Controversial RELIGIONS & SPIRITUALITIES : Conversations
- Thread starter Logiko
- Start date
What? Did you even read my post fully? I was explaining why circumcision in Judaism and why it isn't in Christianism.
In Christian theology, God is timeless(atemporal and infinite). He has no beginning or ending. God IS. In Christian belief, God isn't caused by anything, but is the cause of everything. A God cannot have a beginning or cause ,because this would contradict what being a God means.
“The evidence is in, and the consensus of cosmologists is that the universe didn’t used to be here.”
Interesting reading,:
https://renew.org/where-did-god-come-from/
Muslims make a similar argument it seems:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalam_cosmological_argument#:~:text=The most prominent form of,the universe has a cause.
Jesus did say that circumcision or uncircumcision didn't mean anything. "Circumcise your heart".
Jeremiah 4:4 Circumcise yourselves to the LORD, remove the foreskins of your hearts, O men of Judah and people of Jerusalem. Otherwise, My wrath will break out like fire and burn with no one to extinguish it, because of your evil deeds."
Jeremiah 9:25 "Behold, the days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will punish all who are circumcised yet uncircumcised:
Romans 2:26 If a man who is not circumcised keeps the requirements of the law, will not his uncircumcision be regarded as circumcision? A man is not a Jew because he is one outwardly, nor is circumcision only outward and physical.
Romans 2:29 No, a man is a Jew because he is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a man's praise does not come from men, but from God.
Galatians 5:6 For in Christ neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. All that matters is faith, expressed through love
Colossians 2:11 In Him you were also circumcised in the putting off of your sinful nature, with the circumcision performed by Christ and not by human hands.
Corinthians 7:19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing. Keeping God's commandments is what matters.
Deuteronomy 10:16 Circumcise your hearts, therefore, and stiffen your necks no more.
Deuteronomy 30:6 The LORD your God will circumcise your hearts and the hearts of your descendants, and you will love Him with all your heart and all your soul, so that you may live.
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In Christian theology, God is timeless(atemporal and infinite). He has no beginning or ending. God IS. In Christian belief, God isn't caused by anything, but is the cause of everything. A God cannot have a beginning or cause ,because this would contradict what being a God means.
“The evidence is in, and the consensus of cosmologists is that the universe didn’t used to be here.”
Interesting reading,:
https://renew.org/where-did-god-come-from/
Muslims make a similar argument it seems:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalam_cosmological_argument#:~:text=The most prominent form of,the universe has a cause.
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well people can choose to believe on bad/no evidence, but they better not expect me to join in.
other than that, i dont think science over religion needs to be the case. religion offers alot to people that they wont just find in science, and thats fine. there are also plenty irreligious people who dont value science or care about it.
emphasis on "could".
he just posted some bible quotes on circumcision though
@NAMELESS i have heard about one of the apocryphal gospels having jesus rejecting circumcision on the premise that humans are created in the image of god. i dont quite remember which one though. have you heard about this?
other than that, i dont think science over religion needs to be the case. religion offers alot to people that they wont just find in science, and thats fine. there are also plenty irreligious people who dont value science or care about it.
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emphasis on "could".
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he just posted some bible quotes on circumcision though
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@NAMELESS i have heard about one of the apocryphal gospels having jesus rejecting circumcision on the premise that humans are created in the image of god. i dont quite remember which one though. have you heard about this?
Jeremiah 4:4 Circumcise yourselves to the LORD, remove the foreskins of your hearts, O men of Judah and people of Jerusalem. Otherwise, My wrath will break out like fire and burn with no one to extinguish it, because of your evil deeds."
Jeremiah 9:25 "Behold, the days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will punish all who are circumcised yet uncircumcised:
Romans 2:26 If a man who is not circumcised keeps the requirements of the law, will not his uncircumcision be regarded as circumcision? A man is not a Jew because he is one outwardly, nor is circumcision only outward and physical.
Romans 2:29 No, a man is a Jew because he is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a man's praise does not come from men, but from God.
Galatians 5:6 For in Christ neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. All that matters is faith, expressed through love
Colossians 2:11 In Him you were also circumcised in the putting off of your sinful nature, with the circumcision performed by Christ and not by human hands.
Corinthians 7:19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing. Keeping God's commandments is what matters.
Deuteronomy 10:16 Circumcise your hearts, therefore, and stiffen your necks no more.
Deuteronomy 30:6 The LORD your God will circumcise your hearts and the hearts of your descendants, and you will love Him with all your heart and all your soul, so that you may live.
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im well aware, just pointing out an issue with that and your previous claim that the universe needs an intelligence behind it because its complex.
either that is true (and then it must be true for god as well), or it isnt and the universe can be a thing without any intelligence behind it.
i would need some source about the bolded part.
because as far as i am aware, that premise of the kalam isnt justfied
and yeah, its used by muslims and christians, which also sets off an alarm with me, because it then doesnt point to any particular god. could as well be some entity that kickstarted everything and didnt do shit since then.
i take this as a no.
eventually i wanna read the apocryphal gospels in the future though.
either that is true (and then it must be true for god as well), or it isnt and the universe can be a thing without any intelligence behind it.
i would need some source about the bolded part.
because as far as i am aware, that premise of the kalam isnt justfied
and yeah, its used by muslims and christians, which also sets off an alarm with me, because it then doesnt point to any particular god. could as well be some entity that kickstarted everything and didnt do shit since then.
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i take this as a no.
eventually i wanna read the apocryphal gospels in the future though.
I heard that argument before somewhere. I agree with it. Still, how come can something be generated out of nothing. God cannot have a beginning or else that would create a infinite loop of cause and effect. If god has a cause,that cause itself has a beginning of it owns and this would repeat infinitely and we now that isn't possible because our Universe is finite,therefore God isn't caused by anything,but is the cause of everything.
As i just said to Logiko, God isn't subjected to the laws of our universe. If God had a beginning,that would create an infinite loop,because whatever originated God would certainly have an origin of its own and this would perpetuate forever,which is not possible since our universe is finite.
I don't think a have a link for that, i took that from that text. Its right in the middle of it.
If this was the case,we would have an infinite loop. A Paradox basically. You see why God cannot have a cause now?
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As i just said to Logiko, God isn't subjected to the laws of our universe. If God had a beginning,that would create an infinite loop,because whatever originated God would certainly have an origin of its own and this would perpetuate forever,which is not possible since our universe is finite.
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I don't think a have a link for that, i took that from that text. Its right in the middle of it.
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If this was the case,we would have an infinite loop. A Paradox basically. You see why God cannot have a cause now?
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so special pleading as i predicted.
baseless
so the universe doesnt need an intelligence deity behind it because of its complexity.
while i also think this is likely to be the case, we dont have, and never had, this supposed "nothing" to conclusively know whether anything can come from it
baseless
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so the universe doesnt need an intelligence deity behind it because of its complexity.
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while i also think this is likely to be the case, we dont have, and never had, this supposed "nothing" to conclusively know whether anything can come from it
im referring to this post, where you say the complexity of the universe points to an intelligence orchestrating it.
but the same isnt true for god, despite gods complexity. so the first claim doesnt apply.
i agree. and its a bummer that i will be tortured for eternity because im just not convinced
but the same isnt true for god, despite gods complexity. so the first claim doesnt apply.
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i agree. and its a bummer that i will be tortured for eternity because im just not convinced
im referring to this post, where you say the complexity of the universe points to an intelligence orchestrating it.
but the same isnt true for god, despite gods complexity. so the first claim doesnt apply.
i agree. and its a bummer that i will be tortured for eternity because im just not convinced
but the same isnt true for god, despite gods complexity. so the first claim doesnt apply.
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i agree. and its a bummer that i will be tortured for eternity because im just not convinced
oh ok,you are talking about God in the bible. Here are the quotes:
https://biblehub.com/revelation/1-8.htm
https://biblehub.com/revelation/1-8.htm
