Controversial General Political Discussion

[Zenos7]

@Okamakama see how he tries to invalidate your experience?

Both your background and the suffering of your detrans friends

Not surprising considering his recent reveal of his rampant confirmation bias

 

[Midnight Delight]

Not surprising considering his recent reveal of his rampant confirmation bias

To him Humanities Professors are Prophets and Economists are liars

 

[Okamakama]

To him Humanities Professors are Prophets and Economists are liars

We just need communism and then everything will be okay.

 

[Midnight Delight]

Worst part is that actual people in the academia acknowledge Detrans and actually study it heavily

Logiko just refuses to acknowledge it because of vibes

 

[Logiko]

Don't pretend to care, because I certainly don't. Nobody buys it.

I'm genuingly sorry that you got bullied, but my first sentence was definitly sarcastic yes.

They went around getting into gangs, focusing on material goods and trying to rob them, and I ended up pushing myself to succeed despite that. Plenty of white kids in other areas I know of also ended up in prison. You're only like this because jealous that you couldn't succeed at life and thus push your own impotency onto minorities to create a false sense of solidarity.

I wish things were that simple.

Both your background and the suffering of your detrans friends

I'm starting to get annoyed with these kind of lie based on the half read of my post.

A lot of people in this thread would benefit in regular courses of media literacy.

Abused by my father. Made homeless. Forced into ghettos. Abused for the colour of my skin. All of it led me to having fucked up identity issues. They were already forming at age 4. By the time I was a teen I wanted suicide by transition, effectively, and I did it. I was transitioned for 8 years, went through the surgeries, and have all the scars to prove it. Along the way I learned to deal with life, with myself, and came to realise what I wanted all along.

Instead of killing myself I brought myself back from the brink and took the hard path back from transition. I detransitioned, used the few skills I had cultivated during my time as trans (through my degree and contacts), and built a career whilst also creating a network to assist other detrans individuals. I now work with Genspect as a speaker and writer alongside my full-time job.

Logiko can seriously fuck off. He has no idea of struggle or redemption.

I'm sorry you had to live a bad life, like a said many time, your story about your detransition is legitimate and I will never question that. What I question on the other hand is how you look at that now that you are in a better place.

You are doing something I know very well for experimenting it in my family all the time : you take your horrible story and the fact that you got out of it and you transform your experience into a self made success story thus negating completely the complexities of the sociological upbringings that WE KNOW (as in scientifically know) are responsible for the difference in chances between racialized and white people.

We know that people who lived the hardest lives and "got out" are usually the ones who will believe the most in meritocratic belief system thus being the one who will defend the most our capitalist and racist systems.

Not surprising considering his recent reveal of his rampant confirmation bias

I think I talked about media literacy previousely.. i'm repeating it again. Some people should really learn to read.

We just need communism and then everything will be okay.

No.

Communism will help, but as I told you, it won't destroy all the dominations systems.

Worst part is that actual people in the academia acknowledge Detrans and actually study it heavily

Logiko just refuses to acknowledge it because of vibes

I'm sorry, but I have to repeat it for the third time.... People need to learn to read.

 

[Okamakama]

Worst part is that actual people in the academia acknowledge Detrans and actually study it heavily

Logiko just refuses to acknowledge it because of vibes

I'm aware. I am friends with a lot of people within the sphere. It's why I said if there is one topic Logiko knows nothing about it is detrans and trans. I have not only lived it, I've studied it and worked within the space as an actual expert.

But no. He knows more about every topic.

Cretin.

 

[Logiko]

I'm aware. I am friends with a lot of people within the sphere. It's why I said if there is one topic Logiko knows nothing about it is detrans and trans. I have not only lived it, I've studied it and worked within the space as an actual expert.

But no. He knows more about every topic.

Cretin.

I only know the statistical reality : a form transition as in either simple gender affirming care or FULL transition for the majority of people who suffer from gender disphoria is most often necessary to avoid suicide. The fact that you deny that because you surround yourself with people who luckily "got out" will not erease that data.

You can call me anything you want, it won't change our reality

 

[Logiko]

Now if you wanna keep denying the part when I say "your story is legitimate". Go for it. But I won't kneel and bury my knowledge in front of you just because you had a bad life mate.

 

[Okamakama]

transform your experience into a self made success story thus negating completely the complexities of the sociological upbringings that WE KNOW (as in scientifically know) are responsible for the difference in chances between racialized and white people.

It's not self-made. My wife and family helped support me through the tumult of my experiences. However, ultimately, and this is something you'll realise if you ever improve, you still need to do the work yourself.

You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make it drink.

We know that people who lived the hardest lives and "got out" are usually the ones who will believe the most in meritocratic belief system thus being the one who will defend the most our capitalist and racist systems.

If you read only a page back you'd actually see my political views aren't capitalism, lmfao.

You want to know why people who get out believe in merit? Because they had to struggle. My recovery and redemption was not luck, it was pain and suffering for many years. Yet even so, I don't really believe meritocracy is a thing. Not in the modern society.

What I question on the other hand is how you look at that now that you are in a better place.

You mean how I've actively saved lives of people who were in my position through being a role model and coach? It is one of my greatest honours to have been told I've transformed people's lives. One of the most touching ones was a 46 year old man from Serbia who'd been transitioned for over 20 years. I did not feel worthy of being called a mentor by someone so senior to me, but apparently I was, and my assistance gave him the bravery to finally push forward to go back to what he wanted - but never felt he had the strength or right to do due to his perceived 'failure'.

 

[Okamakama]

You can call me anything you want, it won't change our reality

You have no idea how many people I know who have suicided from trans regret and a loss of self as a result. You know what I've heard people call the cause of their deaths to this day?

Transphobia.

Stop. Just. Fucking. Stop. You have no clue how the statistics work or are skewed to fit a fucking activist narrative.

 

[Midnight Delight]

I'm aware. I am friends with a lot of people within the sphere. It's why I said if there is one topic Logiko knows nothing about it is detrans and trans. I have not only lived it, I've studied it and worked within the space as an actual expert.

But no. He knows more about every topic.

Cretin.

He actually stated that Detrans only exists because of transphobia

 

[Okamakama]

He actually stated that Detrans only exists because of transphobia

I know. I responded to him on that.

He likely believes I only detransitioned because of transphobia.

He doesn't even know what a trans identity is. He doesn't understand the psychology. He'd probably melt if he knew how many trans people I've actually convinced to turn back.

 

[Midnight Delight]

He likely believes I only detransitioned because of transphobia.

He only backed off because he realised he found himself in a trap where the wrong word can get him actually banned btw

 

[Logiko]

It's not self-made. My wife and family helped support me through the tumult of my experiences. However, ultimately, and this is something you'll realise if you ever improve, you still need to do the work yourself.

You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make it drink.

And that's where I believe you are wrong.

If you read only a page back you'd actually see my political views aren't capitalism, lmfao.

I think a lot of people think they are something and are actually the opposite.

You want to know why people who get out believe in merit? Because they had to struggle

That I agree.

My recovery and redemption was not luck

We believe success is not about luck, but capitals.

Yet even so, I don't really believe meritocracy is a thing

And yet you are showing me the opposite. Which part of you should I believe?

You mean how I've actively saved lives of people who were in my position through being a role model and coach? It is one of my greatest honours to have been told I've transformed people's lives. One of the most touching ones was a 46 year old man from Serbia who'd been transitioned for over 20 years. I did not feel worthy of being called a mentor by someone so senior to me, but apparently I was, and my assistance gave him the bravery to finally push forward to go back to what he wanted - but never felt he had the strength or right to do due to his perceived 'failure'.

None of that is a failure to my sight, sorry if you feel that it is what I believe.

Transphobia.

Because that's precisely what it is. I'm sorry if that doesn't suit you.

You have no clue how the statistics work or are skewed to fit a fucking activist narrative.

Perhaps, that is why I'm mainly refering here to the words of actual trans people when I say :

Transphobia will push you to transition, but it will also push you to detransition

Again, I'll not bury their fight.

He actually stated that Detrans only exists because of transphobia

I wouldn't say "only", but transphobia is a huge part of it. The other problem is doctors being completely missinformed... which could also be resulting of cisnormativity.

 

[Okamakama]

None of that is a failure to my sight, sorry if you feel that it is what I believe.

He felt as if he failed as a man by transitioning. He wouldn't care for your opinion. Naturally, I made him aware he wasn't undeserving of his chance to return to what felt right for him.

I think a lot of people think they are something and are actually the opposite.

I agree! You think you're a good person, but you're actually the opposite.

And yet you are showing me the opposite. Which part of you should I believe?

Because that's precisely what it is. I'm sorry if that doesn't suit you.

Yes, people killed themselves because realising they lived a lie and ruined their sexual function and bodies was 'transphobia'. Ridiculous.

Next thing you'll be telling me I'm actually trans and the reason I went back was because of internalised transphobia.

 

[Logiko]

He felt as if he failed as a man by transitioning. He wouldn't care for your opinion. Naturally, I made him aware he wasn't undeserving of his chance to return to what felt right for him.

Do you mean that this man felt as if he wasn't a real man for transitionning to be a woman and now that he detransitionned, he is a happy man?

I agree! You think you're a good person, but you're actually the opposite.

I actually do not think I'm a good person. My shortsightings have done a lot more damages than good in the past. Which is why I fight so much to to find the most ethical path. I'm sorry if you felt that I was acting based on the belief that I was morally superior to you. I'm not. I'm simply following an ethical path that I believe to be the best to be a healthy collective society. And it might evolve.

I simply know that you can be so much better than a conservatist for you.. or a believer in capitalism for Nameless.. or a cynical anti leftist for midnight. I know from experience that these are narrowing views that can only prevent someone from witnessing the entire complexity of our social world. I wish I could convince you. It doesn't seem possible.

Next thing you'll be telling me I'm actually trans and the reason I went back was because of internalised transphobia.

There are many factors in detransition : the lack of health care access, financial precarity, the transphobia of society, the pressure of the family, the pressure of cis normativity,a simple evolution of the gender identity of a person etc..

I can't tell you why you detransition, I'm not you, I can't know that.

 

[NAMELESS]

I actually used to have to carry a weapon because for a time, shortly after getting out of homelessness, I was the only white kid in a brown/black area. I experienced a lot of genuine racism for it (ah well).

I used to have to fight constantly just to ensure groups wouldn't think of me as an easy target.

Jokes on them. They're still in the ghetto and I'm not.

This 'bullying' is really just water off a duck's back, lmfao.

What did you carry, a bazooka?

 

[Okamakama]

Do you mean that this man felt as if he wasn't a real man for transitionning to be a woman and now that he detransitionned, he is a happy man?

He felt as if he was a failure of a man because he transitioned. He wanted to go back, but felt like it was too late, and that he almost didn't deserve to. I convinced him otherwise. Bro is happy with his life now. Proud of him.

There are many factors in detransition : the lack of health care access, financial precarity, the transphobia of society, the pressure of the family, the pressure of cis normativity,a simple evolution of the gender identity of a person etc..

Add a few: People are sold a lie, extreme side effects from transgender care, misdiagnosis of wider problems which identify it as GD, etc.

What did you carry, a bazooka?

It's England. A knife.

 

[Logiko]

He felt as if he was a failure of a man because he transitioned.

Why did he felt like a failure of a man?

He wanted to go back, but felt like it was too late, and that he almost didn't deserve to. I convinced him otherwise. Bro is happy with his life now. Proud of him.

Wonderful.

Add a few: People are sold a lie, extreme side effects from transgender care, misdiagnosis of wider problems which identify it as GD, etc.

The trans people I listen to, do not agree.

 

[NAMELESS]

He felt as if he was a failure of a man because he transitioned. He wanted to go back, but felt like it was too late, and that he almost didn't deserve to. I convinced him otherwise. Bro is happy with his life now. Proud of him.



Add a few: People are sold a lie, extreme side effects from transgender care, misdiagnosis of wider problems which identify it as GD, etc.



It's England. A knife.

I carry a stiletto-type pocketknife with me everywhere. I've been doing that since 13. lol