General & Others How to successfully Conquer a conqueror

#1
What does it mean to conquer a conqueror?

Having a conqueror as a subordinate what does it mean/imply for the leader being able to do so?
what does it mean/imply for the subordinate being under someone else?
  • Xebec had newgate, linlin, and kaido
    • Shiki 100% had it but hess just a weird character to the cannon
  • Roger had rayleigh, oden, and shanks tho we don't know if he unlocked it back then
    • Buggy lowkey being a possible contender just cause its buggy lol
  • Whitebeard had oden and ace
    • Teach also likely having it
  • Big mom had/has katakuri
  • Luffy has zoro and will likely get more
  • Kaido kinda had doflamingo who was his business partner and kinda yamato who he tried to force to listen to him and do as he said
  • The world government technically had/has sengoku
    • Garp definitely has it so the wg/marines technically have him but he does refuse to move up so he doesn't have to take orders from the celestial dragons
    • The admirals might have it
 
#9
Being friends with someone doesn't really mean you'd be willing to follow under them
Luffy did this. Strawhat crew rarely use the " word"captain". Only for special reasons.

+++Luffy make them believe him that he can always his opponent whoever he is.

Whitebeard make his crew a family. So they called him pops. The crewmembers were brothers who had to make their pops Pirate King.The only exception was Oden. Whitebeard called him firstly as brother. So he made Oden feeling him as a brother. Again Whitebeard used the family theme.
 
H

Herrera95

#10
There is no big deal and no reason to overthinking it. Oda never made a good build up for that.

Luffy initially wanted to join Shanks crew. Doesn't matter if he didn't had CoC unlocked back then. It was inside him anyway. Or inside his DF who knows.

Kaido could at some extent conquer Doflamingo but couldn't conquer CoCless guys like Ashura Doji.

There is no pattern.
 
#11
What does it mean to conquer a conqueror?

Having a conqueror as a subordinate what does it mean/imply for the leader being able to do so?
what does it mean/imply for the subordinate being under someone else?
  • Xebec had newgate, linlin, and kaido
    • Shiki 100% had it but hess just a weird character to the cannon
  • Roger had rayleigh, oden, and shanks tho we don't know if he unlocked it back then
    • Buggy lowkey being a possible contender just cause its buggy lol
  • Whitebeard had oden and ace
    • Teach also likely having it
  • Big mom had/has katakuri
  • Luffy has zoro and will likely get more
  • Kaido kinda had doflamingo who was his business partner and kinda yamato who he tried to force to listen to him and do as he said
  • The world government technically had/has sengoku
    • Garp definitely has it so the wg/marines technically have him but he does refuse to move up so he doesn't have to take orders from the celestial dragons
    • The admirals might have it
Conquering a conqueror=destroying his dreams,killing his friends and crippling him so he can't be a pirate anymore.That is the only way.Luffy didn't conquer anyone on his crew,they just tag along because they believe in his potential.
Chinjao is a good example of conqueror that lost his will to move on in his pirate career.
 
S

stealthblack

#12
There are small CoC and big CoC.

if the coc is big you can beat the small CoC. Like say luffy vs chinjao coc, or shanks big coc vs zoro small coc. Shanks and luffy can ko 100.000 or 50.000 fodders, zoro only like 5 fodders
 
#13
What does it mean to conquer a conqueror?

Having a conqueror as a subordinate what does it mean/imply for the leader being able to do so?
what does it mean/imply for the subordinate being under someone else?
  • Xebec had newgate, linlin, and kaido
    • Shiki 100% had it but hess just a weird character to the cannon
  • Roger had rayleigh, oden, and shanks tho we don't know if he unlocked it back then
    • Buggy lowkey being a possible contender just cause its buggy lol
  • Whitebeard had oden and ace
    • Teach also likely having it
  • Big mom had/has katakuri
  • Luffy has zoro and will likely get more
  • Kaido kinda had doflamingo who was his business partner and kinda yamato who he tried to force to listen to him and do as he said
  • The world government technically had/has sengoku
    • Garp definitely has it so the wg/marines technically have him but he does refuse to move up so he doesn't have to take orders from the celestial dragons
    • The admirals might have it
Immerasurable willpower, persona and values.

As we know guys like Kaido, Big Mom and Zoro will not follow just anyone

See above, Z boy downplaying the fact that Zoro is Luffy's subordinate despite being a conqueror when it's actually a big deal as only few characters have been able to achieve this

Kaido a conqueror was uable conquer Yamato despite being stronger than her.
 
#16
Immerasurable willpower, persona and values.

As we know guys like Kaido, Big Mom and Zoro will not follow just anyone

See above, Z boy downplaying the fact that Zoro is Luffy's subordinate despite being a conqueror when it's actually a big deal as only few characters have been able to achieve this

Kaido a conqueror was uable conquer Yamato despite being stronger than her.
Yeah with how strong willed and independent most conquerors are being able to successfully have one follow you is an extremely impressive feat
 
#17
It depends on what you mean by conquering a conqueror. The ones who try to force it may not actually be able to do it. The best way is to somehow find common ground. We have very little to establish exactly what makes a conqueror serve under another conqueror. At what age someone awakens their CoC also matters somewhat.

Let's analyze all the ones that we have so far.
1. Kata under BM: Simply because Kata is BM's son.
2. Yamato under Kaido: Not entirely sure we can call this as being under Kaido but so far it has been through force and Yamato hates him for it and wants to kill him.
3. WB, Kaido and BM under Rocks: A bad case of conquerors under conqueror (Rocks probably was one), a lot of infighting/killing/possible betrayal. Banded together for a scheme/plan. Very little we know of it but must be something great for WB to follow Rocks. Rocks had the charisma to sell a dream which the others probably liked. Maybe they joined to get it for themselves at the end by killing others and stealing it.
4. Sengoku under WG (It is about serving under others): Was probably recruited at a young age and spent his whole career in the marines, when he awoke it, it was already too late and his career direction was pretty much decided. Plus he still became a FA so that is something like a conqueror in itself.
5. Oden under WB: WB was already against having a conqueror under him from his experience with Rocks. But Oden stayed due to his love/bond with WB and WB never called him his son like he did with the rest, but instead he called him his brother. A successful pairing. WB was the first and only option for Oden to realize his dream of seeing the world.
6. Ace under WB: Found his calling and his admiration for WB was the main thing that kept him under WB. He made a pact and honored it. I think WB was also preparing Ace to overtake him and become the PK.
7. Doffy under Kaido: Not exactly under Kaido, Doffy was his own man and king of a country, he was doing business with Kaido but he knew of Kaido's strength and was afraid of Kaido.
8. Shanks under Roger: Too young, probably didn't awaken CoC until much later, anyway he was a big admirer of Roger so would have still stayed under him maybe a little bit rebellious and independent.
9. Ray under Roger: This is one of the more intriguing ones cause this one was a successful one. Ray was called the partner of Roger (somewhat like how Oden was called the brother of WB) so there is that sense of equality and not direct subservience. The first meeting between Roger and Ray is kind of weird, Roger asks Ray to turn the world upside down. I think this is somewhat similar to Rocks selling his plan to WB, BM and Kaido (different pitch for each) but this grand plan/scheme/dream/adventure is what allowed these conquerors to make other conquerors tag alongside them. There is also Ray's epithet of the Dark King which shows his kingly ambitions, he earned that epithet, how, when and why, we don't know but he did.
10. Zoro under Luffy: This one again is a successful one and it is a mixture of the good points. Firstly Zoro agreed to be on the crew in exchange for Luffy saving his life. Zoro was helpless in that situation and this was his only option of living so he agreed. Because he agreed he is honoring that pact similar to Ace honoring his pact after losing to WB 100 times. The next is that Luffy sold his dream of being the PK, something grand/a big adventure for Zoro to really tag along. His admiration for Luffy is what has kept him on the crew apart from honoring his pact. He has been called both the partner of Luffy and his underling as well. Zoro himself has accepted Luffy as his leader but has also set some standards that Luffy must be up to, prime examples of this being Zoro's speech about bringing Usopp back and his comment in Fishman Island after Luffy using his CoC.

So to conquer a conqueror successfully the leader must be able to sell a grand scheme/plan/dream/adventure. The dream should in some way be meaningful to both even if for different reasons. Trying to use force to conquer a conqueror has so far not successfully worked (Kata is a wimp). And most importantly the two should have a deep understanding of each other and a great bond of friendship.
 
C

Cruxroux

#18
Do not get the idea of Conqueror means conqueroring.
It's the representation of your will. That's it.
How strong and big are your ambition.

And luffy won't get any other coc under his belt.

Whitebeard was against the idea of oden on their ships as multiple Coc will just bring clashes. and internal fighting.

whitebeard never had Oden as his son in the ship rather as a brother.
same with rogers.
both roger and wb oden isn't a permanent member to their ship. it's like law travelling with strawhats.
so count oden out.
and shanks. he was just a kid. atleast he awoke his coc after rogers execution.
whitebeard knew about ace being conqueror and it wasn't for a long time. they both had disagreements and ace left to take his revenge when whitebeard had different plans. this is internal fighting and you know what this lead to.

zoro has CLashed with luffy a lot but given his Nature he ain't the serious of decesion taker type.

roger only had rayleigh.

and marines admirals are never in symphony always in disagreement with each other presenting different type of Justice.
 
#19
Only Roger, WB, and Luffy have been the ones to β€œsuccessfully conquer” another Conqueror. Next closest is Rocks but he shit the bed with his crew, he never successfully unified them together. Everybody else was either by some technicality or completely failed to.
 
#20
Many of these relationships are not the same.
Some are partnerships.
Others are Captain/Subordinate, but the fact that the subordinate has Conqueror's Haki matters very little.
 
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