Speculations If Samurai/Pirates/Minks went to defeat Big Mom first

What if Samourai - Pirates - Minks alliance went to WCI and allied with Germa (WCI level only)


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#1
What if Samourai - Pirates - Minks alliance went to WCI and allied with Germa (WCI level only)

  • Luffy, Law, Judge, Dukes(Sulong), Capone, vs Big Mom
  • Zoro, Ichiji vs Katakuri
  • Reiju, Niji vs Smoothie (lightening > water)
  • Jinbei, Yonji vs Cracker (water > biscuit)
  • Sanji vs Snack
  • Kin'emon vs Perospero (fire > candy)
  • Robin, Brook vs Daifuku
  • Franky vs Oven
  • Raizo vs Tamago
  • Nami, Ussop, Chopper, Caesar + Minks(Sulong) vs enraged army

They lose?
 
#6
They would lose since big mom pirates are more organized and no kibi dango
This... Plus Luffy has no Advanced CoA... No Kid and Killer, no Drake... No Enma... Most BMP vets have abilities that needs at least CoA Hardening to counter so SHs outside ZSJ won't be that useful...

The only way to win is to lure them out to the sea and that's very hard and is not secured for a win...
 

TheAncientCenturion

I will never forgive Oda
‎‎‎
#7
  • Luffy, Law, Judge, Dukes(Sulong), Capone, vs Big Mom
Luffy at most can physically push Linlin around for a short duration. Law is as useful here as in Wano. Judge & Capone contribute nothing. The Sulong dukes can injure her but as seen with Kaido, lack the AP to put her down.

Big Mom wins after maybe an hour of combat.

  • Zoro, Ichiji vs Katakuri
Ichiji is irrelevant and Zoro wins extreme diff, coming down to Asura.
  • Reiju, Niji vs Smoothie (lightening > water)
Don't think the Vinsmokes have the portrayal to beat someone of Smoothie's caliber. Feats, they do win, but I'm gonna say Smoothie high diffs.

  • Jinbei, Yonji vs Cracker (water > biscuit)
Duo wins largely thanks to Jinbe.
Sanji wins maybe high difficulty.
  • Kin'emon vs Perospero (fire > candy)
Perospero wins mid difficulty.
  • Robin, Brook vs Daifuku
Robin/Brook win mid difficulty max. Robin spawns hands on the main body and cracks his neck.
Franky likely wins if he has the Shogun with him. Loses without it.
  • Raizo vs Tamago
  • Nami, Ussop, Chopper, Caesar + Minks(Sulong) vs enraged army
Raizo loses, Sulong army wins.
 
#8
Luffy at most can physically push Linlin around for a short duration. Law is as useful here as in Wano. Judge & Capone contribute nothing. The Sulong dukes can injure her but as seen with Kaido, lack the AP to put her down.

Big Mom wins after maybe an hour of combat.


Ichiji is irrelevant and Zoro wins extreme diff, coming down to Asura.

Don't think the Vinsmokes have the portrayal to beat someone of Smoothie's caliber. Feats, they do win, but I'm gonna say Smoothie high diffs.


Duo wins largely thanks to Jinbe.

Sanji wins maybe high difficulty.

Perospero wins mid difficulty.

Robin/Brook win mid difficulty max. Robin spawns hands on the main body and cracks his neck.

Franky likely wins if he has the Shogun with him. Loses without it.

Raizo loses, Sulong army wins.
I think you underrate the Vinskmoke base of Tea Party

If we consider the tea party :

Luffy never have the chance to win against Katakuri
Jinbei struggle against some BM kids
Sanji is below Daifuku

This was not the perfect ground for power scaling
 
#9
If it were just a pure battle between the two camps, Big Mom Pirates would win for sure.
They have:
  • a good organisation
  • strong devil fruits
  • many foot soldiers
  • technological advance (e.g. special Bullets, automatic guns, etc.)
  • Katakuri.

But if we follow the logic of One Piece, the alliance would win trough:
  • Big Mom rages and destroys half her Army (The Tama of this war)
  • Big Mom Children join the Alliance, because they dont like her Mom (Pudding, Katakuri, The Ice Cream man?, The white cream man?, fuck off i forgot their names)
  • Brook negates Big Moms Soul Power and destroys the other half of her army
  • Smoothie.
 
#10
If it were just a pure battle between the two camps, Big Mom Pirates would win for sure.
They have:
  • a good organisation
  • strong devil fruits
  • many foot soldiers
  • technological advance (e.g. special Bullets, automatic guns, etc.)
  • Katakuri.

But if we follow the logic of One Piece, the alliance would win trough:
  • Big Mom rages and destroys half her Army (The Tama of this war)
  • Big Mom Children join the Alliance, because they dont like her Mom (Pudding, Katakuri, The Ice Cream man?, The white cream man?, fuck off i forgot their names)
  • Brook negates Big Moms Soul Power and destroys the other half of her army
  • Smoothie.
Healthy Big Mom
Germa wearing Raid Suit (Candy Bullet 99% useless)
 
#12
Big Mom Pirates have Higher Numbers of Soldiers & also More Officers
Sweet Commanders are indeed comparable to Calamities but in a War, they are more Troublesome

Katakuri have Future Sight which can Help Stop a lot of Alliance Plans & Surprise Attacks, not to mention that Numbers are useless against him & the Strongest Members of Alliance are needed to keep him occupied

Cracker can create Infinite Amount of Soldiers who are really Strong & due to his Haki, not anyone can Stop them, so again Strongest Members of Alliance must take care of them, otherwise the Alliance Soldiers will be Overwhelmed

Another problem is Mont d'Or & Brulee & also Pudding's DF Abilities which can truly ruin Enemy's Formations & create Counter Surprise Formations. Not to mention that O-Tama cannot help in Whole Cake Island

Beasts Pirates were also attacked when they were Drunk & out of Formation, something that BMP doesn't suffer from during Tea Party.
Also they are gathered on Top of Whole Cake Chateau, so sneaking in will be much more difficult, especially that only Charlotte Family & certain Invitees are allowed inside the Party, meaning Alliance cannot have that Surprise Attack they managed to do in Onigashima.
Finally, Big Mom can easily hide the Moon by changing Climate & massively Nerf entire Mink Army

It's pretty clear that they are going to win in Onigashima mostly due to Luck even with all those Advantages.
Invading WCI is much much more Difficult with those Advantages gone & Charlotte Family having more Troublesome Abilities & Preparations. Imo Wano Alliance cannot Defeat BM Pirates (Realistically ofc, not taking Luck & Story into consideration)
 
#14
You should notice they had to set up a Gatling Gun, during a total war they dont have that opportunity

And in the statement, Germa are not facing enraged army.

Finally the gatling gun was useless as they destroyed it
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Big Mom Pirates have Higher Numbers of Soldiers & also More Officers
Sweet Commanders are indeed comparable to Calamities but in a War, they are more Troublesome

Katakuri have Future Sight which can Help Stop a lot of Alliance Plans & Surprise Attacks, not to mention that Numbers are useless against him & the Strongest Members of Alliance are needed to keep him occupied

Cracker can create Infinite Amount of Soldiers who are really Strong & due to his Haki, not anyone can Stop them, so again Strongest Members of Alliance must take care of them, otherwise the Alliance Soldiers will be Overwhelmed

Another problem is Mont d'Or & Brulee & also Pudding's DF Abilities which can truly ruin Enemy's Formations & create Counter Surprise Formations. Not to mention that O-Tama cannot help in Whole Cake Island

Beasts Pirates were also attacked when they were Drunk & out of Formation, something that BMP doesn't suffer from during Tea Party.
Also they are gathered on Top of Whole Cake Chateau, so sneaking in will be much more difficult, especially that only Charlotte Family & certain Invitees are allowed inside the Party, meaning Alliance cannot have that Surprise Attack they managed to do in Onigashima.
Finally, Big Mom can easily hide the Moon by changing Climate & massively Nerf entire Mink Army

It's pretty clear that they are going to win in Onigashima mostly due to Luck even with all those Advantages.
Invading WCI is much much more Difficult with those Advantages gone & Charlotte Family having more Troublesome Abilities & Preparations. Imo Wano Alliance cannot Defeat BM Pirates (Realistically ofc, not taking Luck & Story into consideration)
You forgot something in your analysis : Law is a far better strategist than Capone


Your argument is base of BMP facing half SH crew


Just look at Cocoa Island

- Pre-war : Nami outshined the whole BM navy on Sea with a damaged Sunny
- During the war : BMP had hard times against Germa basic clone in naval war and even got their ships invaded and turned into battlefield
- 4 Vinsmoke were enough to keep the Whole Vinsmoke Pirates who were on land harmless until the SH leave

All of them were greatly relieved when Big Mom joined the war, and if you had the panel below it's highly implied that fishmen and Germa won the naval war when the SH left


Inside your argument, you considered BMP having to face less than 20 individuals

When we're talking here about far more people (Germa clones and Minks included)
 
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#16
I literally said nothing about WCI Arc Events
We saw Alliance in Onigashima & the amount of Luck & Help they received
WCI is much more Difficult, as simple as that
Big Mom doesnt have an army as big as Kaido, you should also consider it
She compensate it with homies chess and other living creatures


If you think they're a big matchs for Sulong Minks, Germa Clones, Chopper, Ussop and Caesar, then well maybe

As for the commanders :

- Katakuri : in this configuration, Zoro and Ichiji are completely aware of Katakuri power because of Jinbei
- Smoothie have 0 feats that put her above Niji + Reiju as well as they dont
- Cracker clearly lose against Jinbei and Yonji
- Sanji should be able to beat Snack

For the rest it goes either way but this is a shonen
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I literally said nothing about WCI Arc Events
We saw Alliance in Onigashima & the amount of Luck & Help they received
WCI is much more Difficult, as simple as that
You can't say you didn't consider WCI when it's the only basis for the BMP
 
#20
I think they would win with even less difficulty than against Kaido!
Jinbe and Bege information on BMP would provide the perfect raid plan during the tea party!
BM-She is dumb and hunger pangs/personality switch is a major weakness!Destruction of the Cake and Mother Carmel picture would severely nerf her!
Luffy,Kidd,Law,Zoro+Dukes would beat her in a extended fight!
Katakuri:Most competent Kaido pirate!He would need to get ganged by at least 3 competent fighters to get dealt with quickly!I think Sanji-Ichiji-Killer would beat him in a high diff fight!Plus fire counter mochi DF!
Smoothie:Reiju+Niji beat her!Poison counters her DF!
Cracker:Jinbe is a bad match up for him!Anyone with water abilities+decent coa-strength can counter him!
Snack:already got beaten once by Urougue,anyone YC4 level with good physical strength beats him!Yonji or Judge beat him!
Veterans:they aren't that impressive and they would get ganged/outnumbered by this alliance veterans:
Straw Hats,Scabards/Yakuza,Dukes bodyguards,Kidd-Law-Bege pirates!They are screwed!
Chess army-no match for Germa clones,Sulong army and Samurai!
Naval battle:Fishman Pirates+Germa armada+Thousand Sunny would deal with BM forces in the sea!
Big Mom pirates aren't all that impressive after all!The right alliance with a good plan beats her!
 
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