Character Discussion Rank Kaido in terms of Written quality

Rank

  • 0

    Votes: 8 8.7%
  • 1

    Votes: 9 9.8%
  • 2

    Votes: 7 7.6%
  • 3

    Votes: 13 14.1%
  • 4

    Votes: 10 10.9%
  • 5

    Votes: 8 8.7%
  • 6

    Votes: 10 10.9%
  • 7

    Votes: 16 17.4%
  • 8

    Votes: 5 5.4%
  • 9

    Votes: 2 2.2%
  • 10

    Votes: 4 4.3%

  • Total voters
    92
#21
Base Design is a 10. Dragon design and Hybrid Design were both lacking imo
Df is awesome guys basically the Avatar in Dragon form.
I do quite like his fighting style as it truly varies depending on which form he's in. Good to see DF playing a major role in battles in OP again ya know? CoC leaking attacks great, Lifting Onigashima was great. He's been good for great visual moments in throughout the arc

He is menacing, still remember him one shotting Luffy that was pretty epic and those stills with him and Big Mom on the roof were great
The drunkedness made him goofier then I'd like

He needs a backstory because right now he's a contradiction. He's a tyrannical pirate captain who runs a meritocracy on his crew and refers to his top Brass as calamities... but he's got a secretary lol
He seemingly wants to die this Grand Epic death and become a legend but nearly every step he takes goes against having that sort of Legendary tale. Allying himself with Orochi, plotting to take out Oden, the weapons deal with Doffy, backstabbing Orochi, Allaince with BM etc he just constantly not doing epic shit. Like he doesn't truly understand why Roger and WB and Oden are considered the greats that they are. Right now he's shallow villain that hints at deeper undertones with his words.

I did love the moment of him taking out Orochi tho because I sure as hell wasn't expecting that, it also took place essentially the minute he realized Kanjuro didnt have any of Odens secrets, probably more of a coincidental timing thing but it still tracks with him being more then a dumb brute that some readers thinks he is. 25+ Years of Partnership snuffed out with one swing no hesitation. Good stuff

He has had some great lines so far so I wont complain about his dialogue. "What sort of King did you say you'd become? Boy?" "Little Pirate Games" "Death is what completes a man" etc But I do hate everytime him and Yamato speak to each other lol

His crew had amazing designs and dynamic BUT they haven't stuck the landing as myself and other seem to think they went down too easily. If they get up we can see more and may be satisfied.

All in all if I had to vote I'd give him a 7 rn with a chance to go up or down. Compelling enough backstory and great finally with Luffy and he might even scratch a 9. (I reserve 10s for Crocodile in Alabasta and Akainu in MarineFord, cant see him getting there) Could even drop to 5 if the backstory is lacking or he doesn't show me more.

I do think he gets unfairly judge by the community, his Arc isnt even done yet lol Let the man work ya'll!
 
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Finalbeta

Science Nerd 🌌 🌍 🧬 ⚛️
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#22
A good 6. Or 7.

Not very profound although featuring some nice teams such as perfection and peculiar crazy quirks such as his will to test his own strenght and his particular rudeness. His design also looked pretty well conceived.
 

Fleet Admiral Lee Hung

Unto Greater Heights
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#30
A 0/10. I already explained my stance on Kaido in more detail in the below post, and the only thing I would throw in:

I often see people saying “wait for Kaido’s backstory to decide if he is garbage or not.” To those people I say:

Doflamingo was a phenomenal villain before Oda gave him a backstory. So was Katakuri. Oda never even gave Crocodile a backstory and he is still regarded as one of the best antagonists in One Piece by fans. This idea that Kaido will somehow be saved by a backstory is nonsense. Kaido is shit now and will forever be remembered as one of the shittiest antagonists in One Piece. I cant wait until Oda has flushed this waste of time down the toilet.

Sorry if I tagged you and you don't give AF! Lol

Well, let's get one thing out of the way first: Big Mom is a masterfully well-written character in comparison to the mess that is Kaido. I plan on doing larger posts on this in the future, but I'll give some thoughts on Kaido for now.

For Kaido, I would almost scrap everything about him. Literally.

Personality: Kaido is an inconsistent mess who's only consistency is how inconsistent he is. On the one hand, he is screaming at his men to stop Big Mom from entering Wano at all costs, and the next he is demanding they remove her seastone cuffs so that he can kill her in a fair 1v1 fight himself (like wut?). 795 Kaido was eager for death and actively sought ways to kill himself for fun, but Wano Kaido shits himself at the very idea of experiencing pain in any form and very much does not seem like he wants to die at all. Kaido claims that he wants to go to war with the entire World Government and Wano, but visibly shits himself at the very idea of Oden's scabbards picking a fight with him. Kaido spends 50% of his panel time being drunk, which gives him an even more inconsistent personality on top of how messily inconsistent his character is already. He is someone who is both terrified of a good fight, while also spending his life seeking out the largest scale war imaginable.

This character is one of the shittiest I've ever seen in terms of his personality, and there is nothing to like about him whatsoever because his personality changes into its polar opposite form every other panel.

How would I change this? Consistency is a start. Either Kaido needs to be a fearless Warmonger who eagerly fights Big Mom as soon as she enters Wano instead of begging his subordinates to protect him, or he needs to be a consistent coward who doesn't take Big Mom's handcuffs off because he's terrified at the idea of fighting her. Kaido should not fear pain, he should actively seek out opportunities to die as he was introduced. His first action when he saw Big Mom, should've been to present his neck to her in hopes that she could actually behead him and end his boring existence. Once she fails, then that should be when Kaido fights her himself because that would fit his adrenaline-seeking nature that exists half of the time.

Drunkenness is not an excuse for shit-tier consistency. Drunkenness should amplify Kaido's most extreme traits, not remove them entirely for the sake of gags. Drunken Kaido should be even more eager for a fight. He should be even more violent and impulsive. He shouldn't be shitting his pants at the idea of fighting the scabbards if his actual goal is to start a war on the largest possible scale. Being drunk is when people reveal who they truly are, and by drawing Kaido as a coward when he's drunk, the message Oda is sending is that Kaido is actually a coward deep down, and him starting a war with the entire World is just a sober facade. Which, of course, makes absolutely no sense unless of course Oda truly does want us to see Kaido as a coward instead of the adrenaline-junky-war-monger that Kaido was introduced as.

There are many more changes I would make but these are just some examples.

Motivations: Kaido's motivations are literally as generic as they get, on the rare occasion that he actually decides to show a consistent motivation and character. Kaido's motivation, is that he wants to destroy the world. I wish I was making that up because it's a simplistic motivation even for children's stories and far too simple for a story as nuanced as One Piece, but Oda really thought that the Arc he's been hyping for 8 years needed a villain with literally the most generic and forgettable possible motivation.

How would I change this: If you're going to give Kaido the most generic and un-nuanced motivation possible, there at least needs to be an understandable, rational backstory that justifies this. How about making Kaido the opposite to Oden? Oden travels the world and sees it's beauty and thus wants to open the borders to Wano to let the "beauty" in, but Kaido travels the world and sees how terrible it is (getting captured, death sentences, etc) and so he resolves to destroy the world and keep the borders to Wano shut so all of the "evil" can't get in. This may be what Oda is going for but we haven't gotten to Kaido's backstory yet because Oda is interested in far more...."important" plotlines like how Kinemon found the baby pig, Oden dancing throughout the streets of Wano for no reason whatsoever, Big Mom's makeup getting ruined via a face-fucking by a motorcycle, etc.

Design: Kaido's design is lazy, uninspired, and has nothing to do with his character (it's hard to make a design that contributes to your character when you have no character whatsoever so I get it). Let's use Doflamingo for example:
Doflamingo's design is meant to exemplify his flamboyant personality, which is a result of his World Noble upbringing which leads him to believe that he is superior to everyone else. He wears an extravagant feather coat which simultaneously shows his self-assurance and charisma while also emphasizing the riches he has earned from his underworld business. His manipulative personality is also complemented by his manipulative Devil Fruit which literally lets him turn people into his puppets, and his Devil Fruit also contributes to his secondary "spider" theme, as Oda gives Doflamingo both primary and secondary animal themes which emphasizes his "hidden" nature to the rest of the world. Doflamingo's primary animal theme being the Flamingo (emphasizing his extravagance and flamboyance) and his perception to the people of Dressrosa was that of a loving king, but his secondary and more hidden theme is the Spider (which emphasizes his manipulative, blood-sucking character) with his true nature being that of a psychotic manipulator.

Doflamingo's design contributes to his character in every way, and his Devil Fruit, Personality, and Design have been made in conjunction with one another to illustrate who Doflamingo is on several metaphorical levels. Doflamingo is not the only character Oda does this with, but he is a nice quick example.

Now let's look at Kaido's design.

Okay so...I'm not even sure what Kaido's design even is first of all. Doflamingo is meant to look like an extremely successful drug-dealer, which is basically what he is in One Piece lol. Kaido is meant to look like...a big muscular man? I mean seriously, wtf even is he? And how does his design contribute to his character?

The rope Kaido is wearing around his waste is called a "Makuuchi" which is apparently a belt worn in Sumo Culture, which has nothing to do with Kaido or his established character so far. A Makuuchi can also be used to symbolize a "sacred" object, but again this has had no relevance to Kaido so far. Kaido is also wearing a shide which is used in Shinto rituals which...I won't go into here, but based on my research, again this has nothing whatsoever to do with Kaido, other than the fact that Kaido has an attack named "Divine Thunder" for what thus far appears to be no reason whatsoever. Again, compare this to Doflamingo who is wearing a stylish button-up shirt meant to emphasize his stylish personality, unbuttoned to show his charisma. See how Doffy's design contributes to his character and Kaido's doesn't?

Kaido's Dragon Devil Fruit (presumably) serves the purpose of emphasizing...what aspects of Kaido's personality exactly? Dragons in mythology are meant to be wise, immortal beings. Kaido might be immortal, but he is far from wise, being consistently out-smarted and having spent his entire life pretty much failing at every serious goal he's ever attempted. He's got a skull tattoo which emphasizes that he wants to die but...again like I mentioned above, he only wanted to die in Chapter 795 and we've never seen this aspect of his personality on display ever again. A Immortal Dragon who wants to die would actually be an interesting concept, which makes Kaido even shittier since this aspect of his personality seems to have been retconned into non-existence.

I'm so at a loss for words to explain what Kaido is even supposed to be, what aspects of his personality and character his design is meant to emphasize, and how his Devil Fruit is supposed to tie into all that that I really don't even know what to say. His design, is truly awful. And I mean that genuinely. Oda should be ashamed of himself on this one. Sure we don't know Kaido's exact backstory yet, but literally every minor detail we learned about Doflamingo, and it became clearer and clearer why Oda designed him the way he did and what the aspects of his design are supposed to represent. With Kaido, Wano is like 100 chapters now and we still have no idea who or what he is or how his design contributes to that.

How would I change this: Well, Kaido's design needs to better emphasize his personality and overall character, so his these things needs to be fixed before his design can. His Devil Fruit also needs to factor more into his personality more, and there are several ways to do this.

I love the idea in my head of Kaido being a Chopper-esque character, in that he's literally a Dragon who ate the Human Human Fruit (Mythical Model: Oni) which would both explain Kaido's immortality as well as explain why he's referenced as a creature and not as a human. I don't want to delve too deep into how I would fix this without fully knowing what Oda intends for Kaido and his backstory, I don't want to "fix" something that might not even be broken at all, but it's hard for me to imagine Oda salvaging this shitshow.

Some quick fixes: Get rid of the Makuuchi, or make sumo more relevant to Kaido's character right from the start. Make it more obvious why Kaido is supposed to be considered "sacred" (does Wano culture consider Dragon's sacred? Is Kaido the last Dragon which makes the people of Wano worship him? Religion has literally had nothing to do with Kaido and his character 100 chapters into Wano). Incorporate real aspects of Shinto-ism into Kaido's personality and actions, thus justifying the Shide that he is wearing.

Overall Kaido is shit-tier in every possible way, and I'm at a complete loss as to how Oda got him so wrong when I know Oda knows how to write a much better character than this. Just my humble opinion ofc lol.

Tagging some people that might be interested, and again I apologize if you don't care:

 
#32
1/10.
Post automatically merged:

He likes the poverty, occupied a country just to make it poor, dude has no tastes at all. :suresure:Meh character with low iq, instead of evolving his new occupied country, he downgrades it to the lowest level:suresure:
This is a good point. If you’re going to occupy a nation by force, at least make it a better place for the people you’re occupying.
 
#34
gonna give him a 2 ...

moral argument = very weak
complex personality = very weak
personal relations = weak
emotional attachment = weak
unpredictability = weak
create strong emotions = weak
long term effect on plot = mid tier
long terms effect on MCs = weak
interesting nature = weak to meh
symbolism = meh to good
and ...

there is not much going on tbh
the world poll says it all
he is not loved for a reason. if he wasn't WSC nobody would give a single fuck
 
#38
We need his backstory to get a better sense of his character and to put everything into perspective. Hindsight will play a big deal in how his overall character arc turns out. I'll reserve judgement until then.
 
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