Controversial General Political Discussion

[Logiko]

Take your own advise

I'm talking to a ragebaiting bot

Proposition : "Anti-white racism doesn't exist but racism against people who are white exists even though it's not based on their skin color"
Examples : Whites and not a western colonizer but from North-Africa or the Middle-East (or really from lots of different places).
Name : Cultural racism ? Xenophobia ? Racism "but no racial profiling" ?
Axiology next to "classical racism" : Is it systemic racism ? Yes it is even though it doesn't work very well for racial profiling.


Far-right is excluded from the debate. Only intellectuals are allowed

To really get racism, it's important to understand what it is systematically : a domination system based on hierarchization and whiteness.

As such, there can't be racism against white people as being white is being part of whiteness and thus benefiting from the social advantaged that come with the domination system (whiteness). I made a big explanation here:

Spoiler: Whiteness explained

Whiteness. (blanchité en Francais). (created by Judith Ezekiel in 2002)

Whiteness is an invisible norm. It's a position of domination is the racial order. It's the idea that even the poor white working class will have a superior non monayable salary : A superior social status, more space access etc. than racialized people.

This psychological salary pushes white people to identify to white elits instead of black (and other racialized workers). Whiteness therefore acts as a tool to maintain économical and racial order.

Whiteness is not about appearance or biological traits, it's a social construct and a position of domination created by imperialism, colonization and slavery. Whiteness is at the center of white supremacy. It's a political and social status that can evolve. For ex: in the XIX's century. Irish who came to the united states were racialized and discriminated despite having a white skin. They were considered inferior.

Whiteness allows us, white people to be able to ignore colors and the violence against racialized people while dominating them at the same time. It's the entire idea behind universalism and colorblindness.

---

And this is why this social norm is important here.

The social order in our current society is pushing the idea that whiteness is a desirable social order because it will allow people to access dignity and recognition. In his work Frantz Fanon (a philosopher and psychiatrist) explained that in colonial context, the oppressed will seek the benediction and acceptation of the oppressor even to the point of fighting for them because of the potential social retribution of whiteness. It's exactly what happens in the United State with these communities. Whiteness is a promisse of a better social status, more priviledges.

But contrary to their internalized beliefs, this whiteness will still works against them. Simply because they are still part of racialized groups.

This is why you can see black people advocating for Trump for a long time and suddenly shift back when it's too late.

 

[Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier]

To really get racism, it's important to understand what it is systematically : a domination system based on hierarchization and whiteness.

As such, there can't be racism against white people

prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism by an individual, community, or institution against a person or people on the basis of their membership in a particular racial or ethnic group, typically one that is a minority or marginalized.

The definition of it is that you can do it to any particular racial or ethnic group, it's just that it's "typically" to a minority/marginalized group.
The definition for bigotry backs this up:

obstinate or unreasonable attachment to a belief, opinion, or faction, in particular prejudice against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group.

So there CAN be racism against white people, it's just far more rare compared to racism against Africans or Asians for example. Actually very similar to misandry or heterophobia, really.

 

[Jew D. Boy]

So now he has autism, right? That’s how this works? @Ravagerblade Are you gonna throw out your ivermectin now??

 

[Logiko]

So there CAN be racism against white people, it's just far more rare compared to racism against Africans or Asians for example. Actually very similar to misandry or heterophobia, really.

Again, sorry to repeat myself but either we leep looking at basic definitions for information about sociological subjects to make conversation and we do not rise above the level of high-schoolers.. Or we look at sociological researches and we really start to dive deep into the subject. I do not keep attacking basic definitions just for the fun of it, but because it's harmfull to knowledge.

 

[Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier]

Again, sorry to repeat myself but either we leep looking at basic definitions for information about sociological subjects to make conversation and we do not rise above the level of high-schoolers.. Or we look at sociological researches and we really start to dive deep into the subject. I do not keep attacking basic definitions just for the fun of it, but because it's harmfull to knowledge.

Words have meanings for a reason

 

[Reborn]

Don't let all these religious, political and sociological talks distract you from the fact that there is only one objective, universal truth in this world

Bald is sexy

 

[Logiko]

Words have meanings for a reason

Yes. That's why using the most basic ways to understand vast and important concepts (like Racism), while negating the iceberg of contextual knowledge said concept are standing on, is a very bad process to learn about linguistic, important social subjects, and science in general.

 

[Zenos7]

The definition of it is that you can do it to any particular racial or ethnic group, it's just that it's "typically" to a minority/marginalized group.
The definition for bigotry backs this up:

So there CAN be racism against white people, it's just far more rare compared to racism against Africans or Asians for example. Actually very similar to misandry or heterophobia, really.

Again, sorry to repeat myself but either we leep looking at basic definitions for information about sociological subjects to make conversation and we do not rise above the level of high-schoolers.. Or we look at sociological researches and we really start to dive deep into the subject. I do not keep attacking basic definitions just for the fun of it, but because it's harmfull to knowledge.

Racism =/= systemic racism

Logiko may be right on his explanation for systemic racism, but again him insisting on everyone else exclusively using that definition while ignoring that the term racism stands on its own and is on an individual level is just intellectually lazy and ridiculous.

Post automatically merged: Tuesday at 6:38 AM

So now he has autism, right? That’s how this works? @Ravagerblade Are you gonna throw out your ivermectin now??

No tylenol though

 

[Reborn]

I will pull a YouTube comments section shitty bait. Anyone..(yes you who is reading it right now) who will click this to see what's the hidden text, will be joining the bald club soon. Welcome future baldies

 

[Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier]

I will pull a YouTube comments section shitty bait. Anyone..(yes you who is reading it right now) who will click this to see what's the hidden text, will be joining the bald club soon. Welcome future baldies

I'd die before I became a b*I'd "person"

 

[Mathias]

I'm talking to a ragebaiting bot






To really get racism, it's important to understand what it is systematically : a domination system based on hierarchization and whiteness.

As such, there can't be racism against white people as being white is being part of whiteness and thus benefiting from the social advantaged that come with the domination system (whiteness). I made a big explanation here:

Cultural racism isn’t made up. Anyway, from my understanding you’re not contradicting me right ?

 

[Blax Blah]

When I die I will no longer exist, heaven and hell are things humans created because they were afraid of death

Well God knows better than anyone else, and this is what he said:



John 3:19-21

19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil.

20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.

21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.


.

Nothing to do with things being made-up, all to do with hating light because people's deeds are evil.

It's up to you if you are willing to acknowledge your deeds are evil and trust in Jesus to be saved, or be condemned later at judgement.

I like this quote that's in line with John 3: "Atheism is a fairy tale for those afraid of the light."

Post automatically merged: Tuesday at 9:14 AM

I'm sorry, I'm sure you said a lot of very interesting things here, but my mind is not able to focus at the moment on long stuff. Can you make a TLDR for me please ?

It's just a quote from a book about the socialist movements in France around 1848

As for Religion being idealist.. sadly yeah.. I really do not see how it can be anything else... While I think it can have a few materialistic idea, the way the world is understood through religion is idealist. It's a focus on behavior first and not really systems.

Well what makes it idealist and what would make it materialist?

Don't worry Blax, All we need to do is to learn about surfing

Well you can't surf while burning

 

[Reborn]

Only way I get salvation

 

[Mathias]

Have you seen The Rock with his wig in that wrestling movie ? He looks just like us :)

 

[CoC: Color of Clowns]

I will pull a YouTube comments section shitty bait. Anyone..(yes you who is reading it right now) who will click this to see what's the hidden text, will be joining the bald club soon. Welcome future baldies

I am this close to shaving my head. Only reason I'm hesitating is hair does have biological functions people don't talk about revolving sensory/nature stuff, and I'm worried about that, and winter is cold.

I like being bald, makes head rubs/scratches niiiiiiiiiiice. I just want people to be able to grow hair if they want to.

Wait... did Vegapunk make any hair growth stuff?

Post automatically merged: Tuesday at 1:48 PM

Shout out to Massie and Sanders for being above this crap.

 

[Blax Blah]

Btw @Jew D. Boy are you a leftist?

 

[Mathias]

Btw @Jew D. Boy are you a leftist?

Spoiler: Open if you're gay only

He is.

 

[Blax Blah]

" “Organisation of Credit”

Economic transformation was at the heart of his activity during 1848, arguing for the “organisation of credit” and creating The Bank of the People. He saw this as the means to achieve “the organisation of labour,” which still remained the end. This was because “the organisation of labour must not emanate from the powers-that-be; it ought to be SPONTANEOUS.” In other words, labour must organise itself rather than be organised by the State or by well-meaning intellectuals:

“Louis Blanc represents governmental socialism, revolution by power, as I represent democratic socialism, revolution by the people. An abyss exists between us.”​

Economic change cannot be left to the State which was, as he had put it in 1846, “chained to capital” and cannot be seized and reformed. Moreover, it was not up to the task anyway:

“Since I first set foot on this parliamentary Sinai, I ceased to be in contact with the masses: by absorbing myself in my legislative work, I had completely lost view of current affairs […] One has to experience this isolation called a national assembly to understand how the men who are the most completely ignorant of the state of a country are nearly always those who represent it.”​

He also sought economic change now, opposing all the others on the left who advocated “political revolution first, then social revolution.” Instead, he argued that economic transformation was needed and so it was a case of “social revolution first, then political revolution.” This reflects his reformist politics and rejection of insurrection.


As well as solving the social question, economic change was needed to combat the economic crisis (which had got steadily worse after revolution). Moreover, he argued that workers could not rely on or wait for the government to act, not least because it was obviously bourgeois and opposed to social reforms. Nor could they await the seizing political power – whether by election or a coup d’état – for their distress would not disappear in the meantime.


Proudhon, then, sought practical solutions to the problems facing the revolution and the working class rather than postpone such things to after “political power” was won (if it ever were and assuming the politicians were up to the task). I must note that some – usually Marxists, following Marx himself – suggest that Proudhon’s “Bank of the People” project was an expression of his utopian politics. However, such smug comments seem to forget that there was a revolution taking place – when would be a better time to seek to apply your socialist ideas than during a revolution? And who better to build socialism than the workers themselves by their own associations for production and credit?"

@RyoQ this is talking about one of the first libertarian socialists, Proudhon, as an example of what I meant of the two different types of communist, although people think of that word as only reffering to authoritarian socialists like marxists and leninists, and bourgeois means being part of the capitalist class

 

[Reborn]

I am this close to shaving my head. Only reason I'm hesitating is hair does have biological functions people don't talk about revolving sensory/nature stuff, and I'm worried about that, and winter is cold.

I like being bald, makes head rubs/scratches niiiiiiiiiiice. I just want people to be able to grow hair if they want to.

Wait... did Vegapunk make any hair growth stuff?

Post automatically merged: Tuesday at 1:48 PM

Shout out to Massie and Sanders for being above this crap.

Go bald


Nothing is hotter than this.

Btw, Wear a hoodie in winters

 

[Logiko]

Racism =/= systemic racism

Logiko may be right on his explanation for systemic racism, but again him insisting on everyone else exclusively using that definition while ignoring that the term racism stands on its own and is on an individual level is just intellectually lazy and ridiculous.

Again, there is what basic definitions says, and there is what the research says. The two are different. Basic definition are made to vulgarize complex concepts, they are, often, inexact. If you want to know what racism really is, you must need to look at the research on the subject. as such, you can understand why racism can't be interindividual and can only be systemic.

Cultural racism isn’t made up. Anyway, from my understanding you’re not contradicting me right ?

I agree. I'm talking about the systematicity(?) of racism and the fact that interpersonnal racism (like a so called reverse racism) can't exist.

But the best way to understand racism is under the bigger prism of domination related to whitesupremacy and whiteness.

Well what makes it idealist and what would make it materialist?

To be honest that's a good question but I'm not sure it's possible. Maybe something that could make it materialist is if the focus of the religious principle were based around the notions of system... Materialism is the understanding of the way our societies are built through social systems, but if a religion were to focus on that, it would defeat the purpose.. I don't know if it's possible to be honest.

Well you can't surf while burning

I'll deal with the details later.