Powers & Abilities Swordsmanship is All About Haki

[Monkey D Theories]

If Shanks had better haki, his swordsmanship would be better.

Are you just going to ignore the fact that he has only 1 arm?

 

[Cinera]

Are you just going to ignore the fact that he has only 1 arm?

Are you just going to ignore the fact that Mihawk has a Black Blade.

Again:

Zoro's growth as a swordsman during and after the time skip was solely about haki.

Haki is the yardstick by which master swordsmen are measured.

 

[Pringles]

 

[Eagle]

Jesus Christ, you guys still arguing about this?

 

[Rootbeer]

How do you seperate haki from swordsmanship then..

 

[HA001]

He isn’t, he has new stronger versions of those moves

if skill doesn’t matter, why does zoro even use special moves?

Post automatically merged: Aug 31, 2022

Using skill to downplay mihawk is retarded. But saying skill doesn’t matter or that swordsmanship is literally haki is equally retarded.

If Kiku had Mihawk’s haki, she still wouldn’t be able to split an iceberg with a casual slash.

Hes literally using the same moves as ore skip
Just most have HAKI on them

Why didn't mihawk teach zoro skill

Why did he teach him haki

 

[Cinera]

The true graph is the exact opposite lol.

Mihawk > Shanks is simply his superior portrayal as the stronger swordsman.

 

[AkainuTheGrimReaper]

Now they see my understanding of one piece swordsmanship/skills.

It is about haki.

 

[Monkey D Theories]

Hes literally using the same moves as ore skip
Just most have HAKI on them

Why didn't mihawk teach zoro skill

Why did he teach him haki

it literally isn't

we've seen sanzen sekai with haki, its not ISDS. Clearly Mihawk taught him skill and haki.

Idk why you are even arguing this. Mihawk>Shanks is confirmed, you don't need to argue that he has better haki when shanks objectively has better feats and haki doesn't define powerlevels. A swordsman with weaker haki can defeat one with higher haki if he has better skill.

Kiku had better haki than killer and look which one lost their arm

 

[kurohime]

"Mihawk>Shanks"

 

[Monkey D Theories]

Are you just going to ignore the fact that Mihawk has a Black Blade.

Again:

you are acting as if haki defines power level when it doesn't, Luffy has defeated multiple opponents with better haki using skill

also, the black blade has never been portrayed to be a CoC feat, nor is it even confirmed that mihawk made yoru black.

Post automatically merged: Sep 1, 2022

y'all are dense as fuck, i'm done wasting my time on this

 

[BleakAsh]

Then why is zoro still using the same sword skills from pre time skip

Named attack aren't necessarily the only kinda skill in swordsmanship

- Zoro stated that he was able to cut King multiple times in his fight before enma acted up and King flexing his DF that us skill

- Haki complements swrods skill but haki itself is everything to a swrodman

Cabbage (the blond guyfrom dressrosa) with a sword is definitely a better swordman in terms if skill than King is even tho we haven't seem him use Haki to the extent King does

 

[Franosuke]

you are acting as if haki defines power level when it doesn't, Luffy has defeated multiple opponents with better haki using skill

also, the black blade has never been portrayed to be a CoC feat, nor is it even confirmed that mihawk made yoru black.

Post automatically merged: Sep 1, 2022

y'all are dense as fuck, i'm done wasting my time on this

Tbh, I don't think it's the "swordsmanship" part the puts Shanks in a hole. It's the fact that Mihawk is the strongest swordsman, with a title that mirrors Whitebeard & Kaido's. Shanks' swordsmanship being brought up simply reinforces the notion that he is in fact a swordsman.

Some people are taking it to mean that Mihawk's title is specifically/only about sword "skills," but that wasn't what was said.

 

[uyuu]

[No essay this time (or images either, I can't be bothered).]


Introduction
The single most important factor to becoming a stronger swordsman is haki and haki alone. Nothing else (skill, physical strength, endurance, e) even registers. Indeed, it wouldn't be wrong to say that true "sword skill" is just the strength and proficiency of your haki.


Arguments in Favour
Some credible arguments in favour:

• Kozaburo told Zoro that the pinnacle of swordsmanship was the power to protect what you wanted to protect and cut what you want to cut.
  • The ability to cut only that which you want to cut is "Ryuo"
  • Thus, the pinnacle of swordsmanship cannot be reached without Ryuo
• Zoro's bloom in his fight against Daz Bones was a bloom of haki.
  • He subconsciously manifested Busoshoku haki (the breath of all things) and Kenbushoku haki (knowing where the rocks wouldn't fall).
• Zoro's trump card against Pica was Busoshoku coating
  • Indeed, he said that Pica would beat him if only his haki was stronger.
• Luffy's haki teachers were all swordsmen
  • Rayleigh during the time skip
  • Hyougoro during Wano
• As far as we're aware, the only thing Mihawk taught Zoro was haki
  • He specifically forbade Zoro from drinking wine until he mastered coating his swords with Busoshoku haki.
  • Zoro has not other flashbacks showing him learn anything else
• Recall that Zoro asked Mihawk to teach him "the way of the sword".
  • Thus, "the way of the sword" is nothing other than mastery of Haki.
• Black Blades — the pinnacle of swordmanship — are forged through supreme haki
  • Mihawk told this to Zoro
  • Gyukimaru reiterated it
• Only the greatest swordsmen of all time have wielded Black Blades:
  • Former WSS: Ryuma
  • Current WSS: Mihawk
  • Future WSS: Zoro
  • Lesser swordsmen have failed to forge Kokuto
    • Roger
    • Rayleigh
    • Shanks
    • Oden
    • Issho
    • Etc.
• Zoro's growth with Enma was all about mastering his Busoshoku and Haoshoku haki
  • Enma forcibly released his Ryuo, and learning how to wield Enma forced him to temper and master said haki
  • He had to unlock Haoshoku haki to effectively use Enma at all
• King stated that Zoro had "kingly ambitions"
  • Upon witnessing his "King of Hell" mode, he chastised him not to get ahead of himself as Kaido would become the Pirate King
  • That is, King considered Zoro a worthy contender for the Pirate King throne.
• Zoro's big power up post skip was unlocking Haoshoku coating and developing an associated mode: "King of Hell".
  • His big attack against King was entirely dependent on his haki with "skill" and physical strength being completely irrelevant
  • This is his equivalent of Luffy's gears
• Asura may also be a manifestation of Zoro's haki
• It was only after his haki bloom in Wano that Zoro earned the title of "Kengou" (master swordsman)
  • Mastering his ryuo
  • Unlocking Haoshoku
    • He needed this to tame Enma
  • Unlocking Haoshoku coating
  • Unlocking a new mode ("King of Hell") based entirely around Haoshoku coating
  • Unlocking a super move that use massive amounts of Haoshoku coating
• At the end of his fight with King, Zoro stated that he will become "Jigoku no Ou" ("The King of Hell" [and a pun on "The King of Samurai"])
  • This further reiterates how important haki — and Haoshoku haki in particular — is to the pinnacle of swordsmanship

More arguments, courtesy of @Salah WG:



Arguments Against
The credible arguments against:

(They don't exist.)


Conclusions
At the high and top tier, swordsmanship is — as best as we can tell — solely about haki. That is, the statement that Mihawk's swordsmanship surpasses Shanks is a statement that Mihawk's haki surpasses Shanks.

For if Shanks had the superior haki, he would be the superior swordsman.

Spoiler

It should also go without saying, but Mihawk explicitly turned down the Yonkou title, revealing that not only does he have no interest in it, but he could have the title of Yonkou had he wished.

So Shanks' lone — and quite dubious at that — portrayal above Mihawk has been completely discredited.

Mihawk's bounty being above three Yonkou and so close to Shanks while he's a "mere subordinate" is further damming for him.

Nah superior haki is not superior swordsman imo. Kaidou wouldve said Roger who is a swordsman, was at the peak since being a swordsman or swordsmanship transcends all, not haki transcends all. Greenbull wouldve said he felt Shanks' swordsmanship or flying slashes or sword technique that was felt by him, not Shanks CoC. Brannew would say Mihawk the WSS who is stronger than Shanks instead of giving a specific condition of surpassing Shanks in swordsmanship. Kaidou, Greenbull, Brannew would not go out on their way to separate the two stuff if one stuff is under the category of the other instead of its own stuff. Akainu should not have been literally affected by Shanks' CoC presence that served as strength difference measurement, while in comparison each Vista-Jozu-Crocodile was unfazed at the slightest by Mihawk's presence against them.

Thats why Shanks is a weaker swordsman who has stronger haki than Mihawk. Thats my stance even since pre-TS, since Shanks displayed Conqueror's Walk in Moby Dick.

You are a detailed person but often exaggerate some scenes to support Mihawk/Zoro points in lengthy essays. You can try to treat Shanks' haki portrayal, feats, recognition whatever by the same manner, and see what happens.

Finally, Shanks who had made two Admirals unwilling to fight against him by showing his CoC, is Oda's self-insert who is also placed narratively as God Nika Luffy's direct competitor to be PK, after WSC Kaidou, while Oda teased about how does he actually fight. From this accumulation of factors alone, i can say that Oda will not have Shanks be below Mihawk the WSS at all. Shanks' plot support is just too unbelievable.

 

[Sword God Ryuma]

Named attack aren't necessarily the only kinda skill in swordsmanship

- Zoro stated that he was able to cut King multiple times in his fight before enma acted up and King flexing his DF that us skill

- Haki complements swrods skill but haki itself is everything to a swrodman

Cabbage (the blond guyfrom dressrosa) with a sword is definitely a better swordman in terms if skill than King is even tho we haven't seem him use Haki to the extent King does

No he not lmfao. King would destroy him. Simple if King defeats him he stronger in a sword fight

 

[Sword God Ryuma]

Nah superior haki is not superior swordsman imo. Kaidou wouldve said Roger who is a swordsman, was at the peak since being a swordsman or swordsmanship transcends all, not haki transcends all. Greenbull wouldve said he felt Shanks' swordsmanship or flying slashes or sword technique that was felt by him, not Shanks CoC. Brannew would say Mihawk the WSS who is stronger than Shanks instead of giving a specific condition of surpassing Shanks in swordsmanship. Kaidou, Greenbull, Brannew would not go out on their way to separate the two stuff if one stuff is under the category of the other instead of its own stuff. Akainu should not have been literally affected by Shanks' CoC presence that served as strength difference measurement, while in comparison each Vista-Jozu-Crocodile was unfazed at the slightest by Mihawk's presence against them.

Thats why Shanks is a weaker swordsman who has stronger haki than Mihawk. Thats my stance even since pre-TS, since Shanks displayed Conqueror's Walk in Moby Dick.

You are a detailed person but often exaggerate some scenes to support Mihawk/Zoro points in lengthy essays. You can try to treat Shanks' haki portrayal, feats, recognition whatever by the same manner, and see what happens.

Finally, Shanks who had made two Admirals unwilling to fight against him by showing his CoC, is Oda's self-insert who is also placed narratively as God Nika Luffy's direct competitor to be PK, after WSC Kaidou, while Oda teased about how does he actually fight. From this accumulation of factors alone, i can say that Oda will not have Shanks be below Mihawk the WSS at all. Shanks' plot support is just too unbelievable.

1. How does Shanks having strong haki make him not a Swordsman

 

[Buggy D Clown]

What's that got to do with anything?

 

[SakazOuki]

Only the greatest swordsmen of all time have wielded Black Blades

 

[Rootbeer]

What's that got to do with anything?

No Swordsmanship involved.. They are destroying the Mirror World around them..

 

[CbShadow]

you are acting as if haki defines power level when it doesn't, Luffy has defeated multiple opponents with better haki using skill

also, the black blade has never been portrayed to be a CoC feat, nor is it even confirmed that mihawk made yoru black.

Post automatically merged: Sep 1, 2022

y'all are dense as fuck, i'm done wasting my time on this

Haki is a power and it's the strongest power in the manga. It can be used with any fighting style or ability.

Luffy didn't defeat his opponents because he was more skilled than them. He beats his opponents because his attack had more strength/power and he has greater will. He doesn't stop fighting until he wins.

Luffy overpowered Kaido, Doffy and Cracker with his haki attack. While Luffy just didn't give up against Katakuri.

We don't know how black blades are created but Oda has given us a few hints.

Based on information we have I believe black blades are created from CoA and CoC haki. Maybe even CoO but not sure about that haki.

CoA haki gives the blade its black color and hardness. Mihawk hinted at that when he was teaching Zoro blackened haki by telling him if his swords were black blades they wouldn't have broke. A swordsman must possess the strongest blackened haki to make the sword so powerful they don't break.

CoC haki forces the blade to permanently accept the new color and hardness. To master a sword a swordsman must bend the sword to their will. Making a permanent change to a blade goes beyond that and CoC is all about will power so it's the only power in the manga that would allow a user to go beyond that. Plus Shanks showed us CoC haki can physically effects things. His CoC knocked GB out of his element state or caused him to change. A swordsman needs the strongest or highest level CoC to force those changes to their sword.

Not really sure about CoO, but if it is needed it will probably have to do with sensing blades in a way that's sensing people. Or it might be the return of breath of all things.