General & Others The (non-existing) stakes in One Piece

[Devilbat]

lol the spoilers are just too predictable now.

Yeah, even without reading those, you can basically predict Luffy's upcoming fights chapter by chapter
- Luffy becomes Nika
- Looney tunes fight against BBEG
- Oh no BBEG too strong, need more food!
- someone distracts BBEG while Luffy eats & heals (Yamato, Gaban, Loki, etc.)
- Nikified Luffy comes back stronger than ever!

 

[BoaHancocksHusband]

Yeah, even without reading those, you can basically predict Luffy's upcoming fights chapter by chapter
- Luffy becomes Nika
- Looney tunes fight against BBEG
- Oh no BBEG too strong, need more food!
- someone distracts BBEG while Luffy eats & heals (Yamato, Gaban, Loki, etc.)
- Nikified Luffy comes back stronger than ever!

Luffy Eats. End chapter

 

[dirtyLarry]

Imagine the feeling of Sabaody. That ain't happened ever again.

Oda completely butchered it post-skip and G5 was the final nail in the coffin.

Just to emphasize how ridiculously dumb things have gotten:

Even just recently Luffy slept for days after fights where he wasn't even half as injured as he was in the fight against Imu right now (against Doflamingo for example).

The most hilarious example happened after his fight against Hody Jones, where he was literally on the brink of death after a mere bite into his shoulder and needed an emergency blood transfusion from Jinbei in order to survive.

Now here he got completely impaled TWICE by the literal Devil King of the world and all it took was a little snack and he's back rolling after only two chapters.

Sorry, but this is complete and utter bullshit and ruins every last little kind of stakes this manga ever had.

 

[Johnny B. Decent]

That doesn't debunk what they said though. This manga doesn't have any tension
Sure, other mangas also don't have much tension, but that's beside the point here.
This is just whataboutism my guy.

It is indeed. But people here are hypocrites, so fight fire with fire, you know?

 

[Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier]

It is indeed. But people here are hypocrites, so fight fire with fire, you know?

Touche.

 

[Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier]

Oda completely butchered it post-skip and G5 was the final nail in the coffin.

Just to emphasize how ridiculously dumb things have gotten:

Even just recently Luffy slept for days after fights where he wasn't even half as injured as he was in the fight against Imu right now (against Doflamingo for example).

The most hilarious example happened after his fight against Hody Jones, where he was literally on the brink of death after a mere bite into his shoulder and needed an emergency blood transfusion from Jinbei in order to survive.

Now here he got completely impaled TWICE by the literal Devil King of the world and all it took was a little snack and he's back rolling after only two chapters.

Sorry, but this is complete and utter bullshit and ruins every last little kind of stakes this manga ever had.

Tbf that Hody Jones thing was clearly only there to set up the plot point of Jinbe being the only fishman brave enough to break an unspoken social law

 

[dirtyLarry]

Tbf that Hody Jones thing was clearly only there to set up the plot point of Jinbe being the only fishman brave enough to break an unspoken social law

Of course you are correct, but I don't give a fuck if it was there for some clear narrative purpose, when it makes zero logical sense in hindsight.

 

[redtiger]

Bro he is the MC...he can't die yet.

 

[dirtyLarry]

Bro he is the MC...he can't die yet.

That's not the fucking point.
Of course everyone knows he can't die yet.

But then at least write your manga so that it's consistent and believable!

If you need a whole emergency surgery with blood transfusion after one single bite into the shoulder by Hody fucking Jones and then fast forward you can fully regenerate after snacking a Whopper and a Cherry Coke midfight against the Devil King of the world, who impaled you twice (!) - sorry, that's horseshit writing.

 

[redtiger]

That's not the fucking point.
Of course everyone knows he can't die yet.

But then at least write your manga so that it's consistent and believable!

If you need a whole emergency surgery with blood transfusion after one single bite into the shoulder by Hody fucking Jones and then fast forward you can fully regenerate after snacking a Whopper and a Cherry Coke midfight against the Devil King of the world, who impaled you twice (!) - sorry, that's horseshit writing.

He is an awakend mythical Zoan so he has faster regeneration. But i get your point

 

[dirtyLarry]

He is an awakend mythical Zoan so he has faster regeneration. But i get your point

I get what you're saying, but there is a difference between "faster healing due to Mythical Zoan powers" and "literally regenerating back to 100% by eating snacks after you just got impaled (!) twice".

 

[Logiko]

One Piece has tension, you people are simply not feeling it.

Experiencing a story is not a one way experience, it's a sharing process : You bring your experience, values, expectations and mindset while the author brings their vision. It is important to understand that if the exchange is corrupted by your own expectations and values of the story, you have a stronger probability to stop liking it.

If you read One Piece thinking it has no tension, you will not feel tension, simply because our mind are structured in such a way that it will negate the obvious and make us focus on what we want to confirm. As such, you will constantly find in One Piece the reasons to confirm this "there is no tension" affirmation. Even if it is not there, even if Oda proves you otherwise like in the last few chapters. That is the power of confirmation bias.

Then, you will reak toxically at people who just started the story and fan who kept the love, dumbfounded by their tensed and surprised reactions in front of the tension.

I personnally feel the tension in One Piece, not simply because I love it, but because I know for a fact that Oda can switch gears at anytime. You simply made yourself believe that - despite the factual evcidences - he would never do that.

Twists after twists, conflicts after conflicts, and probably through a bad reading week to week experience and the idea that you knew better, you detached yourself from the impact of the flow of One Piece.

There are ways to criticize a story ethically, but this is not it. This is a superiority complex.

 

[Logiko]

lol the spoilers are just too predictable now.

Yes, they are. This is a logical storytelling mechanic. It's like trying to theorize a two hours movie at the beginning of the third act, but in slow motion.

I tried to warned you years ago that spoiler and week to week reading experience would become more and more predictible over the years and you would end up feeling worse and worse if you relied on that simple data to enjoy the story:

 

[Logiko]

Yes, they are. This is a logical storytelling mechanic. It's like trying to theorize a two hours movie at the beginning of the third act, but in slow motion.

I tried to warned you years ago that spoiler and week to week reading experience would become more and more predictible over the years and you would end up feeling worse and worse if you relied on that simple data to enjoy the story:

Don't mind the three act structure in this graph, it's for vulgarization purpose and not exact. One Piece is more like a 5+ act structure story with what you could call 2 opposed "midpoint". (Marineford and Wano)

 

[moreha9685]

Experiencing a story is not a one way experience, it's a sharing process

you will reak toxically at people who just started the story and fan who kept the love,

you detached yourself from the impact of the flow of One Piece.

There are ways to criticize a story ethically, but this is not it.
This is a superiority complex.

 

[Logiko]

 

[BoaHancocksHusband]

Don't mind the three act structure in this graph, it's for vulgarization purpose and not exact. One Piece is more like a 5+ act structure story with what you could call 2 opposed "midpoint". (Marineford and Wano)

Big Daddy Saran One Shot is what I am hyped about the most tbh. (I will draw it this week)

 

[dirtyLarry]

One Piece has tension, you people are simply not feeling it.

Experiencing a story is not a one way experience, it's a sharing process : You bring your experience, values, expectations and mindset while the author brings their vision. It is important to understand that if the exchange is corrupted by your own expectations and values of the story, you have a stronger probability to stop liking it.

If you read One Piece thinking it has no tension, you will not feel tension, simply because our mind are structured in such a way that it will negate the obvious and make us focus on what we want to confirm. As such, you will constantly find in One Piece the reasons to confirm this "there is no tension" affirmation. Even if it is not there, even if Oda proves you otherwise like in the last few chapters. That is the power of confirmation bias.

Then, you will reak toxically at people who just started the story and fan who kept the love, dumbfounded by their tensed and surprised reactions in front of the tension.

I personnally feel the tension in One Piece, not simply because I love it, but because I know for a fact that Oda can switch gears at anytime. You simply made yourself believe that - despite the factual evcidences - he would never do that.

Twists after twists, conflicts after conflicts, and probably through a bad reading week to week experience and the idea that you knew better, you detached yourself from the impact of the flow of One Piece.

There are ways to criticize a story ethically, but this is not it. This is a superiority complex.

You can write pompous sounding semi-intellectual excuses all you want, it's way more simple than that:

You feel tension, if you personally feel that there is a legit chance of the author actually going through with major consequences.

In One Piece, if you actually still believe that (and don't just talk yourself into it, because you still can't accept any criticism of Oda's storywriting), then there is only one way to describe you - delusional.

 

[Welkin]

You can write pompous sounding semi-intellectual excuses all you want, it's way more simple than that:

You feel tension, if you personally feel that there is a legit chance of the author actually going through with major consequences.

In One Piece, if you actually still believe that (and don't just talk yourself into it, because you still can't accept any criticism of Oda's storywriting), then there is only one way to describe you - delusional.

But my question is… when did One Piece ever have this?

When I read through One Piece as a kid it immediately became my favorite manga but I never felt like there was any crazy tension

One Piece, like almost any other shonen in the genre, refused to harm 95% of the relevant/main heroic characters

That’s how it’s been since day 1 and I never really thought that would change. In Sabaody when Kizaru arrived it was cool because we’d hardly seen any powerhouses at that point but it wasn’t particularly “scary” nor did I feel tense

I knew that the Strawhats, as they always did, would magically pull through because Oda refuses to kill main characters

And what happened? The right hand man of the Pirate King protected them and Kuma magically appeared to save them at the last possible second

Oda has never tried to hide what kind of story One Piece is

I mean just look at Alabasta. Luffy got stabbed by Crocodile and lost to him multiple times and there were 0 consequences for any of that. Everyone came out of that arc completely unscathed

You cite Enies Lobby but I’d argue that’s one of the worst examples in pre timeskips favor, where the Strawhats get saved by a magical ship and the rest of their allies all get their deaths faked out

 

[Logiko]

You can write pompous sounding semi-intellectual excuses all you want, it's way more simple than that:

Simplicity always stands on the shoulders of complexity.

I'm not trying to be pompous or intellectual, I'm simply sharing what I know. I don't like gate keepings.

In One Piece, if you actually still believe that (and don't just talk yourself into it, because you still can't accept any criticism of Oda's storywriting), then there is only one way to describe you - delusional.

No. I simply know how to manage my expectation and my reading experience. I've been doing that enough time to understand just how hard yet how important it is.

When I read through One Piece as a kid it immediately became my favorite manga but I never felt like there was any crazy tension

One Piece, like almost any other shonen in the genre, refused to harm 95% of the relevant/main heroic characters

People have been led - by the current era - to believe that tension equates to the fear of people dying.

The same way it is bonkers to think that death equates to quality, it is fallacious to think that tension equates to the fear of death. There are many ways to create tension and Oda uses them all.