General & Others Fishman Island is objectively better than Wano

[lee33]

I am seeing a lot of unjust hate towards Fishman Island on this forum. This is mainly due to Hody Jones being the main antagonist. If you base a story only off the main antagonist then no wonder people think it is worse than Wano because to them all they care about in One Piece are the fights even though the fights in One Piece are the worse in all of shounen.

It is objectively false to claim Fishmand Island is worse than Wano from a story perspective. That is not an opinion. Anyone claiming Wano is better than Fishman Island does not know how a story works. Fishman Island is objectively much better than Wano and accomplished a lot more in just 50 chapters than Wano did in 150 chapters.

We learned in Fishman Island:

1. Ancient weapon Poseidon being shirahoshi.
2. Prophecy of Luffy destroying Fishman Island.
3. Introduction to Joy Boy.
4. Character development of Nami resolving her incident with Fishman.
5. Backstory of the slavery and racism of Fishman and Mermaids which is a central story plot in One Piece.
6. Introduction to Big Mom (in hindsight it turned out to be terrible but at that moment it was good).
7. Celestial dragon backstory.
8. Sea kings, the voice of all things.
9. World Building drop between Aokiji and Akainu as well as BB.
10. Jinbei.

What have we learned in Wano?

1. The name of the last island is Laugh Tale and apparently Roger was too early.

Disclaimer: Pay attention to the actual things we learned in Fishman Island being things CENTRAL to the story whereas in Wano all we got were information that is only relevant to Wano and nothing to do with the central plot points of One Piece.

 

[Roo]

70% of what you said came at the end of FI. Wano ain’t there yet

 

[lee33]

70% of what you said came at the end of FI. Wano ain’t there yet

That is false Roo. Number 2, 4, 5, 7, 8 and 10 came in the middle. That is 5/10 therefore 50 percent. Also, it doesn't matter where it came from. In Wano there has been way more than enough time to share information. Story progression is also a very important part of story telling. It is a false analogy to say we should wait until the end of an arc that is 150 chapters long to get relevant information, to an arc that is only 50 chapters long. That is not a logical argument. Context matters.

 

[Rottkins]

Can't wait to read the whole discussion. It might be interesting~

 

[Mackiss]

So, pieces of information without development is what matters in a arc?

Wano is about defeating 2 yonko, which will actually advance the story.

 

[lee33]

So, pieces of information without development is what matters in a arc?

Wano is about defeating 2 yonko, which will actually advance the story.

That is a false statement. You need to learn how to lie better dude. 1, 4, 5, 6, 7, 9 and 10 all had development.

"wano is about defeating 2 yonkos" okay and your point is? Every arc has a main antagonist that needs to be defeated. If those Two Yonkos actually were important in terms of central plot points of the One Piece than you may have a point but they know as much about the One Piece than Buggy the Clown. Actually maybe even less than Buggy the clown since at least he was with Roger. Also, it turned out those two Yonkos are nothing more than just meat heads, which I initially thought they were more important but they are nothing more than just hype tools.

 

[Night Flight]

Even if Fishman Island did have great amounts of worldbuilding and lore reveals, I think it's unfair to claim that this "objectively" makes it better than any other arc. If someone says that they are more invested in the conflict, characters, and plot beats of another arc and therefore think that one's better, I think that's a completely valid take to have.

For example, I like all of the lore details you mentioned above, especially the Fisher Tiger/Otohime flashbacks, and Luffy inviting Jinbe to join the crew. However, I just simply prefer Wano's story and the narrative of the Strawhats and co. taking on 2 Yonko.

 

[lee33]

Even if Fishman Island did have great amounts of worldbuilding and lore reveals, I think it's unfair to claim that this "objectively" makes it better than any other arc. If someone says that they are more invested in the conflict, characters, and plot beats of another arc and therefore think that one's better, I think that's a completely valid take to have.

For example, I like all of the lore details you mentioned above, especially the Fisher Tiger/Otohime flashbacks, and Luffy inviting Jinbe to join the crew. However, I just simply prefer Wano's story and the narrative of the Strawhats and co. taking on 2 Yonko.

If story plot points progression, lore reveals, character development, is why you read One Piece then, yes, Fishman Island is objectively better. If action and fights are why you read One Piece than yes Wano is better than Fishman Island.

I don't read One Piece for the fights, there are literally dozens of other shounen mangas who do fights way better than One Piece. Fights in One Piece are one of the worse thing about it.

 

[Mackiss]

That is a false statement. You need to learn how to lie better dude. 1, 4, 5, 6, 7, 9 and 10 all had development.

"wano is about defeating 2 yonkos" okay and your point is? Every arc has a main antagonist that needs to be defeated. If those Two Yonkos actually were important in terms of central plot points of the One Piece than you may have a point but they know as much about the One Piece than Buggy the Clown. Actually maybe even less than Buggy the clown since at least he was with Roger. Also, it turned out those two Yonkos are nothing more than just meat heads, which I initially thought they were more important but they are nothing more than just hype tools.

Whatever you think about Kaido and BM, luffy would still need to face them in order for the story to advance, wich is not the case in FI, FI arc didn't avanced the story in nothing. After FI arc Oda could'v done a filler arc if he wanted and that would be fine because the story would be pratically in the same point as started after timeskip.

We can shit on wano development all we want, but we can't ignore the importance this arc for the story by himself. Yes, it's a "fighting arc", most fights are shit but those fights are crucial to happen, so even didn't revealing any mystery based on ancient story, wano by himlself is creating a new story for the world.

Unlike FI, by the end of wano arc, Oda will have no choice but proceed to the end of the series, cause the defeat of 2 yonko greatly limits Oda's possibilities for the future of the series, so it's a extreme advancement to the story.

I agree that wano is underwhelming as a whole, but it's definitely not worse than any of post timeskip arcs.

 

[Ask D question]

No, just no


The themes of Fishmen island are better than wano's core themes

All the rest is poorly handled


From gags to character arcs

 

[Night Flight]

If story plot points progression, lore reveals, character development, is why you read One Piece then, yes, Fishman Island is objectively better. If action and fights are why you read One Piece than yes Wano is better than Fishman Island.

I don't read One Piece for the fights, there are literally dozens of other shounen mangas who do fights way better than One Piece. Fights in One Piece are one of the worse thing about it.

I don't read One Piece for the fights either -I actually dislike the obsession a lot of people in this forum have with powerscaling- but I still find the story of Wano's fall, the scabbards, Momo, Oden, Roger, Kaido, etc. to be more entertaining than FI. I still like a lot of the elements from Fishman Island ofc, and all of the points you mentioned are definitely some of the coolest aspects of it, but enjoyment is just subjective at the end of the day.

And regarding the lore reveals, someone else already mentioned this, but I think we'll have a gigantic lore dump at the end of Wano. The defeat of the Yonko will probably have big consequences on the world stage, so IMO I think we should wait until Wano properly ends before discussing its lore contributions (and yes, I know Wano is already 150 chapters long, but that doesn't change the fact that we don't know how much lore will get revealed at the end of it. We'll just have to wait and see.)

 

[lee33]

I don't read One Piece for the fights either -I actually dislike the obsession a lot of people in this forum have with powerscaling- but I still find the story of Wano's fall, the scabbards, Momo, Oden, Roger, Kaido, etc. to be more entertaining than FI. I still like a lot of the elements from Fishman Island ofc, and all of the points you mentioned are definitely some of the coolest aspects of it, but enjoyment is just subjective at the end of the day.

But there is no story of Roger, Kaido, etc. We still don't know why Kaido is in Wano. Why he is a drunk. Etc. Also, we learned nothing of Roger in Wano. Everything we learned about Roger during Oden's backstory was things we already previously knew. Like I said, in my original post, the only reason people dislike Fishman Island is because of Hody Jones. So it is about fights and action to you? Imagine if Kaido was the anatgonist of Fishman Island would you have liked it better than WAno?

nd regarding the lore reveals, someone else already mentioned this, but I think we'll have a gigantic lore dump at the end of Wano. The defeat of the Yonko will probably have big consequences on the world stage, so IMO I think we should wait until Wano properly ends before discussing its lore contributions (and yes, I know Wano is already 150 chapters long, but that doesn't change the fact that we don't know how much lore will get revealed at the end of it. We'll just have to wait and see.)

Too late. 150 chapters is way more than enough time to reveal the lore. Waiting until 4 years and 150 chapter to reveal relevant information makes everything between that basically filler. That is not how to write a quality story.

 

[Pooth]

150 chapters is way more than enough time to reveal the lore. Waiting until 4 years and 150 chapter to reveal relevant information makes everything between that basically filler. That is not how to write a quality story.

Trust in Oda

 

[Herrera95]

70% of what you said came at the end of FI. Wano ain’t there yet

1. Ancient weapon Poseidon being shirahoshi.
6. Introduction to Big Mom (in hindsight it turned out to be terrible but at that moment it was good).
8. Sea kings, the voice of all things.
9. World Building drop between Aokiji and Akainu as well as BB.

Only those 4 topics came at the end. So 60% of what he said came early/mid arc. And Fishman Island is a short arc. It made much more in few chapters than Wano in... idk 5x more chapters?

 

[Hanzo hattori]

FI is the worst arc

 

[ShinichiMugi]

The flashback is great. The rest sucks.

 

[Finalbeta]

I think it was a very good arc.

WCI is a mess.

Wano got things that are better and things that are worse.

 

[York]

Yeah, I wish every other chapter was just a lore dump, too

 

[Santoryu D Bazooka]

We learned in Fishman Island:

1. Ancient weapon Poseidon being shirahoshi.
2. Prophecy of Luffy destroying Fishman Island.
3. Introduction to Joy Boy.
4. Character development of Nami resolving her incident with Fishman.
5. Backstory of the slavery and racism of Fishman and Mermaids which is a central story plot in One Piece.
6. Introduction to Big Mom (in hindsight it turned out to be terrible but at that moment it was good).
7. Celestial dragon backstory.
8. Sea kings, the voice of all things.
9. World Building drop between Aokiji and Akainu as well as BB.
10. Jinbei.

What have we learned in Wano?

1- Ancient weapons "???" been brought up by both Kaido and Big Mom. Momo/Zunesha are linked the same way Shirahoshi is linked to Sea Kings.
2- Prophecy of Sun God Nika and a history of how he saved the slaves around the world.
3- Introduction of the Oni race and their link to Joy Boy/Ozz.
4- Character development of Sanji resolving his relation/conflict with his genes and King/Queen and more "Robin/Zoro/Luffy/Momo".
5- Backstory of the closed nation of Wano and how the whole line of Kozuki were responsible for writing the Poneglyphs and them shutting themselfs in wano which is a central story plot of One Piece.
6- Introduction to Rocks (in hindsight it turned out to be great and it still is great now)
7- Celestial Dragons backstory and how Garp/Roger saved them.
8- Wano is a collection of islands put together and a skull of an ancient race that used to pull "continents" staring at it.
9- World Building drop between Wano having a piece of the puzzle to one piece as well as a reason why Kaido thought he was the "one".
10- Yamato.

I will write some words to describe Wano:-
Identity - Bushido - Swords - Hidden - Hell - Joy - Puzzle - Missing.

 

[Lhulu]

No.