Worstgen
Cinera
@Xione by feats, Sakazuki low diffs Vista. If Vista is actually capable of putting up a fight against Dracule, then it means that he's simply not a top tier. Sakazuki alone was sufficient to take on the entirety of the Whitebeard Pirates bar Whitebeard himself.
Cinera
If Mihawk is a real top tier, he should be capable of low diffing Vista.
Xione
@Cinera There is no "if" about whether Vista can do it. He factually as mentioned in the Vivre card and the databooks can do it. Furthermore, Sakazuki never took on the enitre Whitebeard pirates, that's already been debunked countless times. Even his interactions with Marco were fairly limited, who kept on getting attacked by other marines. By feats there's nothing suggesting Sakazuki low-diffs Vista.
Xione
Also, Mihawk being a top tier doesn't rely on Vista or Sakazuki. Mihawk is the first established top tier in the manga, then Shanks was established as the 2nd when they met up. If somebody can fight with Dracule, they're not getting low-diffed by Sakazuki, no matter what out of context feat manipulation we want to use to hype Sakazuki up.
Elder Lee Hung
The word “context” has now been used so often to make excuses for headcanons that it has literally lost all meaning.
Cinera
@Xione I disagree with the claim that nothing suggests Sakazuki can low diff Vista. Marco and Vista failed to give Sakazuki even negligible damage when they sneak attacked him (compare with Whitebeard who caused him internal bleeding). His offensive power and lethality is also enough to quickly overpower them. Even together, the duo may still get mid diffed.
Cinera
Post WCI Boundman is a level above Vista and he got low diffed by Base Kaido (who should be comparable to Sakazuki), so it holds up. No matter how you dice it, Vista cannot push a serious top tier beyond low diff.
An amnesiac Linlin without access to her devil fruit, haki or any combat knowledge two shot a character on the same level with Vista (likely much more durable given that they are an ancient zoan).
An amnesiac Linlin without access to her devil fruit, haki or any combat knowledge two shot a character on the same level with Vista (likely much more durable given that they are an ancient zoan).
Cinera
If Mihawk cannot low diff Vista he's simply not on the level of Sakazuki, Borsalino, Kuzan, Kaido, etc.
Cinera
That's my position on Mihawk's powerscaling.
Cinera
Besides, only Vista's swordplay was compared to Mihawk's. His physical strength, offensive prowess, range, Colour of Observation and Colour of Armaments haki were all below Hawkeye's.
Xione
@Cinera Those attacks were rather very small, and it's not like Sakazuki did shit to them as a counter. Vista was perfectly fine at the end of the War. Marco as well despite going against Sakazuki multiple times. And Vista actually has superior portrayal over Marco when it comes to being the strong "fighter" of the crew.
Cinera
I don't see Vista having superior combat portrayal to Marco. It's not even clear that he has superior combat portrayal to Jozu.
Cinera
Vista is a Mid High Tier. O-lin, Kaido and Sakazuki have shown us that mid high tiers and even high high tiers are mere nuisances for the top tiers. Mihawk did not demonstrate that vs Vista.
silverfire
@Admiral Lee Hung @Xione @Cinera i ageee it’s easy to use context as an excuse for ones headcanon, but overall I prefer to try to take everything in as data points without dismissing anything. Anything and everything in canon is fair game for powerscaling, though how to use it is where debates start
silverfire
Vista vs Mihawk is something to factor in, as is Rayleigh sweating and huffing, as is Fujitora getting bruised, big mom getting thrown overboard and so on.
silverfire
And personally I’ve never fully let go of vista vs Mihawk, that’s partly why he remains below the logia trio in my book unless he decisively proves otherwise. I do believe unironically that vista and Marco combined would likely get mid diffed by Akainu, based on them being able to do nothing to him with a sneak attack, and the whole crew being needed to stall him.
Cinera
@silverfire some feats are clear outliers/inconsistencies. A good example is Meme's showings against the Fodderhats. It's inconsistent with someone who can face Kaido for at least 12 hours.
Cinera
Mihawk has a lot of bad showings beyond Vista though.
* His attack was blocked by Daz Bones.
* He postponed a fight against Don Krieg.
* He backed off from a fight with Sir Crocodile (who you placed below Marineford Luffy, so low tier at best).
* He failed to oneshot Zoro after bringing out Yoru.
* His attack was blocked by Daz Bones.
* He postponed a fight against Don Krieg.
* He backed off from a fight with Sir Crocodile (who you placed below Marineford Luffy, so low tier at best).
* He failed to oneshot Zoro after bringing out Yoru.
Ray injured him and pissed him off. Marco laughed at his strongest attack to date And overpowered him