Powers & Abilities If Rob Lucci had haki pre-skip. He MUST have learned it after enies lobby.

[Monkey D Theories]

It makes no sense for Lucci to have had haki during that fight. It was never once shown or even hinted at. Yet the datebooks stated that Lucci had haki pre-skip. So for me there are only two options

1. the data book is incorrect.(which happens often)
2. Lucci unlocked before the timeskip but after his fight with Luffy

If the second option is true, I could see post-skip Lucci being a high tier, on par with the YC1s. This would validate how he was paired against Sabo in film gold.

But in any case, him having Haki during the time of enies lobby creates so many plot holes that there is no way that Oda would go out of his way to canonize this.

 

[ShinmenTakezo]

Him having Haki is nonsense and contradicted by the manga, there is not much else to say in that regard.

 

[Patryipe]

FFS.

Explain Rokuogan then. It's Haki or Magic. Take your pick.

Clearly Oda was toying with Haki since back then although the concept might not have been fully elaborated. After all Logias like Ace, Smoker and Aokiji had already been introduced, and Luffy had zero chance of defeating them. Forget about covering yourself in water to fight the Mera Mera...

 

[Rivaille]

It will not be the first inconsistency of the story
And it is not the most important to be honest.

 

[HA001]

Zoro had it in alabasta.

 

[ShinmenTakezo]

Just because it might fit a later introduced ability does not negate all the contradictions.

Oda introduced a lot of unexplained abilities with the CP9, from Seimei Kikan, to Kumadori´s fireballs, to Fukuro´s measure ability and the list goes on. Rokougan is just another example.

I see "strengthened" his Haki the same as Blackbeard commented on Luffy´s Haki in Impel Down.

Every living being has Haki, you can easily interpret it as your innate Haki getting stronger and being awakened, similarly to Luffy, who awakened all three colors pre-TS, but could not use them consciously bet in combat.
And while i know that Oda does feature advanced abilities that get explained later on, ACoA is so advanced it really has no place in a fight, Luffy would be destroyed immediately.

All this assuming you even take databooks and vivre cards seriously, which you shouldn´t.

 

[Finalbeta]

Haki would of been overkill unless Luffy could unlock it spontaneously

 

[Patryipe]

Just because it might fit a later introduced ability does not negate all the contradictions.

Oda introduced a lot of unexplained abilities with the CP9, from Seimei Kikan, to Kumadori´s fireballs, to Fukuro´s measure ability and the list goes on. Rokougan is just another example.

I see "strengthened" his Haki the same as Blackbeard commented on Luffy´s Haki in Impel Down.

Every living being has Haki, you can easily interpret it as your innate Haki getting stronger and being awakened, similarly to Luffy, who awakened all three colors pre-TS, but could not use them consciously bet in combat.
And while i know that Oda does feature advanced abilities that get explained later on, ACoA is so advanced it really has no place in a fight, Luffy would be destroyed immediately.

All this assuming you even take databooks and vivre cards seriously, which you shouldn´t.

Aisa had island level CoO in Skipiea.
Boa's sister had CoO and Level 2 Haki, still lost to Luffy.

But the prodigy leading CP9 couldn't have it. Ok, whatever makes you sleep at night.

 

[ShinmenTakezo]

Aisa had island level CoO in Skipiea.
Boa's sister had CoO and Level 2 Haki, still lost to Luffy.

But the prodigy leading CP9 couldn't have it. Ok, whatever makes you sleep at night.

Aisa was born with it, and her ability was unstable.
Boas sisters come from an island famous for haki.

And nothing actually addressed as usual.
But sure, Lucci could use the most advanced coa form before being able to use any other, just accept they were just trying to cover their asses because of a mistake.

 

[Patryipe]

Aisa was born with it, and her ability was unstable.
Boas sisters come from an island famous for haki.

And nothing actually addressed as usual.
But sure, Lucci could use the most advanced coa form before being able to use any other, just accept they were just trying to cover their asses because of a mistake.

Hilarious.

Aisa was born with it so it's ok, but forget about Lucci being trained despite being overwhelming emphasized that the dude was a totally different thing even by CP9 standards. Truly unthinkable.

For all I know and care Lucci could have very well had zero haki, I just find it laughable how people are dismissing the idea outright.

 

[ShinmenTakezo]

Hilarious.

Aisa was born with it so it's ok, but forget about Lucci being trained despite being overwhelming emphasized that the dude was a totally different thing even by CP9 standards. Truly unthinkable.

For all I know and care Lucci could have very well had zero haki, I just find it laughable how people are dismissing the idea outright.

I agree.

Yep she was, hence unrelated.

Completely different things.
I always criticized how cp9 not having haki made no sense considering they were trained as children, that disbelief has nothing to do with them suddenly having it though when it directly contrasicts the manga. How often were luffys advantage against blunt damage mentioned in water 7 and enies lobby, often enough, an advantage that would not exist when they even remotely knew haki.
You have seasoned coa users not even having an idea of advanced coa, there will not suddenly be a roundaway way to acquire it.

Vivre card writers simply contradicted themselves with the cp9 and cp0 cards, and they had two options to remove said contradiction.

 

[Garp the Fist]

The problem is his introduction of CoA was woefully done compared to the other two forms of Haki and he's now going back and retconning stuff to try and fit it in. The lack of Hardening until after the timeskip is the other big sign of this,

From an in-story perspective, CP9 absolutely have to have Haki. It makes no sense for the World Gov to train their top assassins from childhood and for them not to have CoA, which is far and away the most effective tool in fighting DF users. Same as Croc and Moria- they're very clearly meant to have been experienced New World pirates. They should have been using Haki. But Oda hadn't came up with the full details of it until after these characters had featured and been defeated.

 

[Monkey D Theories]

FFS.

Explain Rokuogan then. It's Haki or Magic. Take your pick.

Its a fighting technique that is similar to fishman karate and hasshoken. I hope you are not suggesting that Lucci had penetration haki, an ability whose only known users are Rayleigh and fifth emperor Luffy

 

[sanjikun]

First of all, EVERYONE has Haki. It's whether you can manifest it or not in combat that's the question.

That being said, it makes no sense for him NOT to use it. He was 28 years old and could beat at least half the Vice Admirals in the Navy. Onigumo, out of all people, was hyping him up saying there's nothing more they can do if Rob Lucci was there.

Its a fighting technique that is similar to fishman karate and hasshoken. I hope you are not suggesting that Lucci had penetration haki, an ability whose only known users are Rayleigh and fifth emperor Luffy

We don't know whether it's penetration or something like what Hyogoro/Sentomaru did. But Lucci blasting Haki out of his hands is very feasible.

At the same time, it's not like he could spam Haki blasts. He had to stay stationary with both hands out to use it. Luffy right now can spam it in a gatling form.

 

[HA001]

Wouldnt the finger pistol have killed luffy when he used it if it was haki ?

 

[sanjikun]

Wouldnt the finger pistol have killed luffy when he used it if it was haki ?

Who said that was Haki though? The question is whether he could use it all, not whether every move he used was Haki.

 

[ZenZu]

This is not about Rob Lucci, more about Oda. His failure in properly planning and executing armament haki. You're not doing yourself any favours trying to force some contrived in verse logic into this.

 

[HA001]

Who said that was Haki though? The question is whether he could use it all, not whether every move he used was Haki.

So what was haki then ?
Its been corrected from they learned haki to his haki grew stronger. So which of his moves were haki ?