Versus Battle Buff/Ultra Buu vs Mystic gohan (Buu arc)

[TheAncientCenturion]

Didn’t the cell saga teach us that muscular forms just slow down fighters?

Even then Gohan was stomping Super Buu, unless it’s a Buutenks type buff I don’t see it

Only this specific transformation, 100% Frieza is faster than any other form

 

[Loki D. Terror]

But he was proven wrong later?

In what way?

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

In what way?

That he couldn’t beat Kid Buu at all, he’d need a full minute to charge his ki up enough to get an attack that could kill him and Kid Buu was dominating Ssj3 Goku

 

[Veku]

Buutenks isn't fodderizing SSJ3 Goku, that's where your logic collapses.

Dude, Goku knew he had no chance without fusion...Super Buu alone arguably would defeat Goku, let alone Super Buu + SSJ3 Gotenks, let alone Mythic Gohan..

 

[Loki D. Terror]

That he couldn’t beat Kid Buu at all, he’d need a full minute to charge his ki up enough to get an attack that could kill him and Kid Buu was dominating Ssj3 Goku

He was sure he could beat kid buu if he could built up his full ki. The issue was the downside of SSJ3.

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

He was sure he could beat kid buu if he could built up his full ki. The issue was the downside of SSJ3.

The issue is Goku needs to build up power against Buu's best martial artist incarnation. So he needs to stay still in order to have a hope of killing his opponent.

No different to Piccolo being able to kill Raditz with the special beam canon, it doesn't translate to winning a fight because the only way Goku ever gets this opportunity is with outside help.

 

[Jiihad]

Kid Buu is the strongest form of Buu, this is said many times.

Nothing puts Buuhan or Buutenks > Buff Buu

@Veku and them other ***** that was arguing with me and @ZenZu and everyone else in that thread….see wtf yall do mane smh

 

[kekaro]

Its been decades and people still refuse to accept kid buu as the strongest is wild

 

[SkySanji]

Dude, Goku knew he had no chance without fusion...Super Buu alone arguably would defeat Goku, let alone Super Buu + SSJ3 Gotenks, let alone Mythic Gohan..

Goku's statements on Buu's power are unreliable because Buu's power is literally undeterminable, even to himself as Toriyama has stated.

1. This is why Goku first said he could never beat Buu
2. And then next he's uncertain about whether he could beat Buu
3. And then finally he flat out says he would've beaten Buu

These are all contradictory statements that make zero sense unless you factor in that Buu's power is a mystery to everyone, and there are many more examples of characters either underestimating or greatly misreading Buu's power, like Gotenks thinking he could stomp Buu only to be stomped himself.

It is also repeated with Kid Buu, where Goku and Vegeta initially treat him like a joke and that they can take care of him no problem, but then what comes minutes later? Vegeta and Goku both agree Kid Buu could kill Vegeta easily. Vegeta is amazed that SSJ3 Goku can even fight Kid Buu. Goku is unable to beat him and is literally being toyed with, finally needing a Super Spirit Bomb with the ki of Mystic Gohan, Goten, Trunks, Piccolo, everyone else on Earth, everyone on Namek, people in the afterlife etc to actually beat him.

Also, I'm not sure what you mean by "let alone Mystic Gohan" considering Buutenks was stomping Gohan.

 

[Veku]

Goku's statements on Buu's power are unreliable because Buu's power is literally undeterminable, even to himself as Toriyama has stated.

1. This is why Goku first said he could never beat Buu
2. And then next he's uncertain about whether he could beat Buu
3. And then finally he flat out says he would've beaten Buu

These are all contradictory statements that make zero sense unless you factor in that Buu's power is a mystery to everyone, and there are many more examples of characters either underestimating or greatly misreading Buu's power, like Gotenks thinking he could stomp Buu only to be stomped himself.

It is also repeated with Kid Buu, where Goku and Vegeta initially treat him like a joke and that they can take care of him no problem, but then what comes minutes later? Vegeta and Goku both agree Kid Buu could kill Vegeta easily. Vegeta is amazed that SSJ3 Goku can even fight Kid Buu. Goku is unable to beat him and is literally being toyed with, finally needing a Super Spirit Bomb with the ki of Mystic Gohan, Goten, Trunks, Piccolo, everyone else on Earth, everyone on Namek, people in the afterlife etc to actually beat him.

Also, I'm not sure what you mean by "let alone Mystic Gohan" considering Buutenks was stomping Gohan.

It's not about Goku's statements, but the fact, SSJ3 Gotenks and Mythic Gohan's power, which both are at or arguably above Goku's paygrade, get added to Super Buu's power, which is evident by the fact, Super Buu went from getting fodderized by Mythic Gohan, to low dififng him, just by absorbing Gotenks, so how in the world is Kid Buu > Buutenks/Buuhan?

 

[SkySanji]

It's not about Goku's statements, but the fact, SSJ3 Gotenks and Mythic Gohan's power, which both are at or arguably above Goku's paygrade, get added to Super Buu's power, which is evident by the fact, Super Buu went from getting fodderized by Mythic Gohan, to low dififng him, just by absorbing Gotenks, so how in the world is Kid Buu > Buutenks/Buuhan?

You said "Goku knew he had no chance without fusion"

Goku is stronger than both Gotenks and Mystic Gohan.

I have Kid Buu > Buutenks/Buuhan simply because the author has stated Kid Buu is the strongest form as well as multiple other guidebooks and such reaffirming it.

 

[Roo]

Toriyama is not reliable

The manga makes it clear Buuhan is the strongest. Vegeta was sure Gohan could low diff kid buu

 

[kekaro]

Toriyama is not reliable

Then the manga is not reliable either, this argument leads to nowhere

 

[SkySanji]

Toriyama is not reliable

lmao

 

[Roo]

Then the manga is not reliable either, this argument leads to nowhere

Um no. What’s in the manga is the canon. What Toriyama states years down the line after dealing with onset dementia isn’t. It’s not that hard to understand

Goku in the manga shows clear affection towards his kids. Goku according to a senile Toriyama doesn’t “love” anybody. This is an instance where the author can’t be taken seriously as he forgotten most of his work(as shown in multiple interviews)

 

[kekaro]

Um no. What’s in the manga is the canon. What Toriyama states years down the line after dealing with onset dementia isn’t. It’s not that hard to understand

Goku in the manga shows clear affection towards his kids. Goku according to a senile Toriyama doesn’t “love” anybody. This is an instance where the author can’t be taken seriously as he forgotten most of his work(as shown in multiple interviews)

This is attributing to toriyama that he was lucid during the serialization of DB tho, which is factually untrue. The manga contradicts itself all the time

 

[Blackbeard]

Narrative-wise it makes more sense for Kid Buu to be the strongest variation of Buu, but SSJ3 being able to fend him off for a while drags him back.

 

[Kurozumi Wiwi]

Toriyama is not reliable

True
We do not care about Toriyama headcanons here

 

[soupongo]

Its been decades and people still refuse to accept kid buu as the strongest is wild

Brother.....

 

[Jiihad]

Goku is stronger than both Gotenks and Mystic Gohan.

Mane I thought tha allegations of DB fans not being able to read were blown out of proportion but…..