Questions & Mysteries The diabolical truth about Kuma that Oda is hiding from you!!!

Etzel Andergast

Etzel Andergast

‎
#1
#1
Click bait title

I have 3 important questions about Kuma and an theory trying to answer some of them:

1) Why Kuma knew that Dragon has a son, but Ivankov didn't? The three are close friends according to Sabo and the three founded RA. But why only Kuma knew it?

2) Why Kuma protected Sunny? Would not make any sense Dragon order him to do it. Dragon doesnt want interfere in Luffy journey. I dont think that Dragon even knew about Kuma situation in that moment. But the interesting about this question is because that was Kuma last wish.

3) Why Kuma send Luffy to Amazon Lily? He sent every strawhat to place that are related to them. But Luffy and Amazon Lilly doesnt have nothing in common.
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Let's begin with the third question. There is no apparent reason for Kuma send Luffy to Amazon Lily. But I think that there is one reason: the former empress of amazon lily. She was the empress between Hancock and Shakky. According to Gloriosa she died from "love sickness". But she fell in love for who? The answer is Dragon. That is a old Luffy's mom theory (the best one by far). So thats the connection between Luffy and Amazon Lily (you can argue that the women from Amazon Lily can't give birth to boys, but I think this an old lie from the women island).

But how Kuma know about Luffy's mom? If this theory is right then Luffy's mom and Hancock have parallels. Apart the parallel of both having fallen in love to a member of Monkey D. family, both were celestial dragon's slave. In some moment Luffy's mom met Kuma when both were slaves (Kuma was a child at that time, so I guess Luffy's mom was also a child) and both become close friends.
So the reason Kuma knew that Dragon has a son, is because he is also a friend of Luffy's mom.

Like I said before, Dragon didnt order Kuma to protect Luffy in Sabaody or protect sunny for 2 years. Dragon would not waste for 2 years one of his best commanders to protect a ship. But protect Sunny was Kuma last wish. It's still not clear why he did that, but I guess the reason he did that is cause he somehow conclude that Luffy is Nika or something like that.

*Kuma and Luffy's mom were enslaved in God Valley not Mary Geoise. God Valley was a place tenryuubito used to frequent, Sengoku himself says that the Rocks took slaves and tenryuubitos hostage in God Valley.

This sounds like a fanfic or not?



@Rambles @AverageNamiEnjoyer @Paperchampion23 @Sir Yasheen @Devilbat @Useless_Kidd @CoC: Color of Clowns @Warchief Sanji D Goat @Mr. Reloaded
 
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Paperchampion23

Paperchampion23

‎
#3
#3
Etzel Andergast said:
Click bait title

I have 3 important questions about Kuma and an theory trying to answer some of them:

1) Why Kuma knew that Dragon has a son, but Ivankov didn't? The three are close friends according to Sabo and the three founded RA. But why only Kuma knew it?

2) Why Kuma protected Sunny? Would not make any sense Dragon order him to do it. Dragon doesnt want interfere in Luffy journey. I dont think that Dragon even knew about Kuma situation in that moment. But the interesting about this question is because that was Kuma last wish.

3) Why Kuma send Luffy to Amazon Lily? He sent every strawhat to place that are related to them. But Luffy and Amazon Lilly doesnt have nothing in common.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Let's begin with the third question. There is no apparent reason for Kuma send Luffy to Amazon Lily. But I think that there is one reason: the former empress of amazon lily. She was the empress between Hancock and Shakky. According to Gloriosa she died from "love sickness". But she fell in love for who? The answer is Dragon. That is a old Luffy's mom theory (the best one by far). So thats the connection between Luffy and Amazon Lily (you can argue that the women from Amazon Lily can't give birth to boys, but I think this an ancient lie from the women island).
But how Kuma know about Luffy's mom? If this theory is right then Luffy's mom and Hancock have parallels. Apart the parallel of both having fallen in love to a member of Monkey D. family, both were celestial dragon's slave. In some moment Luffy's mom met Kuma when both were slaves (Kuma was a child at that time, so I guess Luffy's mom was also a child) and both become close friends.
So the reason Kuma knew that Dragon has a son, is because he is also a friend of Luffy's mom.
Like I said before, Dragon didnt order Kuma to protect Luffy in Sabaody or protect sunny for 2 years. Dragon would not waste for 2 years one of his best commanders to protect a ship. But protect Sunny was Kuma last wish. It's still not clear why he did that, but I guess the reason he did that is cause he somehow conclude that Luffy is Nika or something like that.

*Kuma and Luffy's mom were enslaved in God Valley not Mary Geoise. God Valley was a place tenryuubito used to frequent, Sengoku himself says that the Rocks took slaves and tenryuubitos hostage in God Valley.

This sounds like a fanfic or not?



@Rambles @AverageNamiEnjoyer @Paperchampion23 @Sir Yasheen @Devilbat @Useless_Kidd @CoC: Color of Clowns @Warchief Sanji D Goat @Mr. Reloaded
Click to expand...
I love it personally. Kuma having ties to God Valley has several other implications to some theories I have about his character and what the island even is (i.e. I think the island itself is Uranus, the weapon Imu used to destroy Lulusia and is powered by Mother Flame). Kuma knowing Luffy's mother as a child just helps that idea.

But to you're point, Im not sure Luffy's mother was an original amazon Lily inhabitant, but theres an explanation and its Shakky.

Shakky was a pirate 40 years ago, which like Bakkin and others, aligns with her being a Rocks pirate. One thing I can see is Shakky took in Luffy's mom (and maybe temporarily Kuma?) from God Valley. As you can see here, Shakky was the Empress 2 generations ago, which aligns the previous one dying due to "Lovesickness" (my guess is this is wrong and just spun that way because of Hancock):



I think we are getting VERY close as to what Kuma is and why he's this knowledgeable about Luffy.

Now I assume his motivations to becoming a machine have to do with the wider WG and Bonney, but its making things very interesting going forward. Good thread.
 
I

IsaziSempi

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#4
#4
I think Kuma is a central player. Only people who have been relevant to the story as Michael as him and as significant as him are shanks and dragon.

He's probably really important which is why he's being fleshedout in the end game. Even his daughter is a supernova. He was also probably a fatherly figure to Sabo since we know dragon is a deadbeat in the father department.

He's probably aware of who Luffy was because he was never under Dragons controll. The reason why iva was unaware of Kuma's mission is because it wasn't dragons idea. Dragon would have never sent Kuma on this suicide mission. Kuma decided himself that there was something on the redline he needed to take care of and there's a reason why urusus shock has been significant every times he's used it. He's probably after Imu.

He's also tied in with vegapunk and the reason being vegapunk has been so rebellious. Df's play a vital role I'm the storyline and there's something special about the paw paw fruit. I think people would say oh jey it's probably a bomb which was mentioned in the story but I think it's more relevant to his ability to repel memories and other non tangible things.

Kuma is way more linked to the ancient kingdom and forgotten knowledge than he is with the shichibukai, wg or revolutionaries. His decision to protect the thousand sunny probably has to do with the fact that it's made from the Adam wood from O'Hara the same as Roger's ship.

You might need a ship made from that wood to reach raftel or some other goal. As for why he sent Luffy to Amazon lily I don't know and I don't think Oda knows himself.

He might just have done it because he knows luffy's affinity towards Shichibukai. He either befriends them or defeats them. He was their when Mihawk attended the reverie and expressed interest in the strawhats. He also saw Luffy defeat moria and knew he took down Crocodile. Maybe he knew that Boa would either accept his or fight him. He also could have asked Rayleigh what do you think Boa would do with Luffy.
 
Etzel Andergast

Etzel Andergast

‎
#6
#6
Paperchampion23 said:
I love it personally. Kuma having ties to God Valley has several other implications to some theories I have about his character and what the island even is (i.e. I think the island itself is Uranus, the weapon Imu used to destroy Lulusia and is powered by Mother Flame). Kuma knowing Luffy's mother as a child just helps that idea.

But to you're point, Im not sure Luffy's mother was an original amazon Lily inhabitant, but theres an explanation and its Shakky.

Shakky was a pirate 40 years ago, which like Bakkin and others, aligns with her being a Rocks pirate. One thing I can see is Shakky took in Luffy's mom (and maybe temporarily Kuma?) from God Valley. As you can see here, Shakky was the Empress 2 generations ago, which aligns the previous one dying due to "Lovesickness" (my guess is this is wrong and just spun that way because of Hancock):



I think we are getting VERY close as to what Kuma is and why he's this knowledgeable about Luffy.

Now I assume his motivations to becoming a machine have to do with the wider WG and Bonney, but its making things very interesting going forward. Good thread.
Click to expand...
I didnt mention previously, but I believe shakky is the elder sister of luffy's mom
 
Poorsalino Cooker

Poorsalino Cooker

‎
#7
#7
Etzel Andergast said:
Click bait title

I have 3 important questions about Kuma and an theory trying to answer some of them:

1) Why Kuma knew that Dragon has a son, but Ivankov didn't? The three are close friends according to Sabo and the three founded RA. But why only Kuma knew it?

2) Why Kuma protected Sunny? Would not make any sense Dragon order him to do it. Dragon doesnt want interfere in Luffy journey. I dont think that Dragon even knew about Kuma situation in that moment. But the interesting about this question is because that was Kuma last wish.

3) Why Kuma send Luffy to Amazon Lily? He sent every strawhat to place that are related to them. But Luffy and Amazon Lilly doesnt have nothing in common.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Let's begin with the third question. There is no apparent reason for Kuma send Luffy to Amazon Lily. But I think that there is one reason: the former empress of amazon lily. She was the empress between Hancock and Shakky. According to Gloriosa she died from "love sickness". But she fell in love for who? The answer is Dragon. That is a old Luffy's mom theory (the best one by far). So thats the connection between Luffy and Amazon Lily (you can argue that the women from Amazon Lily can't give birth to boys, but I think this an old lie from the women island).

But how Kuma know about Luffy's mom? If this theory is right then Luffy's mom and Hancock have parallels. Apart the parallel of both having fallen in love to a member of Monkey D. family, both were celestial dragon's slave. In some moment Luffy's mom met Kuma when both were slaves (Kuma was a child at that time, so I guess Luffy's mom was also a child) and both become close friends.
So the reason Kuma knew that Dragon has a son, is because he is also a friend of Luffy's mom.

Like I said before, Dragon didnt order Kuma to protect Luffy in Sabaody or protect sunny for 2 years. Dragon would not waste for 2 years one of his best commanders to protect a ship. But protect Sunny was Kuma last wish. It's still not clear why he did that, but I guess the reason he did that is cause he somehow conclude that Luffy is Nika or something like that.

*Kuma and Luffy's mom were enslaved in God Valley not Mary Geoise. God Valley was a place tenryuubito used to frequent, Sengoku himself says that the Rocks took slaves and tenryuubitos hostage in God Valley.

This sounds like a fanfic or not?



@Rambles @AverageNamiEnjoyer @Paperchampion23 @Sir Yasheen @Devilbat @Useless_Kidd @CoC: Color of Clowns @Warchief Sanji D Goat @Mr. Reloaded
Click to expand...
I think it all sounds very possible. Luffy's mom being the deceased queen of Amazon Lily would also be an apt revelation since it would make his banishment to Amazon Lily make way more sense outside of the haki stuff.

Also is there any confirmation anywhere if any of the queens of Amazon Lily were related to each other? Because Aunt Shakky and Uncle Rayleigh has nice ring to it too.
:lunazing:
 
Etzel Andergast

Etzel Andergast

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#12
#12
AverageNamiEnjoyer said:
Uta's song where the wind blows is referring to windmill (Luffy's village).
I think Uta did talk about it in one of her concerts that this song is about Luffy's home.
She could be just a normal person like Making lol.

Luffy's mother could be celestial dragon. Maybe she is still alive.
Click to expand...
I still bet amazon lily just to make kuma decision to send luffy there make sense. But dont worry that parallel with hancock doesnt imply in luhan
 
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AverageNamiEnjoyer

AverageNamiEnjoyer

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#13
#13
Etzel Andergast said:
I still bet amazon lily just to make kuma decision to send luffy there make some sense. But dont worry that parallel with hancock doesnt imply in luhan
Click to expand...
" John Irons: What is Luffy's mother like? Was she beautiful? What happened to her? Did she die when Luffy was a baby?

Oda: I think she's alive. I'm still thinking hard about this. [Laughs] But if she does appear in the story, then she'll be a very tough-looking woman. And strict. There's no way that she's a beautiful mother. She's got this typical middle-aged woman's permed hair. Speaking about families, I did a backstory for Nico Robin and her family. That was actually the first time for me to draw a mother in a character's memory. Up until that point, I'd never drawn a blood relation. In Chopper's case, he's called a son even though he's not blood-related. So I've put in a message there saying that you can still call someone who's not related by blood your family. American Shonen Jump (December 2009 ) "

This is probably about Dadan.
But who knows.


Maybe a giant.. so he can connect Luffy to Elbaf too.

 
Malakhith

Malakhith

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#15
#15
I personally disagree a little with your theory because it assumes things that Kuma/Boa/Amazons had no way to know. What's the point of sending Luffy to Amazon Lilly if no one knew the connection (not even Luffy)? And it's not like Kuma sent every SH to helpful places. Brook was sent to help against the longarm tribe but ended captured instead, as a example.

Luffy events in Amazon Lily were beyond anything Kuma would have a chance to know or even plan. How would he know that Boa's powers would not work on him? Or that she would fall in love with him? Let's assume for a moment that Kuma knows Boa enough to know that she hates men. With her hax there was no way for Luffy to avoid being turned into stone (for what he knew).

So answering question 3, the reason why he sent Luffy to Amazon lily was exactly for that: keep him away from Marineford and Ace. Amazon Lily does not have boats besides Boa's pirate ship and is located in the calm belt so he would be unable to built one and escape. And while he is strong enough to survive against the common amazons, for what kuma knows he would be turned to stone as soon as he met Boa. At the same time, Rayleigh is basically Boa father figure and would be able to convince her to let him be freed. Logically speaking, he sent Luffy to the best place in the world to keep him away from the war and safe from danger.

But that's a good theory, man. Maybe you're right.
 
Etzel Andergast

Etzel Andergast

‎
#18
#18
AverageNamiEnjoyer said:
Uta's song where the wind blows is referring to windmill (Luffy's village).
I think Uta did talk about it in one of her concerts that this song is about Luffy's home.
She could be just a normal person like Making lol.

Luffy's mother could be celestial dragon. Maybe she is still alive.
Click to expand...
Luffy: windmill
Nami: pinwheel (tattoo)
The wind spins both

DON
 
Devilbat

Devilbat

‎
#20
#20
AverageNamiEnjoyer said:
" John Irons: What is Luffy's mother like? Was she beautiful? What happened to her? Did she die when Luffy was a baby?

Oda: I think she's alive. I'm still thinking hard about this. [Laughs] But if she does appear in the story, then she'll be a very tough-looking woman. And strict. There's no way that she's a beautiful mother. She's got this typical middle-aged woman's permed hair. Speaking about families, I did a backstory for Nico Robin and her family. That was actually the first time for me to draw a mother in a character's memory. Up until that point, I'd never drawn a blood relation. In Chopper's case, he's called a son even though he's not blood-related. So I've put in a message there saying that you can still call someone who's not related by blood your family. American Shonen Jump (December 2009 )
Click to expand...
If she's alive, I hope Oda gives good reason as to why she abandoned Luffy... I kinda like the Amazon Lily theory better tbh.
 
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