Current Events Oda Degrades And Humiliates Admiral Haters Repeatedly (Week Of October 31, 2024)

[Kurozumi Wiwi]

And Kizaru took an attack that is many leagues above that.

ACoC isn't be-all and end-all. It is very useful power-up, but against Kizaru, Luffy is severely lacking in speed. Even Snakeman was getting completely outmatched by Kizaru in that department, base/Gear2&3 Luffy with ACoC would be getting blitzed and unable to do any damage to Kizaru.

What's ironic is that we actually got Base Luffy ACOC (stronger than crude version that was boxing Kaido) kick getting blocked clean by Kizaru forearm right at the beginning of the fight.
I know a number of people deny it because it destroys their fantasies even further, but it feels kind of hypocritical to me. If one is going to argue Luffy wasn't using ACOC in snakeman because the lack of black lightning, at least be consistent and admit Luffy is using it when there's black lightning. aCOC is now an etablished power-up that we know for a fact that Luffy have, he isn't a character with ambiguou power set. Oda isn't going to dedicate panels of fodders collapsing or him charging the attack everytime he's using it to satisfy powerscalers that need everything spelled out literally, this is not pratical.


....

Concerning how much Luffy was trying, I think he was serious but he didn't get the luxury to go all out like most characters in Egghead. Now that the arc is over it's clear it was always written in the mind of it being an escape arc, which is why even it doesn't really have any drawn-out, extended fights. Oda is the type of writer to only have characters use everything they have in proper battle arcs

The thing is that Luffy being nerfed relies on a meta analysis (in story he had every reason to try his hardest), while Kizaru being nerfed and a mental mess that never truly wanted to accomplish his job (he went as far as feeding Luffy, i don't think people completely realize the implications of this action yet) is a literal thing in story confirmed by everything.
So when someone acts like Luffy was super nerfed while ignoring Kizaru's situation it feels like they're grasping at straws to not let go of their headcanon tier list.

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

I don’t think he is 90% of his prime

at MF maybe and that’s a maybe, it can be less : still active duty but getting old.

now that he officially retired, Ace was killed in front of him, and he is 2 years older

I don’t think he is more than 80%/70% of his prime self today

He is still constantly training though. This was told to us by Brannew that he still trains every day. The Vivre Card reinforced that as well. At this point it’s being thrown in our face that current Garp is just a slightly nerfed prime Garp with stamina issues.

It’s just like Gyou’Un in Kingdom. Gyou’Un stated his strength had declined by 50%, but we all know Gyou’Un was just exaggerating as he was disappointed that he had grown weaker. Shukai Gyou’Un was probably like 80-85% of prime Gyou’Un. The same goes for Garp. He declined, but he continued training and now the Vivre Card reinforces that he maintained most of his strength.

 

[Daves John]

What's ironic is that we actually got Base Luffy ACOC (stronger than crude version that was boxing Kaido) kick getting blocked clean by Kizaru forearm right at the beginning of the fight.
I know a number of people deny it because it destroys their fantasies even further, but it feels kind of hypocritical to me. If one is going to argue Luffy wasn't using ACOC in snakeman because the lack of black lightning, at least be consistent and admit Luffy is using it when there's black lightning. aCOC is now an etablished power-up that we know for a fact that Luffy have, he isn't a character with ambiguou power set. Oda isn't going to dedicate panels of fodders collapsing or him charging the attack everytime he's using it to satisfy powerscalers that need everything spelled out literally, this is not pratical.

Black lightning around Luffy's leg way smaller than ACoC is usually shown, I myself am skeptical is it ACoC or just regular CoA.

What makes me think it is more likely to be ACoC is your post on how post WCI, black lightning was never used when Luffy hits someone without CoC.

Concerning how much Luffy was trying, I think he was serious but he didn't get the luxury to go all out like most characters in Egghead. Now that the arc is over it's clear it was always written in the mind of it being an escape arc, which is why even it doesn't really have any drawn-out, extended fights. Oda is the type of writer to only have characters use everything they have in proper battle arcs

The thing is that Luffy being nerfed relies on a meta analysis (in story he had every reason to try his hardest), while Kizaru being nerfed and a mental mess that never truly wanted to accomplish his job (he went as far as feeding Luffy, i don't think people completely realize the implications of this action yet) is a literal thing in story confirmed by everything.
So when someone acts like Luffy was super nerfed while ignoring Kizaru's situation it feels like they're grasping at straws to not let go of their headcanon tier list.

I agree, Kizaru objectively was nerfed more than Luffy, but Luffy didn't get to show his best.

I think it will be interesting when they get to show their best in the future

 

[OPKnK]

I don’t think he is 90% of his prime

at MF maybe and that’s a maybe, it can be less : still active duty but getting old.

now that he officially retired, Ace was killed in front of him, and he is 2 years older

I don’t think he is more than 80%/70% of his prime self today

We had a manga panel with him saying he can only throw canon balls half as fast as before in chapter 438 and that was before marineford .
I don't think he as high as even 80%\70%.

The thing is that Luffy being nerfed relies on a meta analysis (in story he had every reason to try his hardest), while Kizaru being nerfed and a mental mess that never truly wanted to accomplish his job (he went as far as feeding Luffy, i don't think people completely realize the implications of this action yet) is a literal thing in story confirmed by everything.
So when someone acts like Luffy was super nerfed while ignoring Kizaru's situation it feels like they're grasping at straws to not let go of their headcanon tier list.

Kizaru was nerf but the whole thing about that fight was they were even trying to beat each other .
Luffy full out say he was trying to stall him while Kizaru was trying kill VP when he did not want to .
If this was Kaido or don or Croc luffy would be saying he going to kick there ass .
Truth is luffy fight vs marines is always just seem less serious than his pirates fights and i wonder if that will ever change.
About luffy being nerf is i don't even put that vs Kizaru alone cause like i said you can't make a island size barrier fist and then next arc can't even do vs topman.

 

[LolonoisZolo]

Hmmm the point about ''old characters still being in their prime'' completely contradicts numerous manga panels... Rayleigh stated he was too old and out of prime, Garp said it as well, WB said it and others said it about him too, Chinjao said it, Hyogoro said it and maybe more...

 

[Daves John]

Hmmm the point about ''old characters still being in their prime'' completely contradicts numerous manga panels... Rayleigh stated he was too old and out of prime, Garp said it as well, WB said it and others said it about him too, Chinjao said it, Hyogoro said it and maybe more...

Pretty sure it's mistranslation and it's supposed to be just that he is very strong