Controversial Big Mom is an Absolute Trash Person

[Midnight Delight]

That's straight up Mafia moves and would be #1 headline if it happened in the real world. He is also a dead beat dad and of the four greatest pirates (terrorists) in the world refusing to follow the law no matter what you think of the law.

I mean, he shot criminals trying to kill a child

 

[NAMELESS]

I could say the same about Hitler, Leopold II, Stalin, Pot and Mao.
Dumb question

except she is not real lmfao dumb take

 

[Erkan12]

What is the difference between Big Mom and a Celestial Dragon? She seems just like them. The people around her are tools for her private pleasure or vision, and what they see, feel or think about it is irrelevant to her.
.

Did you learn the difference between 2?

As I just debunked, Big mom has good sides to children, while Celestial Dragons just shoots children with a bazooka for no reason as we see how they tried to kill Sabo when he was a kid.

 

[Sasaki Kojirō]

No, Fleet Admiral Wig Mom cannot be trash

 

[Malakhith]

I see where you are coming from, and while I respect your post and view, I do respectfully disagree. We probably will not see eye to eye on this issue, which is perfectly fine.

I will share why I think the way I do, and my opinion on such matters below. But before that, I very much want to outline that I don't think poorly of you at all, @Malakhith . There is potential that some of what I say below could be interpreted as an accusation made with the interest of fitting you into some box of a type of person I would look down upon. So I wanted to make sure that I wrote that I have no such view. You sound like a pretty reasonable person, and obviously brought out a lot of compassion/empathy points which are good traits.

So, what I am about to say is more of my personal view, based on experience on the topic of change, power to change and whether the individual has a choice or not:

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My experience in things like that.

My personal experience is that I know a lot of people who maintained behavioral patterns that they knew were subpar - the types of behavior that hurts both themselves and others. For example:

The guy who literally never works a day in his life, and "rides the system".

The silly single mother who over-mothers her son for her whole life, and enables bad traits by being weak on discipline.

The marijuana smoking, alcohol abusing carpenter who always speaks abusively to his employees the moment they so much as drop a 1 cent nail.

The guy whose wife wants to divorce him and thinks everything is her fault - yet only ever talked to her the way a pimp talks to his ----, and somehow was stupid enough to think he would get a happily ever after story while behaving like scumbag.

The deadbeat dad, the absentee dad.

The mom who blames her ex-husband for everything, all her problems for her whole life.

The video gaming/computer gaming addict.

Various drug addicts, and addicts of numerous things.


..... All that is just to name a few. I could give countless more examples.


While I agree that base routines - especially those imprinted in the subconscious parts of the brain - are exceedingly difficult to remove, they are not impossible. The difference between very difficult or even extremely difficult and actually impossible is a universe of difference in my view. There are times when people's most sacred dreams and goals are actually threatened by their own imprinted behavior and traits, where if they want that "happily ever after" they absolutely must overthrow those routines.

The battle place in such situations is the mind, and the greatest enemy is both self, and the enforcer of self. Or should we say, old self. Old self vs. new self.

I am of the view and opinion - and not an uneducated opinion, very observation based rather - that most of those individuals have some decision point where they catch a very strong hint that the behavior they love to promote, tolerate and defend is the very thing making their life miserable. They start to realize that they are either their own worst enemy, or the enemy of the very dream and goal they hold sacred. Usually at that point they have a tremendous opportunity to break through - and indeed, some do though it is quite rare, sadly.

What usually keeps people stuck in a bad habit or mindset are usually pretty common factors. One you hinted at is the difficulty level. Basically, in a nutshell, that is your own body/emotions fighting against you making a legit move (usually involving a lot of short-term suffering) to improve your long-term life. You catch a small gleaning of this whenever you try to quit a so-called fleshly comfort that has become detrimental due to an imbalance or misuse. I.e. Smoking, Alcohol, Marijuana, Excessive sexual stimulation - anything potentially used as a form of coping mechanism to tolerate the so-called or so-perceived "difficulty of life". (Generally, difficulty of life is different per the individual. For some, difficulty is when they break their finger nail, or can't get someone to do a job for them for free. For others, difficulty is when you are forced to accept a reality where you have an actual dedicated enemy trying to destroy your life for no real good reason at all. Still others, some other thing.)

It is important to note, that people of the Narccistic character archetype are often addicted to achieving sense of superiority over others, and stress relief through domination or perceived domination of an other. Their way of "coping with hardships" is, often, to mistreat others. I tend to be somewhat partial to Empaths, because where I am the Narcissists outnumber the Empaths by vast numbers, and typically persecute Empaths by nature in a variety of ways.

Another factor is, for example, the Enablers. The people who function as bad counselors/patronizers that constantly reassure the individual "everything is fine", "you're doing great" "you don't have to change a thing". or "There are no major consequences of this behavior" - people who tell the individual "the thing they want to hear" rather than "the thing they need to hear" when that same individual confronts their own problems and begin to ask questions - there is always someone it seems that thinks they are doing good because "they just don't want to see the person hurting" so they always counsel the person the "path of least resistance" - and for people who are very vulnerable to a heavy need or reliance on outside validation . If you get a person with a legitimately bad habit with even one single enabler, it is incredibly difficult to address that habit. If you get one with multiple enablers - a whole arrangement of bad counselors constantly giving advice to simply keep that person where they are at forever - it becomes horrifically more difficult to address the behavior.

I have a lot of experience with family members getting into obviously toxic and unhealthy relationships. I have always seen Self-Deception (People lying to themselves) and a slew of enablers (Outsiders lying to the individuals) present to amplify the difficulty of dealing with the actual issue. This is made all the worse when you introduce a concept like The Negative Confession, or Self-Fulfilling Prophecy. For example, when an individual is misdiagnosed with a mental illness and a label associated with it - these misdiagnosis do happen in real life from time to time - the individual believes the words of the one giving the diagnosis "because of this, you can't do this, you will never be able to do that, or achieve such and such" - and believing the words, they forfeit the matter because of the belief and then make no needed effort to achieve the actual thing - whatever it is.


So essentially, based on what I have seen and experienced, people make change harder than its needs to be and often forfeit their power to change by giving in to self-deception (lying to themselves that things are not as bad as they are), and enablers (people assuring them that it is not as big an issue as it really is.) - and cave in to the idea that they have no choice. They just simply surrender to default patterns and nature. I myself as an individual have many habits that in my opinion, absolutely must be changed - habits that threaten my own dreams, yet which are deeply ingrained and virtually nature - things enacted by the default impulse. Yet I hold hope that I can change those behavioural patterns in my own mental and emotional systems and override them through force of will, and I would certainly not easily forfeit the battle against myself. When people see bad habits and the battles as a matter of life and death in importance - they will make massive changes. Regardless, I also found in my own case that - with regards to my personal habits I want to change - I have had to deal with my own pleasure-loving impulse (nature to avoid harship, "nature to pursue path of least resistance", a bunch of terrible counsellors enabling the behavior I don't want, whose patronizing advances I had to reject and rather to opt for some level of alienation from even close friends - a body that fights to make me do what it wants rather than what my mind wants., and finally, the most difficult part, the actual enemies who rise up because the one person going against the grain makes them feel insecure about themselves - thus they interfere with someone else's business. I've come to the conclusion that, even when it seems insanely difficult, and even cruelly unfair, that I would conclude that it simply indeed is insanely difficult and cruelly unfair, but that I would strive and move forward inspite of that obstacle of radical difficulty. Now not only do I watch out for myself making and taking advantage of "Illegitimate excuses" - but even actual "legitimate excuses" - real good reasons for throwing in the towel, at least those that made perfect sense to me in the past... I am now turning away from them, and I believe that I am achieving some success in acquiring the change desired, only in little pieces, one bit a time.

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Back to Big Mom:


So for me - I take Big Mom's case as intrinsically relatable to that concept above. Because of what I have seen and experienced, I am liable to believe that it is far more likely that Big Mom had these decision points, and simply gave in to the combination of perceived difficulty changing plus the comfort of all those enablers, than to believe that she genuinely had no opportunity to become anything other than what she became.

Again, this is my personal view only. I don't demand others to conform to it. I offer it as an explanation of my viewpoint, not a spear-wielding crusade of moral conversion.

Good Morning!

To be honest, I don't think we were in actual disagreement about how to change ingrained patterns and the possibility of it. The only that we seemed to disagree is that, based on my experiences, I don't believe that people can change ingrained patterns without removing the things or people that enable it in the first place, but looking at your post now it looks like you also agree with me on this aspect.

Back to Big Mom:

I agree with you that she should have moments when she questioned her reasoning and methods during the years. And I personally think that the Totland that the SH found was actually the version she perfected during the years. The thing that I doubt is that, because of her trauma and abandonment issues, it could go in other -more bening- way, beyond what we saw.

First: her dream. If you look at her dream in a vacuum, I doubt anyone- from the most villainous to the most heroic character- would have issues with it. Frankly, many people think that Luffy true dream is something similar to hers. So, even if she questioned her dream and tried to ask random people, the best she would hear would be ''that's too naive'' or ''the other countries would never allow it to happen''. Even Kaido would just laugh and tell her that it was a good dream but too naive/stupid to work. And he was a piece of shit. So, in the best case scenario, she would question the method to achieve the dream but not the dream itself.

Then come the question of her methods. Young BM seemed more like a conqueror like Atila, the hun than older BM. It's very likely that, after she found real opposition from other Yonkos and Marines that she couldn't just stroll over, that she also questioned herself and tried the Hapsburg approach. Again, in a vacuum, it's a great approach that worked in the real world and would be a great argument if someone called her violent: ''You didn't want me to conquer and said that a bloody approach wouldn't work! This way no one needs to die and my family keeps the power! win, win!''.

And then come the question of how she treats her citizens. Overall, her citizens have a good life. It's a good life in a prison but I don't doubt that many people would die to defend it. I think we can agree that she likes to keep her ''toys'' neat and if someone questioned the treatment of her citizens they would have very few arguments because the One Piece world is a shithole.

In general, it's pretty hard to criticize her country thinking as someone from that world. If you say that her citizens lack X, she would do her best to get it for them (woe to those that have those things and don't share, of course). And if you ask her to let her citizens leave, she would likely ask why and what they lack under her (the revs exist because of the poor conditions that WG countries have and they also aren't allowed to leave)- which would bring the same results, specially in a environment full of enablers that want the status quo to be kept.

In order for someone to change they need to see the error in their ways and how they could be better. Or, in another words, they need to be made aware that their way of thinking is ''wrong'' and ''there's a better way to live''. If you are already in a way that's arguably better than your neighbors and giving a stable and safe life to your citizens, why should you totally change everything? What' sthe better way that you can point and say to BM: ''Here, be more like this!''. The best example would be WB and his subjugated places sucked a lot compared with Totland (for the common man point of view).

But again, thanks for your input. It's was a fun and engaging read.

 

[Cozy Sofa]

I mean, he shot criminals trying to kill a child

Sure, it's better than many of the other despicable characters but it's still murder in broad day light in front of innocent people.

 

[Fujishiro]

On my way to work shortly, so I might touch up this post a bit later with adding manga panels and the rest.


Basically, I think Big Mom is a terrible piece of garbage character. I am normally not the type to rush for insults, but this character is indeed worthy. I think Big Mom may be the most disgusting of the villains shown in One Piece.

Here are some reasons:

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One: Reveres a a child trafficker scumbag. (Carmel)

Those who revere trash people are less than trash people. Enough said.

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She doesnt know Carmels true nature.

 

[Monkey D Theories]

BM is a pirate. That being said she’s not the worst pirate.

 

[K!NG HARA$H!MA]

Big Mom is mentally a child

 

[Juanpiz]

She had a better story than hostage kaidou
:risitavirus:

 

[SparagusParty]

Good Morning!

To be honest, I don't think we were in actual disagreement about how to change ingrained patterns and the possibility of it. The only that we seemed to disagree is that, based on my experiences, I don't believe that people can change ingrained patterns without removing the things or people that enable it in the first place, but looking at your post now it looks like you also agree with me on this aspect.

Back to Big Mom:

I agree with you that she should have moments when she questioned her reasoning and methods during the years. And I personally think that the Totland that the SH found was actually the version she perfected during the years. The thing that I doubt is that, because of her trauma and abandonment issues, it could go in other -more bening- way, beyond what we saw.

First: her dream. If you look at her dream in a vacuum, I doubt anyone- from the most villainous to the most heroic character- would have issues with it. Frankly, many people think that Luffy true dream is something similar to hers. So, even if she questioned her dream and tried to ask random people, the best she would hear would be ''that's too naive'' or ''the other countries would never allow it to happen''. Even Kaido would just laugh and tell her that it was a good dream but too naive/stupid to work. And he was a piece of shit. So, in the best case scenario, she would question the method to achieve the dream but not the dream itself.

Then come the question of her methods. Young BM seemed more like a conqueror like Atila, the hun than older BM. It's very likely that, after she found real opposition from other Yonkos and Marines that she couldn't just stroll over, that she also questioned herself and tried the Hapsburg approach. Again, in a vacuum, it's a great approach that worked in the real world and would be a great argument if someone called her violent: ''You didn't want me to conquer and said that a bloody approach wouldn't work! This way no one needs to die and my family keeps the power! win, win!''.

And then come the question of how she treats her citizens. Overall, her citizens have a good life. It's a good life in a prison but I don't doubt that many people would die to defend it. I think we can agree that she likes to keep her ''toys'' neat and if someone questioned the treatment of her citizens they would have very few arguments because the One Piece world is a shithole.

In general, it's pretty hard to criticize her country thinking as someone from that world. If you say that her citizens lack X, she would do her best to get it for them (woe to those that have those things and don't share, of course). And if you ask her to let her citizens leave, she would likely ask why and what they lack under her (the revs exist because of the poor conditions that WG countries have and they also aren't allowed to leave)- which would bring the same results, specially in a environment full of enablers that want the status quo to be kept.

In order for someone to change they need to see the error in their ways and how they could be better. Or, in another words, they need to be made aware that their way of thinking is ''wrong'' and ''there's a better way to live''. If you are already in a way that's arguably better than your neighbors and giving a stable and safe life to your citizens, why should you totally change everything? What' sthe better way that you can point and say to BM: ''Here, be more like this!''. The best example would be WB and his subjugated places sucked a lot compared with Totland (for the common man point of view).

But again, thanks for your input. It's was a fun and engaging read.

Good reply.