Controversial Marines have in no way shape or form the moral high ground above ANY pirate crew and I am tired of people acting like they do.

[Malick the last Light]

I have recently seen to many people prop up the Marines as supposedly being somehow better than Pirates in the Akainu/Sengoku/Kong eras. And not just from Admiral-stans but from other people too this belief of the Marines being "better" than Pirates seems rather widespread. And to be real? I just want people to legit attempt and explain how and why that is the case?

We are not talking about some EOS version of the Marines led by people like Fuji, Smoker or Coby okay? Because the Marines thus far are LITERALLY just a Yonko crew with extra steps.

That is ALL they are when you pull away what they SHOULD be and examine what they ACTUALLY are.

They serve the Celestial Dragons as soldiers, bodyguards, tax collectors and, if need be, baby killers. They literally carpet bomb islands out of existence at their command no questions asked.

Monkey D. "I was just following orders" Garp has stuck with the Marines not only after God Valley where he saved the Celestial Dragons from Rocks while they were literally in the process of genociding the local island. And he is considered “one of the good ones” by the way.

The aptly named Native Hunting Competition is a triennial contest for fucks sake. The fact people like Garp and Sengoku have stuck with the Marines after seeing them literally hunt down and kill every woman they could get their hands on that VAGUELY could have been the mother of Rogers child speaks volumes about their character at least to me.

All the evil shit the Celestial Dragons are up to in the story thus far was not carried out hush hush behind doors by some CP0 agents okay? Marines did that shit. Garp is not blind. He specifically knows how fucked the system he works for is since he avoided promotion to not directly serve Celestial Dragons as bodyguards. So I must ask the question why and how are the Marines better than even the WORST pirates exactly?

I am not even bringing up the Strawhats here or some shit. Compare them to Blackbeard and Kid for all I care, how in the hell do they come of as superior on a moral level even with them?

What the fuck do the civilians care if they are being killed/enslaved by Pirates or World Nobles?

What actual difference is there between a Yonko like Big Mom making her island pay her each month with sweets and the Marines playing text collects for the heavenly tribute to the Holy land?

Especially considering how powerful the Admiral Agenda and its supporters claim the Marines to be, namely them being the strongest force of the entire setting with some still saying Akainu will be Luffys final fight I have to ask you all this.

Why are these supposedly morally good and super strong people that are oh so superior to Yonko behaving in this manner? Why doesn't Akainu or Prime Garp and Prime Sengoku walk into the Holy Land, jail all Celestial Dragons, and call it a day?

Slavery is still illegal right, and Akainus whole thing is Absolute Justice right? So he ought to get up from the desk and start doing his job enforcing the law instead of looking the other way when they commit a crime. Or, as he has done in the past, going a step further and burning down a ship of civilians at their behest.

That guy is currently Fleet Admiral btw so even though he killed more innocents than pretty much every Pirates we see in the setting via that one moment alone that sure as fuck didn’t hurt his chances at promotion.

So, my main question to this Forum to check what people think on here: Are the Marines morally superior to the Yonko?

 

[Sasaki Kojirō]

It was missing to add that they protect those who enslave, it's no different from Kaidou

 

[Malick the last Light]

It was missing to add that they protect those who enslave, it's no different from Kaidou

I sort of thought I implied it enough with "What the fuck do the civilians care if they are being killed or enslaved by pirates or world nobles?"

But just to be safe, yeah, the Marines protect Celestial Dragons and not only ignore the fact that they keep slaves, but furthermore seemingly condone the various slave houses they purchase their slaves at, as well as the slavers who operate them at the behest of the Celestial Dragon overlords.

I don't know about anybody else, but this does not seem like something a faction that could be described as even vaguely good on a moral level would do, but hey, that might just be.

 

[Just a member]

I didn't see these claims anyway of course there is no white and black knights. The marines are the shield and sword of the CDs who are the worst scum in the whole series then you have good guys like Garp but even trash like Greenbull and all that is between. Same for yonkos, you can have slavers, mass murderers etc. like Kaido, BM or BB and relatively good guys like Shanks or Luffy.

 

[Malick the last Light]

I didn't see these claims anyway of course there is no white and black knights. The marines are the shield and sword of the CDs who are the worst scum in the whole series then you have good guys like Garp but even trash like Greenbull and all that is between. Same for yonkos, you can have slavers, mass murderers etc. like Kaido, BM or BB and relatively good guys like Shanks or Luffy.

How is Garp a good guy?

How is the man who served as the Celestial Dragons willing propaganda tool, and who knows full well of all the evil the people he works for do on a regular basis, a good guy? Garp, who, by the way, as his biggest fans often remind us, is the only real Hakiman and Rogers equal, was at God Valley. He knows what the Marines did to Ace and all the other children and their mothers who were not lucky enough to escape the Marines.

I am sorry, but am I reading a different manga from other people? If any character knew like half the shit Garp and still chose to remain a Marine, he is no longer a good guy at least to me.

Plus, I know people like to ignore this, but Garp also had Dragon as an option, at the very least. If THE Marine Hero just stood up and said "enough is enough" and joined Dragon in his revolution instead of continuously ignoring the system he works for is evil, the story might be over right now. People get that, right?

The revolutionaries are already turning countries to their side more and more in the story right now without any support from Garp as far as we know. If they DID have Garps help? Who knows what sort of utopia the world could look like right now.

Instead, what has "the hero" done tha gets him looked at with such fondness? He sure as fuck was not busy raising any of the three kids with top-tier potential himself to be better than he was. He instead gave them over a mountain bandit (the true and only parental figure any of them would ever have, but still).

I mean for fucks sake he would not even have Koby with him if it was not for Luffy!

 

[MonochromeYoru]

Marines aren't pure good. but they're a hell of a lot better than most pirates who rape and pillage innocents.

 

[Marco Vipsanio Agrippa]

the only explanation is that the Marines have no interest in politics. One who enlists does so to defend civilians from pirates, not to honor the celestial dragons. is he wrong? obviously, as you wrote, the celestial dragons do horrible things like Big Mom and Kaido. Those who choose to join the Marines do so because they think it is better to serve/ally with a corrupt government than to see pirates and criminals have more power.

 

[Just a member]

How is Garp a good guy?

How is the man who served as the Celestial Dragons willing propaganda tool, and who knows full well of all the evil the people he works for do on a regular basis, a good guy? Garp, who, by the way, as his biggest fans often remind us, is the only real Hakiman and Rogers equal, was at God Valley. He knows what the Marines did to Ace and all the other children and their mothers who were not lucky enough to escape the Marines.

I am sorry, but am I reading a different manga from other people? If any character knew like half the shit Garp and still chose to remain a Marine, he is no longer a good guy at least to me.

Plus, I know people like to ignore this, but Garp also had Dragon as an option, at the very least. If THE Marine Hero just stood up and said "enough is enough" and joined Dragon in his revolution instead of continuously ignoring the system he works for is evil, the story might be over right now. People get that, right?

The revolutionaries are already turning countries to their side more and more in the story right now without any support from Garp as far as we know. If they DID have Garps help? Who knows what sort of utopia the world could look like right now.

Instead, what has "the hero" done tha gets him looked at with such fondness? He sure as fuck was not busy raising any of the three kids with top-tier potential himself to be better than he was. He instead gave them over a mountain bandit (the true and only parental figure any of them would ever have, but still).

I mean for fucks sake he would not even have Koby with him if it was not for Luffy!

Ok, he is not a snowflake, also some of your points are a bit of a speculation anyway I still put him in the "good guys" basket when there are people like Akainu or even Kizaru and a ton of other corrupted marines (not to talk about Kaido/BM or BB).

 

[Malick the last Light]

Marines aren't pure good. but they're a hell of a lot better than most pirates who rape and pillage innocents.

As opposed to the Celestial Dragons, who treat innocents far better, am I right? Just because the Celestials like to handle the rape part of raping and pillaging themselves does not mean they don't send Marines to pillage on their behalf, by the way. Or use them to protect themselves from anybody trying to fight back. Because they totally do.

The Marines cannot serve the Celestial Dragons, carry out their orders, and then act like they are not responsible for their actions. And to be real, I have yet to see any pirate crew do shit on the level of God Valley and the human hunts that happen on a very regular basis like it.

I have never seen a Pirate straight up eradicate an island for NO reason or just because they were told to by anybody, but the Marines totally do that with buster calls.

 

[Sir Tuna Sandwich II]

Shut up.
No one care about your opinion.
Papazuki >>>

 

[Malick the last Light]

Ok, he is not a snowflake, also some of your points are a bit of a speculation anyway I still put him in the "good guys" basket when there are people like Akainu or even Kizaru and a ton of other corrupted marines (not to talk about Kaido/BM or BB).

What exactly is speculation in my post? Because if you mean to imply that anything in what I said is up for debate, it really is not. Koby and MABYE even Smokers generation not knowing some of the stuff that being a Marine serving the World Government means? Okay I can sorrta see that.

But Garp? Garp not only knows about the worst of the worst but has both enough importance but ought to be actually strong enough himself to facilitate change. He just doesn't give a shit, or at least not enough to ever try and be more than the WG lapdog.

Post automatically merged: Mar 11, 2024

Shut up.
No one care about your opinion.
Papazuki >>>

You cared enough to comment didn't you?

 

[Paperchampion23]

I have recently seen to many people prop up the Marines as supposedly being somehow better than Pirates in the Akainu/Sengoku/Kong eras. And not just from Admiral-stans but from other people too this belief of the Marines being "better" than Pirates seems rather widespread. And to be real? I just want people to legit attempt and explain how and why that is the case?

We are not talking about some EOS version of the Marines led by people like Fuji, Smoker or Coby okay? Because the Marines thus far are LITERALLY just a Yonko crew with extra steps.

That is ALL they are when you pull away what they SHOULD be and examine what they ACTUALLY are.

They serve the Celestial Dragons as soldiers, bodyguards, tax collectors and, if need be, baby killers. They literally carpet bomb islands out of existence at their command no questions asked.

Monkey D. "I was just following orders" Garp has stuck with the Marines not only after God Valley where he saved the Celestial Dragons from Rocks while they were literally in the process of genociding the local island. And he is considered “one of the good ones” by the way.

The aptly named Native Hunting Competition is a triennial contest for fucks sake. The fact people like Garp and Sengoku have stuck with the Marines after seeing them literally hunt down and kill every woman they could get their hands on that VAGUELY could have been the mother of Rogers child speaks volumes about their character at least to me.

All the evil shit the Celestial Dragons are up to in the story thus far was not carried out hush hush behind doors by some CP0 agents okay? Marines did that shit. Garp is not blind. He specifically knows how fucked the system he works for is since he avoided promotion to not directly serve Celestial Dragons as bodyguards. So I must ask the question why and how are the Marines better than even the WORST pirates exactly?

I am not even bringing up the Strawhats here or some shit. Compare them to Blackbeard and Kid for all I care, how in the hell do they come of as superior on a moral level even with them?

What the fuck do the civilians care if they are being killed/enslaved by Pirates or World Nobles?

What actual difference is there between a Yonko like Big Mom making her island pay her each month with sweets and the Marines playing text collects for the heavenly tribute to the Holy land?

Especially considering how powerful the Admiral Agenda and its supporters claim the Marines to be, namely them being the strongest force of the entire setting with some still saying Akainu will be Luffys final fight I have to ask you all this.

Why are these supposedly morally good and super strong people that are oh so superior to Yonko behaving in this manner? Why doesn't Akainu or Prime Garp and Prime Sengoku walk into the Holy Land, jail all Celestial Dragons, and call it a day?

Slavery is still illegal right, and Akainus whole thing is Absolute Justice right? So he ought to get up from the desk and start doing his job enforcing the law instead of looking the other way when they commit a crime. Or, as he has done in the past, going a step further and burning down a ship of civilians at their behest.

That guy is currently Fleet Admiral btw so even though he killed more innocents than pretty much every Pirates we see in the setting via that one moment alone that sure as fuck didn’t hurt his chances at promotion.

So, my main question to this Forum to check what people think on here: Are the Marines morally superior to the Yonko?

They arent, this is why this speech from Doflamingo exists

 

[MonochromeYoru]

As opposed to the Celestial Dragons, who treat innocents far better, am I right? Just because the Celestials like to handle the rape part of raping and pillaging themselves does not mean they don't send Marines to pillage on their behalf, by the way. Or use them to protect themselves from anybody trying to fight back. Because they totally do.

The Marines cannot serve the Celestial Dragons, carry out their orders, and then act like they are not responsible for their actions. And to be real, I have yet to see any pirate crew do shit on the level of God Valley and the human hunts that happen on a very regular basis like it.

I have never seen a Pirate straight up eradicate an island for NO reason or just because they were told to by anybody, but the Marines totally do that with buster calls.

Marines aren't the celestials. There's plenty of marines opposed to the wg. But since the wg have enough power to quell any rebellion, they can't openly oppose them.

Without the marines, the entire world is in chaos.


Kaido literally enslaved an island for weapons manufacturing...

Kidd literally has attacked civilians...

BB and his crewmates like Vasco and Devon are on panel saying they wanna rape...



The celestials are scum. Majority of the pirates are scum too.

But majority of the marines are good.

 

[mmd]

Shut up.
No one care about your opinion.
Papazuki >>>

No
Don lee pancake

 

[Malick the last Light]

Marines aren't the celestials retard. There's plenty of marines opposed to the wg. But since the wg have enough power to quell any rebellion, they can't openly oppose them.

Without the marines, the entire world is in chaos.


Kaido literally enslaved an island for weapons manufacturing...

Kidd literally has attacked civilians...

BB and his crewmates like Vasco and Devon are on panel saying they wanna rape...



The celestials are scum. Majority of the pirates are scum too.

But majority of the marines are good.

Nah, they are just their lap dogs that do all their dirty work for them you are right, much better.



Also why the fuck cant they openly opoose them?

What, is the entire Navy, all Admirals plus their Cherished One scarred of CP0 and the Gorosei or something? They don't even know that Imu fucking exists, so they can hardly be them that they are so afraid of, right?

I am constantly told the Admirals are the WG's strongest force, so what the fuck is this argument that they just can't oppose the World Government? Why not?

Why the fuck can Dragon do it then and basically start a world revolution on his own, but Garp and Sengoku in their prime for example couldn't fucking do shit? Is the argument here that they aren't evil, just really fucking stupid and lazy, or what?

 

[Kizaruber Eats]

 

[Just a member]

What exactly is speculation in my post? Because if you mean to imply that anything in what I said is up for debate, it really is not. Koby and MABYE even Smokers generation not knowing some of the stuff that being a Marine serving the World Government means? Okay I can sorrta see that.

But Garp? Garp not only knows about the worst of the worst but has both enough importance but ought to be actually strong enough himself to facilitate change. He just doesn't give a shit, or at least not enough to ever try and be more than the WG lapdog.

The speculation part was about Garp joining Dragon. He is not Gandhi but still has his list of good deeds: kept Ace safe for Roger and Luffy for Garp (then I agree he just sent them to that bandit woman), went to save Coby when nobody else gave a damn about him. He is the grandad of Luffy and father of Dragon, they do good deeds but at the same time are no heroes. Or at the very least I think they can be counted among the "good" people in this manga (even if in the end even Garp, or Luffy himself, can be contested like you did).

 

[AkainuTheGrimReaper]

That is like asking to usa military why they didn't kill elties when they control usa military.

Is elites stronger than usa military with your logic?

George soros as old man literally control politics, media . He is old man so why we didn't kill him yet ?

 

[Herrera95]

Yes marines are superior morally speaking. They are meant to protect while pirates are selfish and just care about themselves.

Even when Akainu, Aokiji and Kizaru for example takes hard decisions and do some harm even against their will it is for a greater good.

 

[SakazOuki]

This is a conclusion I’d expect from a 10 year old, or your average OP fan at that