Versus Battle Kisame versus Sarutobi Hiruzen

[Salah WG]

You already know that, no ?

Itachi > Orochimaru, but Orochimaru is = or > Jiraiya, but Jiraiya > Itachi and Jiraiya = Pein, but Pein > Orochimaru.

There is some inconsistencies on how strong is Orochimaru comparatively to his Akatsuki ex-fellows.

That's because you think A beats B & B beats C then A beats C
Naruto isn't like that, for example Databooks also said that Jiraya can beat Tsunade & Tsunade can beat Orochimaru & Orochimaru can beat Jiraya, it depends on Match-Up

Itachi can beat Orochimaru but he isn't Superior than him in Level & Jiraya isn't Superior than Itachi, it's just that Itachi deemed it's not wise to fight Jiraya at the time. Orochimaru is simply bad against those with Ocular Jutsu such as Itachi & Pain but Jiraya was better at handling them, Jiraya & Oro are still Same Level & Rivals according to Manga & Databooks

For example, Itachi didn't want to fight Guy too but didn't mind fighting Kakashi, even though we know that aside from 8th Gate, Guy & Kakashi are Rivals, it's because Guy was more troublesome to fight & knows how to handle the Sharingan

And this comparison is irrelevant, doesn't matter who is stronger than who & how strong is someone
These are Elite Ninja, they are worthy of becoming Kages & leading Villages & hunting Jinchurikis & other Kages too
For the final time, please understand how crazy it is that Orochimaru decided to summon Three Hokages to make sure he can beat Old Hiruzen & said that if he was only 10 years Younger, they would have lost for sure.

Do you think Orochimaru needs to summon Three Hokages to ensure he can beat Kisame? This is crazy, either you believe Orochimaru is Trash Level or you think Kisame is Madara, it's one of the two

 

[Bob74h]

But I think he is a great character, a guy who looked for immortality because he was traumatize by his parents death.

I dont think thats ever stated or inferred by sasori infact the contracy is stated, It's shown that the death of his parents didt traumatize him rather it made him become emotionless.

In the end he was not satisfied and did not want to kill his grandma so he let her kills him and helps Sakura.

Thats not what was said and b that scene was a extension of sasori's inability to wait, He was going to die at that point so he let himself get killed.

http://imgur.com/S0oqyQn

I like Deepa design. But Deepa is an Anime only character. Check your information.

He's still apart of boruto which people like so it's irrelevant really
I never claimed deepa was a manga character so dont put words in my mouth

Hidan is basic crazy guy, yes. Like The Espada Hollow Scientist in Bleach, or any Anime characters laughing like crazy. Like Light Yagami or Dofflamingo or Team Rocket.

Hidan is religious extremist how does that even relate to a comedic villain like team rocket or a morally grey character like light yagami who kills ''bad guys'' so that the good people live more safer lives

 

[Gargo]

That's because you think A beats B & B beats C then A beats C
Naruto isn't like that, for example Databooks also said that Jiraya can beat Tsunade & Tsunade can beat Orochimaru & Orochimaru can beat Jiraya, it depends on Match-Up

Itachi can beat Orochimaru but he isn't Superior than him in Level & Jiraya isn't Superior than Itachi, it's just that Itachi deemed it's not wise to fight Jiraya at the time. Orochimaru is simply bad against those with Ocular Jutsu such as Itachi & Pain but Jiraya was better at handling them, Jiraya & Oro are still Same Level & Rivals according to Manga & Databooks

For example, Itachi didn't want to fight Guy too but didn't mind fighting Kakashi, even though we know that aside from 8th Gate, Guy & Kakashi are Rivals, it's because Guy was more troublesome to fight & knows how to handle the Sharingan

And this comparison is irrelevant, doesn't matter who is stronger than who & how strong is someone
These are Elite Ninja, they are worthy of becoming Kages & leading Villages & hunting Jinchurikis & other Kages too
For the final time, please understand how crazy it is that Orochimaru decided to summon Three Hokages to make sure he can beat Old Hiruzen & said that if he was only 10 years Younger, they would have lost for sure.

Do you think Orochimaru needs to summon Three Hokages to ensure he can beat Kisame? This is crazy, either you believe Orochimaru is Trash Level or you think Kisame is Madara, it's one of the two

The thing is.

Hiruzen was really underwhelming.
He was being restraint by the 4 of the sound in a barrier,
He used a Doron Barrier,
He used Enma ( Enma was impressive )
He used paper bomb trick
We got a few panels of him fighting Orochimaru Kusanagi with Enma
We got the Soul Reaper and that's it.

Orochimaru was far more impressive without arms against 4 tails Naruto.

Kisame was very very impressive when 30% Kisame was sufficient to fight Gai, Neji, Lee and Tenten.
Kisame was very impressive when he defeated ( and intentionally let himself caught ) by Killer Bee.
Killer Bee, the one who is comparable in Strength to See and single-handely defeated Sasuke and his Taka team.

What Hiruzen has done which is as impressive as the Shark Bombs of Kisame against Gaï or the gigantic water done against Bee and Hachibi ?

Okay. It's true that Orochimaru did prepare Kages, ( Kimimaro ) and stuff against Hiruzen. But that was with Hiruzen Pre-Time Skip hype, Post-Time Skip, even Kakuzu is more impressive.

Post automatically merged: Feb 13, 2021

I dont think thats ever stated or inferred by sasori infact the contracy is stated, It's shown that the death of his parents didt traumatize him rather it made him become emotionless.

He became emotionless because of the traumatic shock. He had a friend and then he don't like his friend or anybody anymore.
He has been so traumatize and unable to cope with the death of his parents that he seeks immortality, like his puppets who never dies.

Thats not what was said and b that scene was a extension of sasori's inability to wait, He was going to die at that point so he let himself get killed.

Nope.

Hidan is religious extremist how does that even relate to a comedic villain like team rocket or a morally grey character like light yagami who kills ''bad guys'' so that the good people live more safer lives

I'm talking about "evil guy laugh like a maniac" we see everywhere.

 

[Salah WG]

The thing is.

Hiruzen was really underwhelming.
He was being restraint by the 4 of the sound in a barrier,
He used a Doron Barrier,
He used Enma ( Enma was impressive )
He used paper bomb trick
We got a few panels of him fighting Orochimaru Kusanagi with Enma
We got the Soul Reaper and that's it.

Orochimaru was far more impressive without arms against 4 tails Naruto.

Kisame was very very impressive when 30% Kisame was sufficient to fight Gai, Neji, Lee and Tenten.
Kisame was very impressive when he defeated ( and intentionally let himself caught ) by Killer Bee.
Killer Bee, the one who is comparable in Strength to See and single-handely defeated Sasuke and his Taka team.

What Hiruzen has done which is as impressive as the Shark Bombs of Kisame against Gaï or the gigantic water done against Bee and Hachibi ?

Okay. It's true that Orochimaru did prepare Kages, ( Kimimaro ) and stuff against Hiruzen. But that was with Hiruzen Pre-Time Skip hype, Post-Time Skip, even Kakuzu is more impressive.

You're using Fighting Scenarios rather than Official Claims & Portrayal
A Mangaka doesn't only make a Story, he also Draws

Masashi's Mind at the time was limited to that Fighting Scenario, over time, he improved his Battles
I also find that Fight short & underwhelming, but the Manga Statements & Databooks reveal to us what the Author decided in his Story, if he fails to showcase that in Panels, that's his problem, which is a Drawing & Scenario problem but it doesn't change Canon Facts & Power Levels

Hiruzen was called God of Shinobi which is Greatest Title in Ninja World, only given to him & Hashirama
He was called The Professor for Mastering every single Technique in Konoha (Even Hidden ones)
He is Mentor of Three Legendary Sannin & Student of both First & Second Hokage
He became Hokage at a very young Age & was considered Strongest Kage ever which is mentioned in both Manga & All Databooks
He Mastered 5 Elements & can counter any Technique
Even though many Characters had Rivals who Equal them, Hiruzen had Hanzo who admitted that he was nowhere near Hiruzen Level indicating that he was too strong that he didn't have a Rival.
Databooks also mentioned that the only Ninja that Naruto wished to fight & surpass was Hiruzen himself

Only Ninja who can fight a Character with such Portrayal are the other God of Shinobi Hashirama, his Rival Madara, his Successor Obito & the Main Duo Naruto & Sasuke (+ ofc 8th Gate Guy & 2 Sharingan Kakashi).
Only these Ninja can Match or Defeat God of Shinobi Hiruzen

Old Hiruzen was much Weaker than his Former Self & yet:

Databooks still gave him 5/5 in Ninjutsu, Taijutsu & Genjutsu showing that even though he is far from his Prime, he still the Perfect Ninja. And Orochimaru deemed it necessary to summon Three Hokages to ensure Victory over Old Hiruzen & even though the latter stopped revival of Minato & only fought Two Hokages, Orochimaru still barely won & said he would have lost if Hiruzen was 10 years younger

I mean just Orochimaru vs Kisame would be a good fight to discuss & debate on
You're here comparing an Akatsuki Member with the Guy who fought another Akatsuki Member of same level + 2 revived hokages

I think i said everything i could say about this fight, if you still believe Kisame wins then it's okay, let's just agree to disagree
But ask yourself, can Kisame beat Orochimaru + Edo Tensei Hashirama & Tobirama?
Tobirama is literally Master Water User just like Kisame, adding Hashirama even if nerfed & Orochimaru who is as dangerous as Kisame alone, it's an overkill man, just think about it