General & Others Next Straw Hat Crew Members and the Grand Fleet

[Warback]

I think we're all big bois to understand that both Carrot and Yamato we're written like they were meant to join and their endings made no sense, if we didn't have this weird nakama war we could aknowdlege that and wait see what Oda is going to do, because something is either in store for them or Oda is just bipolar.

In fact it's such an obvious fact that we're still discussing these characters a year later, who the fkc is even talking about Smoker or Boa? And Vivi was also a spur of the week thing at this point.

No need to @ me that X or Y was never meant to join, i know diferent opinions exist.

 

[Logiko]

The simplest explaination is the one that requires dozens of paragraphs talking about shining nakama moments, 10 pillars for strawhat eligibility, False allies/enemies parrallels and a bunch of other stuff that just fits under "character who isn't boring". Sure buddy.

Those are not difficult concept in actual writing, those are just choices. The simplest answer is that Oda interiorized those choices.

Oda doesnt actually have to break convention, because again, he doesn't keep any of the rules you have in mind when deciding who joins.

THose arules are fitting all the strawhats so yes.

1. Not a celestial dragon

Why ?

2. not a logia

Why ?

3. Were not boring in there arc

Fair enough but that falls under one one my golden rule (be relevant in the story)

4. They all wore footwear at some point,

Fair enough.

5. they all sailed on the sunny....

Why ?

Yeah it's like i said you view any character that's a good guy that turns out to be a bad guy to be this false whatever

That's what false allies are mate. Its not rocket science.

I guess you think Blueno is an false ally, this random character that showed up once before being revelead to be a villain.

Yes, just a irrelevant one.

Again like i said completly loose with terms

No. There can be numbers of false ally and false adversary in one story if the story is good enough. Those are just more relevant than others. Just like there are main and secondary protagonists and main and secondary antagonists.

I think we're all big bois to understand that both Carrot and Yamato we're written like they were meant to join and their endings made no sense

Yamato was never meant to join

No need to @ me that X or Y was never meant to join, i know diferent opinions exist.

Too bad already did and its not an opinion, its a storytelling fact for once.

 

[DavyJones]

LOL that reaction made me crack up. Carrot being co-Queen would be okay if she actually was interested and Neku and Inu were staying to teach her. Like, fuck, just park Zou outside of Wano, and go back and forth.

Momo's 8, yeah, but he comes from a country where royalty runs the government, and he has Sukiyaki, the former Shogun, Hiyori, Kinemon, and Denjiro to help him when it comes to managing things.

Neku and Inu are just like "Hey, teenage rabbit, take over this country, we're retiring to Wano." LIKE, NO, MAN, WTF?!?!? Adults in this series are horrible at taking responsibility at times.

Wizaru will find a way. I think Bonney's going to the Revs because her enemy is the Celestial Dragons, just like Dragon/Sabo. But, I really like Bonney now, and would like her to sail with the crew. Yamato's a lock, it's just annoying she got left behind. Oda's just invested way too much narrative space into Yamato and Vivi to leave them behind. Carrot got a bit less, but, still, she had a tragic mentor death involving a guy who wanted to help find the One Piece, and Inherited Pedro's Will in the process.

Characters who sail on the Sunny for a good period of time and act as a part of the crew at that time generally have good chances in One Piece. Either way, those characters become big parts of the plot, if not Nakama. Look at Law.

Do you have any idea how much Usopp fans wish Usopp got what Law got in this series????????

Just becoming Nakama doesn't even mean you'll get better screen time. Chopper HAD WAY MORE impact back in the day. But, as characters like Law and Yamato began showing up, his screen time and presence just died at times.

Even if Yamato does join soon, Yamato has so little connection to crew members outside of Luffy (and technically Momo, I guess), that it's going to be hard to integrate her in naturally. Carrot and Vivi don't have that problem since they're already familiar with most of the Straw Hats, with Vivi not knowing Jinbei, Franky, and Brook, and having known Robin only as an enemy.

Even if Yamato spent a bunch of time hanging out with the crew post-Raid, we barely saw any of that. Wish the anime had filler of Yamato interacting with the other crew members while Luffy and Zoro were out.

Carrot, Vivi fit the mold already but dont forget new nakama awkwardness is basically a ritual. Happened with Robin, Jinbei and Brook so I don't feel it will be as big an issue as it seems now.

Its mostly a meme, but I genuinely could see Kizaru's joining if he really is just broken by the WG. It'd be cool to see the SH crew to show him a dream he never knew he had. If Jinbei can want fishman equality and Ussop to be a brave warrior, I'm sure Kizaru could fight for a world where Justice isn't unclear and his close friend can continue to make the world a better place.

Post automatically merged: Oct 20, 2023

Adding that it would parallel Blackbeards acquisition of Kuzan, who almost certainly joined for prime backstab positioning (especially since almost everyone is convinced it was genuine). Borsalino could join the SHs with most of them suspicious of him expecting a backstab, but unlike Kuzan, Kizaru is actually all about the Straw Hats mission statement.

 

[Warback]

No. There can be numbers of false ally and false adversary in one story if the story is good enough. Those are just more relevant than others. Just like there are main and secondary protagonists and main and secondary antagonists.


Yamato was never meant to join



Too bad already did and its not an opinion, its a storytelling fact for once.

You're really hopeless.

 

[CoC: Color of Clowns]

Carrot, Vivi fit the mold already but dont forget new nakama awkwardness is basically a ritual. Happened with Robin, Jinbei and Brook so I don't feel it will be as big an issue as it seems now.

Its mostly a meme, but I genuinely could see Kizaru's joining if he really is just broken by the WG. It'd be cool to see the SH crew to show him a dream he never knew he had. If Jinbei can want fishman equality and Ussop to be a brave warrior, I'm sure Kizaru could fight for a world where Justice isn't unclear and his close friend can continue to make the world a better place.

Straw Hat Pirate, Kizaru

Role on the Crew: Dealer​

Kizaru: Baking Bad​

"He Smoked"

 

[Logiko]

You're really hopeless.

If you say so

 

[DavyJones]

I think we're all big bois to understand that both Carrot and Yamato we're written like they were meant to join and their endings made no sense, if we didn't have this weird nakama war we could aknowdlege that and wait see what Oda is going to do, because something is either in store for them or Oda is just bipolar.

In fact it's such an obvious fact that we're still discussing these characters a year later, who the fkc is even talking about Smoker or Boa? And Vivi was also a spur of the week thing at this point.

No need to @ me that X or Y was never meant to join, i know diferent opinions exist.

An angle we all ignore too is that Oda might be human, and may have just planned a SH addition that he bailed out on. I know he's Goda and all that, but sometimes a storyline might not pan out well and our attachment to certain characters might make his decisionshard to swallow at times.

 

[Warback]

If you say so

You take my concialitory post about Yamato and Carrot, and say Yamato never was meant to join it's a "fAcT", my guy it's like you're trying to make me be against Carrot, because as people said a thousand times, you were wrong about Carrot.

So you saying Yamato not joining is a fact means nothing honestly. She might, she might not, I'm not Oda and neither are you.


You're not here because you want to express some knowledge or share some theories with "audiences" you just want drama, you're purposely provocative.

Post automatically merged: Oct 20, 2023

An angle we all ignore too is that Oda might be human, and may have just planned a SH addition that he bailed out on. I know he's Goda and all that, but sometimes a storyline might not pan out well and our attachment to certain characters might make his decisionshard to swallow at times.

I'm not sure why he would bail out on two potential new SHs, it's not like most SH aren't treated as background characters, Oda could just not write 50145106 characters per arc and focus on the main cast a bit.

 

[Logiko]

You take my concialitory post about Yamato and Carrot, and say Yamato never was meant to join it's a "fAcT", my guy it's like you're trying to make me be against Carrot, because as people said a thousand times, you were wrong about Carrot.

I never ever and ever said that Carrot joining was a storytelling fact. It has always been a theory. But I also always said and from the beginning that Yamato not joining was most likely factual. For a simple reason, a concept I called subversive affirmation that I therefore theorized but a real storytelling tool nonetheless and used all the time in fiction. For a brief on that concept. Go check that page on my blog, its not perfect but it works.

HERE

She might, she might not, I'm not Oda and neither are you.

Now Yamato story arc is over. To join, Yamato would need a whole other storyline created from scratch which is why while still possible, its very unlikely.

You're not here because you want to express some knowledge or share some theories with "audiences" you just want drama, you're purposely provocative.

NOthing in what I say is provocative. Only your reactions (of you guys as a group) are. I say things as they are. When I theorize I say that its a theory, when I notice a factual storytelling concept I note the factual concept. Yamato was never meant to join. This is not a provocation, this is a simple statement. If you guys feel threatened by it its not my fault.

In fact, the one who should be angry is me. Because the one who are causing drama is you guys. On my post on this forum, I'm simply and I mean really SIMPLY applicating and sharing the knowledge I have about storytelling. The reaction: "you know nothing logiko snow". AFter two years I should be frustrated, I should be angry in front off so much blissfull ignorance and so much smugness in front of actual knowledge.. but no, I keep explaining, I never stop. I keep the pedagogy going for those who actually want to listen and I never get angry.

So please, check yourself before you say "you just want drama". From my perspective, I should not even waste my time with you guys as you don't understand a single concept that I use or constantly and I mean SYSTEMATICALLY question the legitimacy of a new or older concept because ...

.. because what in fact ? Are you afraid to learn ? Are you afraid of complexity ? Are you afraid that I might be right ? What are you afraid of ?

 

[Warback]

So please, check yourself before you say "you just want drama". From my perspective, I should not even waste my time with you guys as you don't understand a single concept that I use or constantly and I mean SYSTEMATICALLY question the legitimacy of a new or older concept because ...

.. because what in fact ? Are you afraid to learn ? Are you afraid of complexity ? Are you afraid that I might be right ? What are you afraid of ?

You're not going to teach me anything new, noone is afraid of you being right, the problem is that you say shit like :

"But I also always said and from the beginning that Yamato not joining was most likely factual. For a simple reason, a concept I called subversive affirmation "

That doesn't mean anything, just because you subvert expectations doesn't mean that subversion is going to be a fact.

Shanks being a secret villain would also be subversive, it doesn't mean it's going to happen.

This is thoroughly pointless, you wanna keep postulating here sure by all means, but i personally am not going to engage you anymore

 

[Logiko]

You're not going to teach me anything new, noone is afraid of you being right, the problem is that you say shit like :

That's cool so at least don't deligitimize what I say, basic gentleman rule :)

That doesn't mean anything, just because you subvert expectations doesn't mean that subversion is going to be a fact.

DId you read the page ? Did you read what subversive affirmation was ? (and not subversive expectation)

Shanks being a secret villain would also be subversive, it doesn't mean it's going to happen.

This has nothing to do with the concept of subversive affirmation.

This is thoroughly pointless, you wanna keep postulating here sure by all means, but i personally am not going to engage you anymore

You do you.

 

[Warback]

I dont have to argue this, youre claiming something about the future of a story, youre not writting, is a fact, its non sense.

 

[Logiko]

I dont have to argue this, youre claiming something about the future of a story, youre not writting, is a fact, its non sense.

Do you deny that it is impossible to predict future elements of stories because of previous elements ?

 

[Mr. Reloaded]

Conforming

Thank you autocorrect

 

[CoC: Color of Clowns]

Thank you autocorrect

LOL I WAS WONDERING WHY YOU POSTED THAT

 

[Warback]

Do you deny that it is impossible to predict future elements of stories because of previous elements ?

Do.. do you not know the diference between a fact and a prediction?

I can predict that Luffy's final bounty is going to be 5.656.000.000 at the end of the story, it doesn't mean it's a fact even if it happens

 

[Logiko]

Do.. do you not know the diference between a fact and a prediction?

I can predict that Luffy's final bounty is going to be 5.656.000.000 at the end of the story, it doesn't mean it's a fact even if it happens

When storytelling tools are in usage, yes, its factual

 

[Warback]

 

[Ravagerblade]

Can't make much sense out of him.

 

[Logiko]

Can't make much sense out of him.

Read the things I wrote carefully. Maybe it will make sence. Just maybe lol