Character Discussion Does Big Mom Get Any Sympathy
- Thread starter Longleg Larry
- Start date
I mean, that was a big ol smack...with a spiked bat 
Maybe I'm salty, cuz Katakuri being a Big Brother Dragon,
Maybe I'm salty, cuz Katakuri being a Big Brother Dragon,
Kaidou showed interest in having a Devil Fruit after Whitebeard’s demonstration.
A bit later, Big Mom discovers that God Valley has Devil Fruits, and Kaidou asks to find out what their powers are.
During that time, it becomes clear that after learning about the Devil Fruits that would be in God Valley, Big Mom promised something to Kaidou. Everything indicates that if she found the Azure Dragon, she would give it to him. This explains why Kaidou, not fully trusting her promise, asks her again when they arrive at God Valley: “ARE YOU REALLY GONNA GIVE ME A DEVIL FRUIT, LINLIN?”
With Kaidou unsure whether he should trust her or not, Big Mom goes ahead and lies to him in the meantime, breaking the trust he had in her.
So, the sequence of events that led to the final page was as follows:
Kaidou wanted a Devil Fruit → Big Mom discovered there would be Devil Fruits in God Valley → She asked to learn about their powers → They made a deal that Big Mom would give a Devil Fruit to Kaidou → Kaidou asked her if she was really going to give him one upon arriving at God Valley → Big Mom lied to him in the meantime → Kaidou lost trust in her → Big Mom found the Devil Fruit → Kaidou took it from her.
Kaidou was actually very clever — the real rat in the story isn’t him, it’s Big Mom.
I mean, Big Mom promises to give him a Devil Fruit, lies to him in the process, makes him lose trust in her, and then, when she finally finds the promised Devil Fruit, says she’s going to give it to her son instead — yet somehow Kaidou is the “rat” for not trusting someone who had already lied to him before.
I mean, Big Mom promises to give him a Devil Fruit, lies to him in the process, makes him lose trust in her, and then, when she finally finds the promised Devil Fruit, says she’s going to give it to her son instead — yet somehow Kaidou is the “rat” for not trusting someone who had already lied to him before.
hence the crew fell apart once Rocks died
To be fair she didn’t say she wasn’t going to help him get a fruit there were a handful of powers there, nothing wrong with her thinking of Kaido and her children too and I don’t think there’s a problem with her thinking of Katakuri first. Kaido kinda attacked her over the first fruit she got her hands on, and I’m not blaming Kaido for feeling skeptical about her intentions. It’s just like you guys are like siblings, BM was the first one to look after you and there wasn’t any implication that she was gonna snake him so I did feel bad for her a bit. I’m surprised at the lack of trust or maybe his lust for a great power superseded other feelings. It would sting if we actually see her saving Kaido after what he did and it would be sad if the heart of their beef was because of the fruit, there’s genuine care between them and idk if things had to go this far.
It works like this:
Kaidou showed interest in having a Devil Fruit after Whitebeard’s demonstration.
A bit later, Big Mom discovers that God Valley has Devil Fruits, and Kaidou asks to find out what their powers are.
During that time, it becomes clear that after learning about the Devil Fruits that would be in God Valley, Big Mom promised something to Kaidou. Everything indicates that if she found the Azure Dragon, she would give it to him. This explains why Kaidou, not fully trusting her promise, asks her again when they arrive at God Valley: “ARE YOU REALLY GONNA GIVE ME A DEVIL FRUIT, LINLIN?”
With Kaidou unsure whether he should trust her or not, Big Mom goes ahead and lies to him in the meantime, breaking the trust he had in her.
So, the sequence of events that led to the final page was as follows:
Kaidou wanted a Devil Fruit → Big Mom discovered there would be Devil Fruits in God Valley → She asked to learn about their powers → They made a deal that Big Mom would give a Devil Fruit to Kaidou → Kaidou asked her if she was really going to give him one upon arriving at God Valley → Big Mom lied to him in the meantime → Kaidou lost trust in her → Big Mom found the Devil Fruit → Kaidou took it from her.
Kaidou was actually very clever — the real rat in the story isn’t him, it’s Big Mom.
Kaidou showed interest in having a Devil Fruit after Whitebeard’s demonstration.
A bit later, Big Mom discovers that God Valley has Devil Fruits, and Kaidou asks to find out what their powers are.
During that time, it becomes clear that after learning about the Devil Fruits that would be in God Valley, Big Mom promised something to Kaidou. Everything indicates that if she found the Azure Dragon, she would give it to him. This explains why Kaidou, not fully trusting her promise, asks her again when they arrive at God Valley: “ARE YOU REALLY GONNA GIVE ME A DEVIL FRUIT, LINLIN?”
With Kaidou unsure whether he should trust her or not, Big Mom goes ahead and lies to him in the meantime, breaking the trust he had in her.
So, the sequence of events that led to the final page was as follows:
Kaidou wanted a Devil Fruit → Big Mom discovered there would be Devil Fruits in God Valley → She asked to learn about their powers → They made a deal that Big Mom would give a Devil Fruit to Kaidou → Kaidou asked her if she was really going to give him one upon arriving at God Valley → Big Mom lied to him in the meantime → Kaidou lost trust in her → Big Mom found the Devil Fruit → Kaidou took it from her.
Kaidou was actually very clever — the real rat in the story isn’t him, it’s Big Mom.
[/SPOILER]
During that time, it becomes clear that after learning about the Devil Fruits that would be in God Valley, Big Mom promised something to Kaidou. Everything indicates that if she found the Azure Dragon, she would give it to him. This explains why Kaidou, not fully trusting her promise, asks her again when they arrive at God Valley: “ARE YOU REALLY GONNA GIVE ME A DEVIL FRUIT, LINLIN?”
With Kaidou unsure whether he should trust her or not, Big Mom goes ahead and lies to him in the meantime, breaking the trust he had
Kaido stans going on their own gaslighting crusade by making up a whole lot hardline claims about what kind of deal or promise Big Mom might've made with Kaido just to justify the presumption that he was justified in attacking her without warning because she claimed she would give one of the DFs (among many known to be on the island) to her own child instead of him first.
None of that's in the manga. We just have a one-sided implication that Big Mom agreed to give Kaido "a devil fruit" because Kaido keeps bringing it up. And it's still just an implication since we never actually see her state as such. But even then, there's no clarification on if it was a specific devil fruit, if Kaido was supposed to receive it immediately or after they left GV, or anything else more specific than just "a devil fruit."
That doesn't translate to a meaningful justification for Kaido's actions by any reasonable reading. Let alone that all of it is predicated on Kaido being so apparently incapable of getting a fruit on his own that he had to keep begging Big Mom to do it for him in the first place, at best his owed response if Big Mom lied to him was to just call her out on it and challenge her honor (which we know she cares about) for refusing to give him a fruit that might've been promised to him. Her actions were otherwise harmless to Kaido and didn't preclude him the opportunity for reconciliation or recompense.
Kaido's actions, on the other hand, were both of those things. He actively harmed Big Mom without warning or established justification and precluded any reconciliation or recompense because he immediately ate the DF as part of his underhanded attack on her.
She got the DF when he was apparently too incompetent or incapable to do so for himself, notably preventing it from being eaten by someone else if she hadn't (so he does owe her for that), then at worst might've just lied about giving that specific one to him (if that was even the deal they made, which we never saw), and then he attacked her out of the blue to steal it through a significantly more harmful betrayal of their relationship.
So yeah. Big Mom is not a paragon by any means. But despite the Kaido stans inventing this fantasy of a concrete deal we never saw and then gaslighting everyone by parroting it all the time, I'd say she deserves some sympathy for suffering from his much shittier actions than hers (assuming she even actually lied when we don't have the evidence to prove that).
None of that's in the manga. We just have a one-sided implication that Big Mom agreed to give Kaido "a devil fruit" because Kaido keeps bringing it up. And it's still just an implication since we never actually see her state as such. But even then, there's no clarification on if it was a specific devil fruit, if Kaido was supposed to receive it immediately or after they left GV, or anything else more specific than just "a devil fruit."
That doesn't translate to a meaningful justification for Kaido's actions by any reasonable reading. Let alone that all of it is predicated on Kaido being so apparently incapable of getting a fruit on his own that he had to keep begging Big Mom to do it for him in the first place, at best his owed response if Big Mom lied to him was to just call her out on it and challenge her honor (which we know she cares about) for refusing to give him a fruit that might've been promised to him. Her actions were otherwise harmless to Kaido and didn't preclude him the opportunity for reconciliation or recompense.
Kaido's actions, on the other hand, were both of those things. He actively harmed Big Mom without warning or established justification and precluded any reconciliation or recompense because he immediately ate the DF as part of his underhanded attack on her.
She got the DF when he was apparently too incompetent or incapable to do so for himself, notably preventing it from being eaten by someone else if she hadn't (so he does owe her for that), then at worst might've just lied about giving that specific one to him (if that was even the deal they made, which we never saw), and then he attacked her out of the blue to steal it through a significantly more harmful betrayal of their relationship.
So yeah. Big Mom is not a paragon by any means. But despite the Kaido stans inventing this fantasy of a concrete deal we never saw and then gaslighting everyone by parroting it all the time, I'd say she deserves some sympathy for suffering from his much shittier actions than hers (assuming she even actually lied when we don't have the evidence to prove that).