is Zabuza is maybe a bit too hard for the people of Kiri at that time; They just were freed from a tyranical rule I don't think Zabuza is the best one to reconcile people, to negociate with other villages etc.

I think Mei would still be in the lead but Zabuza as a hero and a world known figure would also be at the top of Kiri.
Lol given that Mei desesperately wants a husband maybe they would marry each other.

Post automatically merged: Feb 3, 2021

And Haku with 2/3 years to train would become a beast (likely next in line to be Mizukage in a Boruto what if)

 

[Seth]

He was an elite jonin

We both know this rank means shit in Shippuuden let alone later in Boruto. ( Trashamaru ).

Latter things I agree.

Although remember. Leading one of the rogue groups that strive to do a coup =/= leading a whole village.

 

[RayanOO]

Although remember. Leading one of the rogue groups that strive to do a coup =/= leading a whole village.

obviously different things, as I said Zabuza wouldn't be that much suited to negociate with other countries, trust them etc. That is why Mei would maybe be Mizukage or they will rule together.

And often the one leading the coup and managing to revolt against the power in place = great importance / leading role in the new order.

Zabuza really needs Mei to rule Kiri.

And we also know that Zabuza mellowed a bit with Haku. He cares about him and that new side of him will likely help him to have a leading role.

The thing I don't know is about Kiri death match in academy : Zabuza seemed to be pleased/found of this memory. I don't think he will want to change that rule, while I don't think Mei is fan of that.

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

It's a little wild that Zabuza tried to kill Yagura the perfect Jinchuuriki at the age of 16. Downright monster, that guy.

What do you think would have happened if Zabuza had lived after meeting Naruto and co and killed the 4th ?

Realistically? Potential Akatsuki recruit—we don't know when Hidan was recruited. We know Deidara was recruited when he was 16 and he was 19 at the start of Shippuden. We also know that Hidan is the newest recruit bar Tobi. So, depending on the timeline, it's entirely possible that Zabuza ends up being a temporary partner for Kakuzu.

The other outcome? Probably hunted by Kakuzu. He's a famous missing nin. with a name to him. Definitely more notorious than Asuma. So I can see that being the outcome.

Would he became the new Mizukage ? and what kind of reign he will have (dictator/good/middle ground) ? relationships with other villages / Naruto ? What about Mei Ao or Chojuro, the other stronges ninjas of Kiri, would they follow him ?
Which one between Mei or Zabuza would have become Mizukage ?

Zabuza could never become Mizukage. He doesn't have the support for it. He was an infamous murderer who tried to usurp the title, was forced to flee and had 3 loyal followers. Short of some massive tonal shift for the Kirigakure shinobi, I can't imagine they'd ever look at Zabuza as a viable leader.

If he was the Mizukage? He'd be a very cynical and militaristic one. Zabuza's key traits are ambition and being pragmatic. I could see there being a devolution to a more bloody time for the village under Zabuza's leadership alongside provocations on neighboring countries.

Naruto? It's tough to say. If he somehow just lives after killing Gato? I can see Zabuza having a degree of respect and admiration for Naruto. He credits Naruto with his own defeat, no one else. Likewise, that drive to be a kage resonates with Naruto. But I can't see them being chummy if Zabuza becomes Mizukage. He showed a more human side to himself in Wave, but that doesn't wash away his core traits.

Ao? Yes. He would. He's a longstanding Kiri jounin and elite. Mei / Chojuro? No. Can't see either falling in line. Mei seems like she'd size Zabuza up and take his place at the first opportunity, especially with her anti-Bloody Mist demeanor. Chojuro follows Mei like a sick puppy.

What do you think he will change or not change about Kiri ? change the death exam ? the class ? the kenkei kekkai hunt ? a more military Kiri ? etc

The graduation exam was actually changed because of Zabuza already. At the age of 9, he slaughtered the entire graduating class before he was eligible to be a shinobi—either being an underclassman or not even enrolled in the academy—and Kirigakure was forced to change their ways.

I doubt Zabuza brings it back. He didn't force Haku to kill, giving Haku a shred of autonomy in that field. And Haku would do anything Zabuza wanted to the letter. The Bloodline purges have also been massacred by fandom and fanon. To my knowledge, it was essentially... Peasantry and rural folk killing people with bloodlines and never a sponsored action by Kirigakure.

I see Zabuza enrolling more clan kids—maybe doing away with the caste system of Kirigakure and 100% a more militarized village.

 

[FloriGlori]

Since the 4th was essentially a puppet controlled by Obito, Zabuza would be defeated by Obito after a successful elimination. No future for Zabuza, sadly. He might've been recruited into the Akatsuki, tho, similar to Kisame.

 

[RayanOO]

Short of some massive tonal shift for the Kirigakure shinobi, I can't imagine they'd ever look at Zabuza as a viable leader.

People really hated Yagura ? people will maybe be grateful for him if he had killed him ?

That move will gain him some good number of followers.

Mei seems like she'd size Zabuza up and take his place at the first opportunity, especially with her anti-Bloody Mist demeanor.

I agree but don't you think they can collaborate a bit ? forced to do it ?

The graduation exam was actually changed because of Zabuza already

u're right, forgot that

Post automatically merged: Feb 3, 2021

He might've been recruited into the Akatsuki, tho, similar to Kisame.

I think Zabuza would want to work "for" (subjective) his country. I don't see why he would join the akatsuki

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

People really hated Yagura ? people will maybe be grateful for him if he had killed him ?

That move will gain him some good number of followers.

From what we know via the post-series novels, Kirigakure is made up of three rungs of society. Those who founded the village in the first estate, those who fought alongside Kirigakure in the second estate and everyone conquered in the third. Add to that a history of hyper aggression and promoting interpersonal conflicts every which way — so much so that assassinating a senior gives you their position — and I can't see Kirigakure's chief figures ever showing genuine gratitude. Kirigakure is merciless and I think that would just make Zabuza the new guy to hate / betray.

I agree but don't you think they can collaborate a bit ? forced to do it ?

Sure, if push comes to shove, I think it's in character for Zabuza to make use of others to further his agenda. Mei probably would do so too. But I think calling them allies or expecting either to serve the other is out there.

 

[symbiote]

If he would have succeeded and became the Mizukage he’d be a ninja version of Hitler. Obsessed with military power, not sure what his version of Jews are but w/e. Don’t think he’s last that long before someone like Mei steps up, challenges him and takes the title from him. If she doesn’t kill him I can see him joining the Akatski, don’t know how long that’ll last though.