I am. Which is why I keep saying get back to the thread points. Not off-topic stuff.
Eight Gates that left him helpless in a fight after and hurt his bad more than his foes. Sanji still takes him overall with or without gates.
That has zero catchup by Kishimoto to catch on how much he improve. Again bad writing mess him up to know how far he goes. We speculating this point, not much Canon.
Eight Gates that left him helpless in a fight after and hurt his bad more than his foes. Sanji still takes him overall with or without gates.
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That has zero catchup by Kishimoto to catch on how much he improve. Again bad writing mess him up to know how far he goes. We speculating this point, not much Canon.
Do you have a good example?
Because i didn´t see him tanking this:
or this:
http://i.imgur.com/CdwT0os.jpg
His movement alone when he activate the gates, affected the whole area:
http://i.imgur.com/aScg9l6.jpg
His punches against Gaara create shockwaves
+ http://i.imgur.com/x1bxC9Q.jpg + http://i.imgur.com/TFoBtO4.jpg
You also see a lot of speedfeats in this fight. Neither the shinobi nor Gaara his Sand could follow Lee his speed.
Most of them can´t even see Lee
Here is a good respect thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/3b4m8c/respect_rock_lee_naruto/
If we going with PTS Lee vs PTS Sanji, i didn´t see Sanji neither in Terms of speed, nor in terms of power on the level with Lee. He get´s some good feats later against the CP9, and in the Thriller Bark, but i didn´t see him here as the winner.
Even Lee without his Gates could be a problem for Sanji, since Lee is still too fast. Fast enough to blitz Gaara even with his automatically sand defense.
But ok, if we going with current Sanji, then i think he wins against Lee.
And that, even Sasuke has trouble to follow Haku in his ice mirror jutsu before. Lee is far faster then Haku in his Ice Mirror Jutsu. FTE is no big deal for Naruto characters, it is a 0815 speed, thanks to abilities like the Shunshin no Jutsu. That´s why im saying before that Naruto characters have on average a better speed then OP characters (Of course, there are exceptions)
The current Sanji, yes.
Because i didn´t see him tanking this:
or this:
http://i.imgur.com/CdwT0os.jpg
His movement alone when he activate the gates, affected the whole area:
http://i.imgur.com/aScg9l6.jpg
His punches against Gaara create shockwaves
+ http://i.imgur.com/x1bxC9Q.jpg + http://i.imgur.com/TFoBtO4.jpg
You also see a lot of speedfeats in this fight. Neither the shinobi nor Gaara his Sand could follow Lee his speed.
Most of them can´t even see Lee
Here is a good respect thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/3b4m8c/respect_rock_lee_naruto/
If we going with PTS Lee vs PTS Sanji, i didn´t see Sanji neither in Terms of speed, nor in terms of power on the level with Lee. He get´s some good feats later against the CP9, and in the Thriller Bark, but i didn´t see him here as the winner.
Even Lee without his Gates could be a problem for Sanji, since Lee is still too fast. Fast enough to blitz Gaara even with his automatically sand defense.
But ok, if we going with current Sanji, then i think he wins against Lee.
And that, even Sasuke has trouble to follow Haku in his ice mirror jutsu before. Lee is far faster then Haku in his Ice Mirror Jutsu. FTE is no big deal for Naruto characters, it is a 0815 speed, thanks to abilities like the Shunshin no Jutsu. That´s why im saying before that Naruto characters have on average a better speed then OP characters (Of course, there are exceptions)
The current Sanji, yes.
One Piece characters are naturally more physical and take more abuse in strength. You shouldn't compare as same lvl of physical attributes it's very different. Sanji shows that in his fights with Kuroubi, Bon Clay, Enel, Jabra, Kuma, etc.. He got great tanking so even if Lee went Gates, it's no match for his physical attributes at all. Plus speed and power always been praised factor by Oda with his character even in pre-timeskip. Don't see much what Lee on both versions.
Again with Kishimoto shotty on side characters, it's hard to see how far they go and we are speculating than Canon. Ask this, do you think pre-timeskip Lee got huge power that is compare or more than Enel's Lighting or Kuma's Ursa Shock. Don't see that possible from what we swen that compare to that even with Eight Gates.
I can't envision Lee taking DJ to the body and just get back up as he isn't physical attributes like OP character who take natural abuse. Naruto characters are bit more human when taking hits abd can hurt their body more than OP character overall.
Just saying comparing both and I am huge Lee fan, but I aware what Kishimoto dine to his character sadly, so can't give him full go knowing he hasn't a proper fight to state how much he change since then.
Again with Kishimoto shotty on side characters, it's hard to see how far they go and we are speculating than Canon. Ask this, do you think pre-timeskip Lee got huge power that is compare or more than Enel's Lighting or Kuma's Ursa Shock. Don't see that possible from what we swen that compare to that even with Eight Gates.
I can't envision Lee taking DJ to the body and just get back up as he isn't physical attributes like OP character who take natural abuse. Naruto characters are bit more human when taking hits abd can hurt their body more than OP character overall.
Just saying comparing both and I am huge Lee fan, but I aware what Kishimoto dine to his character sadly, so can't give him full go knowing he hasn't a proper fight to state how much he change since then.
Correct, that is what i am saying before, but i also said there are exceptions. There are more physical stronger characters in One Piece then in Naruto, and still they have hand full of shinobis, who have equal or better physical stats then many of the One Piece characters. By speed, we have more faster Naruto characters, then One Piece characters. But even here One Piece has a hand full of characters who can keep up, or ar faster then most of the Naruto characters. Kizaru for example, where no one in Naruto is Lightspeed (There is only one attack, who is accepted as LS) Both verses have different powerlevels.
Also don´t see how Kuroubi, Bon Clay, or Jabra wouldn´t beat by Lee. Enel of course can´t be beaten, Kuma also is to strong. We could make a gauntlet for Lee, who runs Sanji his enemies. I think Lee has far less problems then Sanji to beat them.
By that logic a terminally ill Itachi was hit by Lightning and still survive this. To Kuma his Ursus shock. Do you think Bon Clay or Jabra his attacks are stronger then Kuma his Ursus Shock? No one in One Piece in PTS has shown that power in Kicks or punches like Lee in PTS. It affected the whole are in the fight with Gaara. There are also similar powers like the attack between Crocodile and Doflamingo on the Marineford. Don´t see PTS Sanji could block that. Lee already has fight in PTS against someone who has bones which are harder then steel. Zoro for example in PTS only fight someone who is "iron" level. They get their best feats after the 2 years, when they destroyed a pacifista. Sanji on the other hand damaged his own leg, when he try to kick Kuma. I didn´t think PTS Lee would hurt Kuma as well, but he doesn´t have any pain trough the kicks against him, which means he has a better physical condition then Sanji at this time.
That´s right, but you can´t put automatically every One Piece character on the same level. The same goes with the Naruto characters. Everyone has a limit and Sanji isn´t more durably then other One Piece characters. I would agree that naruto characters are bit more "human", but that doesen´t change the fact, that Lee has showing more power in his abilities. Of course we could say those are two different verses, but going by feats Lee has shown that his attacks have a lot more power then Sanji before timeskip.
That is right, we only knew his most potential before the timeskip and that´s why i am saying that Lee couldn´t beat Sanji after his time skip. I never said Lee could keep up with this version of Sanji.
Also don´t see how Kuroubi, Bon Clay, or Jabra wouldn´t beat by Lee. Enel of course can´t be beaten, Kuma also is to strong. We could make a gauntlet for Lee, who runs Sanji his enemies. I think Lee has far less problems then Sanji to beat them.
By that logic a terminally ill Itachi was hit by Lightning and still survive this. To Kuma his Ursus shock. Do you think Bon Clay or Jabra his attacks are stronger then Kuma his Ursus Shock? No one in One Piece in PTS has shown that power in Kicks or punches like Lee in PTS. It affected the whole are in the fight with Gaara. There are also similar powers like the attack between Crocodile and Doflamingo on the Marineford. Don´t see PTS Sanji could block that. Lee already has fight in PTS against someone who has bones which are harder then steel. Zoro for example in PTS only fight someone who is "iron" level. They get their best feats after the 2 years, when they destroyed a pacifista. Sanji on the other hand damaged his own leg, when he try to kick Kuma. I didn´t think PTS Lee would hurt Kuma as well, but he doesn´t have any pain trough the kicks against him, which means he has a better physical condition then Sanji at this time.
That´s right, but you can´t put automatically every One Piece character on the same level. The same goes with the Naruto characters. Everyone has a limit and Sanji isn´t more durably then other One Piece characters. I would agree that naruto characters are bit more "human", but that doesen´t change the fact, that Lee has showing more power in his abilities. Of course we could say those are two different verses, but going by feats Lee has shown that his attacks have a lot more power then Sanji before timeskip.
That is right, we only knew his most potential before the timeskip and that´s why i am saying that Lee couldn´t beat Sanji after his time skip. I never said Lee could keep up with this version of Sanji.
This is a mismatch.
More or less EOS Rock Lee is comparable to Might Guy who is capable of keeping up with Madara (for a period of time) ... that alone puts Rock Lee in his own tier.
Sanji becomes a rag doll in front of EOS Rock Lee.
Once One Piece ends we can have a better comparison right now Rock Lee K.O's Sanji while drunk.
More or less EOS Rock Lee is comparable to Might Guy who is capable of keeping up with Madara (for a period of time) ... that alone puts Rock Lee in his own tier.
Sanji becomes a rag doll in front of EOS Rock Lee.
Once One Piece ends we can have a better comparison right now Rock Lee K.O's Sanji while drunk.