Worstgen

Cinera

I don't think the Hawkins fight is necessarily an anti feat for FS, but Luffy did not use it there. Even when protecting Tama, it's not like he reacted to the nails before Zoro (when he logically should have).

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Shura

@Cinera ....the point is even if you see something doesn't mean that you can avoid it........to do that you have to figure out how the attack works....I have given example before....

Cinera

I understand your point, I'm saying that I don't think Luffy saw the explosion. Luffy did not act like he saw himself getting blown up. A soru would have been sufficient to avoid it TBH. Or at least if Luffy did that we'd know that he saw the explosion and tried avoiding it (even if he was unsuccessful),

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Shura

@Cinera ....at this point you should know what kind of guy Luffy is, he slept in Sanji hands right at the core of BMP......

Bottom line is to use FS he have to maintain focus on your surroundings...this is same for bailsic CoO......future just won't come to you.....

Cinera

As is, Luffy made no attempt to avoid or defend against the incoming attack. This leads me to the conclusion that he didn't see it.

Cinera

@Shura my point isn't that Luffy doesn't have FS, it's that he hasn't used FS many of the times when he should have.

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Shura

@Cinera .....there is a chance that attack is too fast to react.....I mean even light speed Kizaru got hit by the attack

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Shura

Yeah.....forget about FS, he didn't use CoC in many situations he should have....but that is plot gotta live with it....

Cinera

Yeah, I agree that it's plot. But if Oda is not going to be consistent with Luffy's FS in the manga and it's rarely relevant in fights against non fodder, I'm not going to grant Luffy consistent FS in the battledome.

Sentinel

If Luffy truly has no consistent FS, would you reevaluate his Post WCI power level regarding YC1 level characters?

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Shura

why the consistency matters in battledome threads?...if we go that way battledome threads are pretty much useless because it will create more ruckus of several permutations and combinations....battledome threads are anything but plot based...all that matters is what Oda gives to the character and how they work...

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Shura

However, if you can logically interpret on a way to surpass FS by using its loopholes which are backed by manga panels or proofs, then it can work....

Finalbeta

Advanced haki will completely overshadow FS mark my words guys :D

Finalbeta

Overall Katakuri is one of the few FS users in the world and yet his CoO isn't the strongest regardless ~

Cinera

@Sentinel I think one could make the argument that Post WCI Luffy was just low YC 1 level and wouldn't have necessarily won a rematch against Katakuri without any plot assistance.

Cinera

@Shura it feels disingenuous to me if Luffy rarely uses FS in fights against relevant characters in the manga to grant him consistent FS in the battledome. A simpler assumption would just be to state that Luffy's FS is inconsistent and only sometimes (actually rarely) work(s). The latter assumption would be more faithful to the manga at least.

Finalbeta

Well fact is plot armor or not Luffy beat Katakuri in a fair fight :D

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Shura

@Cinera most of the battledome fights are such that it was focused between characters that are participating in the fights.....scenarios are such that the character takes things seriously and utilize their arsenal without plot interference....like I said you can make counter arguments like how FS can be bypassed from whatever shown in the manga.....

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Shura

Also, it is also the case that Luffy may not/couldnot exploit the other ways of using FS like Katakuri does....or still can't make active all the time like Katakuri does....it is not inconsistent, he is just lacking control or inexperience.....it is focus based and it is not impossible to lose focus especially for a character like Luffy....

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Shura

Also @Cinera , Oden couldn't cut barrier eventhough he had adCoA...however, he could cut Kaido......does that mean his adCoA is inconsistent?