Powers & Abilities So does everyone agree Enma not a power up now.
- Thread starter Sword God Ryuma
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I think it depends on how people define power ups....
There's no doubt that Zoro will be stronger at the end of the arc with Enma...
But that's not because of Enma itself, but because he trained to use it.
Same way Luffy trained in prison.
Totally different compared to Sanji's RS that immediately gave him a boost and stuff like the Enies Lobby power ups.
So yeah, I wouldn't define Enma a PU, unlike for example G2/G3, Asura and DJ.
There's no doubt that Zoro will be stronger at the end of the arc with Enma...
But that's not because of Enma itself, but because he trained to use it.
Same way Luffy trained in prison.
Totally different compared to Sanji's RS that immediately gave him a boost and stuff like the Enies Lobby power ups.
So yeah, I wouldn't define Enma a PU, unlike for example G2/G3, Asura and DJ.
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That's actually a drawback.
It means you literally WASTE haki for fodders attack (the tree) and if you try a stronger attack it might make you pass out mid battle.
Enma's ability is shit for combat purposes. It's a plot device to enhance Zoro's Haki mastery. And once you've mastered your haki control Enma's ability basically disappears offering no advantage.
It means you literally WASTE haki for fodders attack (the tree) and if you try a stronger attack it might make you pass out mid battle.
Enma's ability is shit for combat purposes. It's a plot device to enhance Zoro's Haki mastery. And once you've mastered your haki control Enma's ability basically disappears offering no advantage.
Is Enma so different from the Raid Suit, though? The sword did in fact immediately gave Zoro a boost as with it he can casually perform very powerful slashes. Sure, he will need to train and adjust himself to the sword because of the haki drain, but so will Sanji so both make the best out of their tools. Let's imagine a scenario with Zoro versus Page One, in which he takes Enma and start throwing significantly stronger slashes that his enemy just can't keep up with at all anymore. But Zoro can't rely on Enma to fight a stronger opponent like King unless he learns how to control it properly, just like Sanji wouldn't fight Queen without proper adjustment to the suit.
(Yes, I know, "Sanji versus Queen isn't confirmed", "Zoro low-diffs Page One without Enma" and so on; for those willing to write those things try to see the big picture instead of the small parts).
Also, Zoro is a tricky guy to define what a power up is or isn't because, at the end of the day, he acquires a power that just stays with him as an inherent part of him. Shusui was a significant upgrade but once he took it he couldn't just switch to another worse sword just like Luffy starts and finishes Gear Fourth. Asura is the only power up that follows said pattern and we haven't seen it for years. I don't think it is reasonable to apply the same standard that we would apply to other characters.
(Yes, I know, "Sanji versus Queen isn't confirmed", "Zoro low-diffs Page One without Enma" and so on; for those willing to write those things try to see the big picture instead of the small parts).
Also, Zoro is a tricky guy to define what a power up is or isn't because, at the end of the day, he acquires a power that just stays with him as an inherent part of him. Shusui was a significant upgrade but once he took it he couldn't just switch to another worse sword just like Luffy starts and finishes Gear Fourth. Asura is the only power up that follows said pattern and we haven't seen it for years. I don't think it is reasonable to apply the same standard that we would apply to other characters.
I've changed my post slightly and made another one right below.
Anyway, my view is fairly simple.
Characters get stronger either through training or through power ups. Training requires time, PU are instantaneous.
DJ, G2/G3, Asura, RS even Shusui, this for me are all instantaneous and therefore PUs.
Udon prison and Enma require time to train. I would even argue that as soon as he picked up Enma Zoro actually got weaker due to its quirk.
But that's my view. Not a very strong opinion anyway, so whatever
Anyway, my view is fairly simple.
Characters get stronger either through training or through power ups. Training requires time, PU are instantaneous.
DJ, G2/G3, Asura, RS even Shusui, this for me are all instantaneous and therefore PUs.
Udon prison and Enma require time to train. I would even argue that as soon as he picked up Enma Zoro actually got weaker due to its quirk.
But that's my view. Not a very strong opinion anyway, so whatever
Shisui is black blade whats your point. Its not a PU. If Zoro trains with Enma and get stronger with his Haki after lets say 20 days. Lets say Zoro throws away Enma and picks up Shisui. He would still do the same with Shisui at that strength. With the Raid suit Sanji puts it on and gets faster,Invisibility etc... Takes it off He doesn't retain that. He never trained. Stop it
It takes the users Haki. Follow along
Lets say Zoro is a 82/100
Zoro trains with Enma for 10 days and he is now a 90/100. If that Zoro puts down Enma and picks up Shisui he is still a 90/100.
Lets say Sanji is a 82/100 without Raidsuit. Puts on Raid suit he is a 89/100. Takes it off he goes back to 82/100 common sense bro
Lets say Zoro is a 82/100
Zoro trains with Enma for 10 days and he is now a 90/100. If that Zoro puts down Enma and picks up Shisui he is still a 90/100.
Lets say Sanji is a 82/100 without Raidsuit. Puts on Raid suit he is a 89/100. Takes it off he goes back to 82/100 common sense bro
I've changed my post slightly and made another one right below.
Anyway, my view is fairly simple.
Characters get stronger either through training or through power ups. Training requires time, PU are instantaneous.
DJ, G2/G3, Asura, RS even Shusui, this for me are all instantaneous and therefore PUs.
Udon prison and Enma require time to train. I would even argue that as soon as he picked up Enma Zoro actually got weaker due to its quirk.
But that's my view. Not a very strong opinion anyway, so whatever
Anyway, my view is fairly simple.
Characters get stronger either through training or through power ups. Training requires time, PU are instantaneous.
DJ, G2/G3, Asura, RS even Shusui, this for me are all instantaneous and therefore PUs.
Udon prison and Enma require time to train. I would even argue that as soon as he picked up Enma Zoro actually got weaker due to its quirk.
But that's my view. Not a very strong opinion anyway, so whatever
Anyways, I get your point and is a valid one.
But if you give Enma to a 82/100 Zoro then he will be able to perform 90/100 slashes casually, slashes that, albeit exhaust their haki quicker, could also allow him to take stronger enemies down equally faster (enemies he may not have been able to defeat before in any way). Sure, he will become stronger as he trains, but same happened with Shusui: Zoro was instantly capable of creating much bigger slashes, but he was also aware that he needed to get used to it and even to "tame" its temper. So I'm pretty confident that, justs like Shusui, Enma will require adjustment but will represent a power up anyways.
Ironically it's a double edged sword because of how the terminology is used, is zoro getting stronger because of his training to further master his haki, or is enma making zoro stronger. I think it's the former. There's a reason though only Oden was able to tame the blade prior to zoro so now the question is as well does him being able to tame enma make him stronger that the scabbards? to that in my opinion yes
It depends.
You see Luffy training to get AdCoA, it is a power-up through training. You see Sanji uses RS that boost his stats and gives invincibility, it is a power-up through tool.
Enma is something between. It is a tool that requires a training to use it, and through this training, it makes you stronger. So, Enma is a TOOL that helps you to get stronger through training with it.
So no.
You see Luffy training to get AdCoA, it is a power-up through training. You see Sanji uses RS that boost his stats and gives invincibility, it is a power-up through tool.
Enma is something between. It is a tool that requires a training to use it, and through this training, it makes you stronger. So, Enma is a TOOL that helps you to get stronger through training with it.
So no.