Character Discussion Are Big Mom and Kaido bad characters?

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

Using the popularity poll to scale or up hype something is like using the anime as power scale LOL. It doesn't mean anything.

Anyway, Kaido and Big Mom is not a bad characters. Big Mom have good flashback and potential but then again, Lolda uses her as a plot device. Kaido on the other hand, is a decent antagonist, Orochi and Big Mom is still a far better villains than him but he's not bad. People enjoy Lucci and Katakuri despite they don't have the "evil personality" like some of the great villains like Doflamingo and Crocodile does.

 

[Jailer]

Using the popularity poll to scale or up hype something is like using the anime as power scale LOL. It doesn't mean anything.

Anyway, Kaido and Big Mom is not a bad characters. Big Mom have good flashback and potential but then again, Lolda uses her as a plot device. Kaido on the other hand, is a decent antagonist, Orochi and Big Mom is still a far better villains than him but he's not bad. People enjoy Lucci and Katakuri despite they don't have the "evil personality" like some of the great villains like Doflamingo and Crocodile does.

Not every character needs to be complex like Doflamingo. Lucci isn't supposed to be complex, he's a killing machine, that's his job, no complexity needed. Complexity doesn't always mean good, same for unpredictability - where Oda failed with Big Mom in that regard massively.

 

[The White Crane]

i never remember some antagonists with so low popularity (86 for Big Mom and 65 for Kaido), but they are right, in my opinion yes. In the case of Big mom we only remember one of the worst arc (for my it's the worst): Whole cake island arc. In this arc there are two main characters who are sanji (this arc kill him) and big mom (who is the main antagonist).
In this arc big mom had planed to use sanji for killing judge and his family and robbed his technology. Before that arc and the same arc it was talking than Big Mom had the larger spy organization in the word, but she was trolled for luffy and moreover she forget his plan and attack his sons and help the mugis. If we are talking in this arc big mom has gotten worse. So big mom is one of the worst characters i never see in all the mangas i read.
in the case if kaido i don't come to talk yet because we don't see his past but for now he didn't have anything than we can talk to good antagonist (like doffy, croco, madara in the same chapters)
@Finalbeta @Le Fishe D. Crydo @Pantheos @rerere @MonsterKaido @Zoro D Goat

Big Mom is an average character as an adult, an interesting character during her flashback.

Too early to say about Kaido. His flashback will make or break his character.

 

[Charlotte Horchata]

Yea i dont think they go "for some reason i like/hate this character" without context hor-kun

Well, people generally don't question why they like/hate a character, they just do it. Which I personally find problematic.

 

[Jew D. Boy]

No, current Oda is just a much less competent writer than past Oda was. Only one character in this entire series is truly, utterly horrible...

Spoiler: Fuck This Guy And Anyone Who Likes Him

 

[Sakazuki-Singh]

They suck ass, weren't even in the top 60/70 of the popularity poll

They've been here for what ? 4+ years for BM, 2+ years for Kaido ? What a shame

Thank God Kaido will be history in 2022 and BM is a walking joke who'll end up as an ally

 

[Owl Ki]

Kaido and Linlin are horribly written characters.

Linlin is a contradictory mess with absolute shit tier portrayal and is a villain that is exceedingly difficult to ever take seriously considering how Oda dunks on her at every opportunity. She literally played second fiddle as an antagonist to her subordinate in her own damn arc. Her flashback was also utterly stupid.

Kaido is the epitome of blandness. A boring might makes right character with little in the way of personality or charisma. The only thing he had going for him was his supposed "legendary 1v1 sugoi so cool" factor which ended up being bullshit the moment he started pulling bitch moves and constantly having panic attacks. A flashback is unlikely to improve anything here.

Now are polls a 100% indicator of a character's superiority to another character? Of course not.

They are however a clear indicator of fan reaction and fan approval of characters.

This is where Linlin and Kaido drop the ball.

These are two characters that have been hyped up since Pre-TS, Kaido especially has basically been hyped for about a decade straight. These are Top Tiers who should represent the pinnacle of villainy in this series and of what Oda can do as a writer.....

and they cannot even beat feckin Bepo in popularity.

Crocodile is 17th, Doffy is 20th, Katakuri is 15th. Other villain characters that have done nothing in over a decade such as Enel and Lucci are still contextually polling well.

Meanwhile, during the climax of Wano, the culmination of over a decade of work, the fan response to Linlin and Kaido as characters can most positively be described as lukewarm at best.

Whatever Oda was aiming for, he has failed big time because that is what this is, a colossal failure.

 

[Zowo]

bring back croco boy or lucci or enel
post ts villains stink katakuri meme kaido
not including doffy he good

 

[Midnight Delight]

No, current Oda is just a much less competent writer than past Oda was. Only one character in this entire series is truly, utterly horrible...

Spoiler: Fuck This Guy And Anyone Who Likes Him

Gigachad Character

 

[Charlotte LinLin]

Never understood the hype for Doffy tbh. He was meh, not even his flashback flashed me lol.
LinLin and Kaido are not bad characters per say, the people just wished for something more serious I guess 🙄 or competent. I mean I love Lin to bits and I am a huge fan of her, but Oda simply messed her up in certain parts, and I am not only talking about the "Mother Mode" that appears randomly

 

[Jew D. Boy]

Gigachad Character

...AND ANYONE WHO LIKES HIM 🖕🖕🏻🖕🏼🖕🏽🖕🏾🖕🏿

 

[Gutts]

The main problem here is that the yonkou title is really a very prestigious title from the readers' point of view. That's why expectations are high. Don't just think of it as power. People are waiting for very impressive figures as characters. But neither of them could give the expectation.



Big Mom:

Big Mom is a really interesting character. I cannot say a poor quality character, the reason is there is a conscious preference for Big Mom. SHe would be an original and beloved character if the candy thing was not exaggerated and the other aspects (the witch) came to the fore more. But Oda chose to design this character in an extremely absurd way.

Conclusion: There have always been absurd characters in the One Piece universe. But these were never serious enemies. Just insignificant enemies, opponents of side characters and so on. But it was ridiculous that the character, which has such a prestigious title like yonkou, was designed like this. Oda designs this work for the age of 15. But when I was 15, even 12, I used to think this concept was silly and stupid.


Kaido: Kaido is more serious and not absurd. But it's not interesting either. Big Mom is interesting, at least, but Kaido is too normal. He's an overly cliché villain. But It has a little bit interesting and different aspects. Maybe we like it more if we learn about His past.

 

[Jailer]

bring back croco boy or lucci or enel
post ts villains stink katakuri meme kaido
not including doffy he good

Doffy was good but his arc was trash

 

[Lifeismeh]

Kaido and Linlin are horribly written characters.

Linlin is a contradictory mess with absolute shit tier portrayal and is a villain that is exceedingly difficult to ever take seriously considering how Oda dunks on her at every opportunity. She literally played second fiddle as an antagonist to her subordinate in her own damn arc. Her flashback was also utterly stupid.

Kaido is the epitome of blandness. A boring might makes right character with little in the way of personality or charisma. The only thing he had going for him was his supposed "legendary 1v1 sugoi so cool" factor which ended up being bullshit the moment he started pulling bitch moves and constantly having panic attacks. A flashback is unlikely to improve anything here.

Now are polls a 100% indicator of a character's superiority to another character? Of course not.

They are however a clear indicator of fan reaction and fan approval of characters.

This is where Linlin and Kaido drop the ball.

These are two characters that have been hyped up since Pre-TS, Kaido especially has basically been hyped for about a decade straight. These are Top Tiers who should represent the pinnacle of villainy in this series and of what Oda can do as a writer.....

and they cannot even beat feckin Bepo in popularity.

Crocodile is 17th, Doffy is 20th, Katakuri is 15th. Other villain characters that have done nothing in over a decade such as Enel and Lucci are still contextually polling well.

Meanwhile, during the climax of Wano, the culmination of over a decade of work, the fan response to Linlin and Kaido as characters can most positively be described as lukewarm at best.

Whatever Oda was aiming for, he has failed big time because that is what this is, a colossal failure.

BM flashback is one of the best in the series

people like to talk about the build up to Kaido arc, but did Oda even focus on him in Wano? the fact of the matter is Kaido character arc hasn't started yet, for now he's an obstacle and that's it

the time will come when we understand what Oda want to achieve through Kaido character, but for now I dought even Oda expect him to be popular , so far he's not even trying to make him popular, he's focusi on Luffy growth and struggle

 

[Deleted member 83]

I had huge hopes for Big Mom, and I loved her when we started to get more info on her, her design, ability, idea, goals...etc
Also really enjoy her flashback
Then the cake happened
And as of rn her current story in Wano...I can only say that I'm not a fan of
Who knows, maybe it'll get better

Kaido's intro is hands down my favorite in all of fiction, and I love his design, not much to say about his ability, generic big dragon, his hybrid is a little controversial but is growing on me,
I definitely think he is underwhelming for the majority of this arc, completely disappeared after his "fight" with Luffy, then a small clash and alliance with BM, and his controversial performance in Oden's fb doesn't help, he definitely seem to be a complex? confusing? person
a mix of someone who enjoys fighting, having a honorable side, but also likes to scheme and take advantages
So while I love him, it's completely understandable for people to dislike him or think he's a bad character
I am currently hoping for a great flashback of his, it's not a overstatement to say it could be on Whitebeard/Roger Piece level of epicness if it includes Rocks Pirates and God Valley

 

[kom5]

i never remember some antagonists with so low popularity (86 for Big Mom and 65 for Kaido), but they are right, in my opinion yes. In the case of Big mom we only remember one of the worst arc (for my it's the worst): Whole cake island arc. In this arc there are two main characters who are sanji (this arc kill him) and big mom (who is the main antagonist).
In this arc big mom had planed to use sanji for killing judge and his family and robbed his technology. Before that arc and the same arc it was talking than Big Mom had the larger spy organization in the word, but she was trolled for luffy and moreover she forget his plan and attack his sons and help the mugis. If we are talking in this arc big mom has gotten worse. So big mom is one of the worst characters i never see in all the mangas i read.
in the case if kaido i don't come to talk yet because we don't see his past but for now he didn't have anything than we can talk to good antagonist (like doffy, croco, madara in the same chapters)
@Finalbeta @Le Fishe D. Crydo @Pantheos @rerere @MonsterKaido @Zoro D Goat

typical giant character big and strong but stupid

Both characters doesnt give any vibe there just have the character standard to strike feat in a 8 year old kid
BM is the most easiest character to be stop even an 8 year old kid can do it she is trash

Kaido went from Superman to an brainless idiot

Crocodile, Katakuri or Doflamingo did strike in fear in us when we read there stories you had a certain amount of respect
Doffy just turned the whole country in a single move against the Strawhats

Katakuri was the MVP of the BMP

Kaido gets bitch slapped by 8 year old kid I dont have any respect for them and I think they are still too high in the poll both are overhyped idiots

characterwise
Croc>>>> BM and Kaido

 

[Yakyu]

Other than his design and power, Kaido never had my attention and as I said in another thread it took long for him to get some personality and yet, it's lacking a lot for me.
Big Mom was very interesting at first and I legit liked her twisted mentality and "wonderland of hell" theme as she was always the insane child from darkness who never grew up. Then she just became an overpowered gag.

 

[Gnomishness]

Kaido is a bit generic as an evil dictator character, but you've got to assume that there's still some characterization to be had from him. At very least, even if he stays like this, I still enjoy him in concept.

And Big Mom is a bit flip-floppy and inconsistent with her ideals, but that's probably purposeful as a consequence of her not being "A Man" by One Piece standards, and thus having a more realistic mentality (real people act like big mom more than they act like Luffy BTW).

 

[Myuu]

The worst. Wano is a snorefest.

 

[Roo]

Big Mom is a horrible character

Kaido is just fun, but there is barely depth in his character. He has the potential to be a Toguro like character tho