Powers & Abilities Beast pirates swordsmenship? And how it effects the verse
- Thread starter Albino 👑
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fought queen for 10 chapters (base)
Well it was mentioned in the manga that unlike in real life swordsman isn't just about any sword user brandishing a sword, I had predicted that since 2019.
I guess in order to be defined as swordsman a particular training is needed, it's not quite clear how in detail but I guess simply learning enough of the style to be judged as one and yeah a swordsman can be a devil fruit user, we know of Shiryu and Law.
I wonder why Law is a swordsman and King isn't though, I guess my logic can stick with it.
I guess in order to be defined as swordsman a particular training is needed, it's not quite clear how in detail but I guess simply learning enough of the style to be judged as one and yeah a swordsman can be a devil fruit user, we know of Shiryu and Law.
I wonder why Law is a swordsman and King isn't though, I guess my logic can stick with it.
If its just based on needing a sword style law likely isn't an actual swordsman just a guy that uses a sword to fight. Kinda like big mom
Shiryu before getting a devil fruit was 95% probably a swordsman with his own style. So him getting a fruit doesn't take away from it just adds i guess
Same with fujitora if i remember correctly. Cause i think he only got his fruit recently. Even brook is a good example now that i think about it. When it comes to devil fruit users being swordsmen
Then when it comes to other races
Being another race with special abilities doesn't automatically mean you can't be a swordsman. We have people like kawamatsu and inuarashi who obviously are with their own sword styles
Then we have the 🐐
Franky technically does have a sword along with technically having sword based attacks with names but again it isn't a legit style
Shiryu before getting a devil fruit was 95% probably a swordsman with his own style. So him getting a fruit doesn't take away from it just adds i guess
Same with fujitora if i remember correctly. Cause i think he only got his fruit recently. Even brook is a good example now that i think about it. When it comes to devil fruit users being swordsmen
Then when it comes to other races
Being another race with special abilities doesn't automatically mean you can't be a swordsman. We have people like kawamatsu and inuarashi who obviously are with their own sword styles
Then we have the 🐐
Franky technically does have a sword along with technically having sword based attacks with names but again it isn't a legit style
In my opinion swordsmen are people who exclusively fight with swords, which is why Zoro said Mr. 1 and King weren't swordsmen as soon as they started using other means of attack.
That's why in my opinion Law also doesn't qualify as a swordsman because he doesn't always use his sword, he mostly relies on his Devil Fruit and doesn't really use his sword as a swordsman, but more as a surgeon, using it as a tool to guide his Devil Fruit powers rather than as a weapon.
However, people like Fujitora who use their Devil Fruit powers EXCLUSIVELY in conjunction with their katana are to be treated as swordsmen since it's exactly like a sword fighting style just like Kinemon's fire fox style.
So if we really wanted to classify people as swordsmen or not, I guess we would have to go case by case and examine people according to these criteria.
But the most important criteria would be the in-verse statements such as Zoro saying to King that he's just like all the others he's fought up until this point (except Mihawk) and that he isn't a swordsman, but only pretending to be.
Although at first Hyouzou seems like a proper swordsman I think Zoro doesn't view him as a swordsman because he doesn't have the mentality of a swordsman at all (attacking people in the back and using poison instead of skill), and we know mentality is VERY important in sworsmanship (as Ohara pointed out in his character analysis on Mihawk) because that's literally what made Mihawk change his mind when he first met Zoro.
Swordsmanship is a way of life similar to a religion, swordsmen have a code of honor and don't fight dirty because the only thing that's important to them is skill and power which should be enough to make them win against any dirty opponent they might face, and if their skill and power isn't enough then they consider it's their fault for being too weak and it means it's as far as they were meant to go.
But of course there's an exception to this :
When swordsmen feel like they aren't facing a worthy opponent, they sometimes don't even bother to use a sword, just like when Mihawk used a dagger against Zoro or when Zoro punched a sky shark away on Skypiea.
That's why in my opinion Law also doesn't qualify as a swordsman because he doesn't always use his sword, he mostly relies on his Devil Fruit and doesn't really use his sword as a swordsman, but more as a surgeon, using it as a tool to guide his Devil Fruit powers rather than as a weapon.
However, people like Fujitora who use their Devil Fruit powers EXCLUSIVELY in conjunction with their katana are to be treated as swordsmen since it's exactly like a sword fighting style just like Kinemon's fire fox style.
So if we really wanted to classify people as swordsmen or not, I guess we would have to go case by case and examine people according to these criteria.
But the most important criteria would be the in-verse statements such as Zoro saying to King that he's just like all the others he's fought up until this point (except Mihawk) and that he isn't a swordsman, but only pretending to be.
Although at first Hyouzou seems like a proper swordsman I think Zoro doesn't view him as a swordsman because he doesn't have the mentality of a swordsman at all (attacking people in the back and using poison instead of skill), and we know mentality is VERY important in sworsmanship (as Ohara pointed out in his character analysis on Mihawk) because that's literally what made Mihawk change his mind when he first met Zoro.
Swordsmanship is a way of life similar to a religion, swordsmen have a code of honor and don't fight dirty because the only thing that's important to them is skill and power which should be enough to make them win against any dirty opponent they might face, and if their skill and power isn't enough then they consider it's their fault for being too weak and it means it's as far as they were meant to go.
But of course there's an exception to this :
When swordsmen feel like they aren't facing a worthy opponent, they sometimes don't even bother to use a sword, just like when Mihawk used a dagger against Zoro or when Zoro punched a sky shark away on Skypiea.
Being a swordsman might also have to do with your dedication to the sword but i don't think being a piece of shit changes anything
Like hyouzou and shiryu aren't very honorable in the way they fight but are still dedicated enough to create their own style
I know zoro said king wasn't one as soon as he punched him but when did he say it to daz?
Like hyouzou and shiryu aren't very honorable in the way they fight but are still dedicated enough to create their own style
I know zoro said king wasn't one as soon as he punched him but when did he say it to daz?
Yeah, I guess it's true.
Maybe Zoro personally saw Hyouzou as too much of a joke to call him a swordsman, or maybe he simply forgot about him due to how much of a small fry he was.
That's my bad for Daz Bones, I just went to check and it's actually him who said himself he wasn't a swordsman (Chapter 195) to which Zoro replied (after having seen his circular saws) :
"If you're not a swordsman, then maybe you're an excavator"
To which Daz replied : "I'm an assassin"
Maybe Zoro personally saw Hyouzou as too much of a joke to call him a swordsman, or maybe he simply forgot about him due to how much of a small fry he was.
That's my bad for Daz Bones, I just went to check and it's actually him who said himself he wasn't a swordsman (Chapter 195) to which Zoro replied (after having seen his circular saws) :
"If you're not a swordsman, then maybe you're an excavator"
To which Daz replied : "I'm an assassin"
I skimmed it so i might've missed it tbh but i don't think zoro ever says hyouzou isn't a swordsman. Just that his strength is so irrelevant to him that he's basically a nobody aka a frog lol
Aight thanks that makes sense
I skimmed back to the kaku fight too and he's weird tbh
Like he was 100% a swordsman before he ate his fruit specializing in 4 sword style. Using 2 actual swords and tempest kicks
Tho while trying to figure out how to use his fruit he dropped his swordsmanship for a bit. Focusing on trying to use his neck and nose
By the end where he picked it back up in the last chapter of their fight actually using 4 sword techniques. At the same time he was verbally differentiating when he was using 4 sword style and when he was focused on using fruit techniques
So is he still a swordsman? Yes no kinda maybe 🗿
Like he knows swordsmanship and has a style so in that sense yes he is
At the same time with his new devil fruit abilities it gives him a different style to fight with that doesn't involve swordsmanship
He might be more comparable to king now than a "real" swordsman now aka a killing machine. Like king even tho he isn't one was able to overwhelm zoro when it came to straight up swordsmanship before koh
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Tashigi is a swordsman tho tbf
If tashigi isn't one at this point no one is lol
Laws likely sayin that swordsman like spirit aka honor/way of thinking is meaningless for the weak. And not straight up saying she isn't a swordsman
Swordsman honor is "coincidentally" extremly similar to a samurai's honor aka bushido. Something many characters have stated their negative opinion on even back at punk hazard. Between sanji and kinemon and even kinemon and momo they had to let go of that pride and ask for help knowing their not strong enough alone. Along with other aspects of it being argued against
Aight thanks that makes sense
I skimmed back to the kaku fight too and he's weird tbh
Like he was 100% a swordsman before he ate his fruit specializing in 4 sword style. Using 2 actual swords and tempest kicks
Tho while trying to figure out how to use his fruit he dropped his swordsmanship for a bit. Focusing on trying to use his neck and nose
By the end where he picked it back up in the last chapter of their fight actually using 4 sword techniques. At the same time he was verbally differentiating when he was using 4 sword style and when he was focused on using fruit techniques
So is he still a swordsman? Yes no kinda maybe 🗿
Like he knows swordsmanship and has a style so in that sense yes he is
At the same time with his new devil fruit abilities it gives him a different style to fight with that doesn't involve swordsmanship
He might be more comparable to king now than a "real" swordsman now aka a killing machine. Like king even tho he isn't one was able to overwhelm zoro when it came to straight up swordsmanship before koh
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Tashigi is a swordsman tho tbf
If tashigi isn't one at this point no one is lol
Laws likely sayin that swordsman like spirit aka honor/way of thinking is meaningless for the weak. And not straight up saying she isn't a swordsman
Swordsman honor is "coincidentally" extremly similar to a samurai's honor aka bushido. Something many characters have stated their negative opinion on even back at punk hazard. Between sanji and kinemon and even kinemon and momo they had to let go of that pride and ask for help knowing their not strong enough alone. Along with other aspects of it being argued against
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A sword is a weapon. A lot of untrained individuals use guns as a weapon in real life when there are officers and troops that are professionals. In the One Piece world where Pirates are fighting all the time, a sword is a go-to weapon. But just because you use a sword as a secondhand tool, doesn't mean you are suddenly better than a true swordsman.
It's what separates those who use a sword as a mere tool from the real masters in the end.
It's what separates those who use a sword as a mere tool from the real masters in the end.
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