Questions & Mysteries Urek Mazino vs V (Prime)

[MonsterKaido]

--Urek is portrayed to be stronger than Family heads in general. In the FH flashback Zahard and V were highlighted as two leaders among their group while climbing.

--V and arlen where fighting against the 10 FHs and were holding their own in great war.

--V most likely will resurrect at some point in the story. If V didn't "die" and continued to grow stronger , could he match urek's power?

Thoughts?

@Shadowlord123 @Greenbeard @NAMELESS @Welkin @Cinera @Worst @Cadis Etrama Di Urek @Minatoze Narutomaki @Ha Yuri Zahard @Flower @Tai long @Haoshoku @Marimo_420 @Medeia @LogicoftheVI etc

 

[Cruxroux]

Not two of my fav against each other.
Fuck you

They win , Zahard looses in Cross fire.

 

[Welkin]

Well you said it yourself

The flashback portrays Zahard and V as equals

V if he were still alive and grew at the same rate as Zahard would roughly be as strong as him

Which means he’d likely be in the same tier as Urek and Zahard. Above the family heads but below the 2 god tiers (Phanta and Enryu)

The gap between them would probably be too tiny to really matter

I’d call it a draw with Urek maybe having a very very slight advantage since I consider him only slightly superior to Zahard

 

[Worst]

By definition if V was stated to be equal to Zahard and Zahard is above Urek then V should also be > Urek ( even if by a minimal margin )

However there are some things to consider.....

We saw the Great Warriors struggling while climbing BUT whatever V did appears to have triggered some change in the tower so I think irregulars that entered the tower AFTER the Zahard system was in place benefitted from that change much more than the great Warriors themselves

Like Urek is said to have climbed the whole tower in 50 years and is recorded to be the fastest to climb it!

Baam is the lowest ranked regular to have defeated a ranker ( did it as a C regular ) AND defeated multiple rankers and High rankers and is growing at a tremendous rate

Enryu spawned at the floor of death and offed an admin



Also Urek didn't even bothered to learn Shinworyu ( it's said he never underwent revolution ) which is basically ToG's domain expansion if he had learned that he would've been superior to Zahard and V imho

 

[Cadis Etrama Di Urek]

The flashback portrays Zahard and V as equals

Before revolution.

This is the main point people miss, upon revolution onwards all we know is that Zahard became some untouchable monster in the group, after this point V has no arguments or solid ground to still put him as equals with Zahard.


Dude couldn't stop Z from personally murdering his son and that's all we know, he just died and if he died it means he has no immortality contract, probably never reached that point where the FH's asked for one.


Looking at it from a new point of view since he didn't gain immortality he might have faced Zahard before he reached his peak even as with all the family heads.

 

[MonsterKaido]

Before revolution.

This is the main point people miss, upon revolution onwards all we know is that Zahard became some untouchable monster in the group, after this point V has no arguments or solid ground to still put him as equals with Zahard.


Dude couldn't stop Z from personally murdering his son and that's all we know, he just died and if he died it means he has no immortality contract, probably never reached that point where the FH's asked for one.


Looking at it from a new point of view since he didn't gain immortality he might have faced Zahard before he reached his peak even as with all the family heads.

But nothing states zahard overtaking V by huge margin or anything post revolution.

 

[Cadis Etrama Di Urek]

But nothing states zahard overtaking V by huge margin or anything post revolution.

Everything alludes to that, wym?

V is never referred to in the same power bracket as Zahard after revolution, Gustang who is the greatest piece of knowledge for readers didn't allude to something like that when describing him.


He just called him the worst person he ever knew, he was more evil than Zahard and that's all we're told, and seeing his god complex with belleir it's firmly believable that he was a piece of shit later on.

It was stated everyone changed during that climb after all, V was not special or exempt from that


He died which means he was mortal, and if he was mortal around that time period then that means the FH's were also mortal as they all gained immortality simultaneously.


If he lost to a mortal Zahard who along with the family heads weren't yet at the level they are now in current times then that makes any arguments for him decrease even further.


Data Zahard was known as the strongest Data in there at all times even in the past when the other datats of FH's were there.


Only person who would have been greater was a properly copied Urek.


If the gap already existed from that point already then there's truly no room for V being in the same tier as current Z or the family heads.

 

[Minatoze Narutomaki]

But nothing states zahard overtaking V by huge margin or anything post revolution.

he never overtook V, both V and Zahard were considered strongests before their evolutions, even more so V was the pioneer and more reliable as it was he who took the decisions for the FHs in the flashback after the evolution as well,
but Urek is stronger still

 

[MonsterKaido]

V is never referred to in the same power bracket as Zahard after revolution, Gustang who is the greatest piece of knowledge for readers didn't allude to something like that when describing him.


He just called him the worst person he ever knew, he was more evil than Zahard and that's all we're told, and seeing his god complex with belleir it's firmly believable that he was a piece of shit later on.

It was stated everyone changed during that climb after all, V was not special or exempt from that


He died which means he was mortal, and if he was mortal around that time period then that means the FH's were also mortal as they all gained immortality simultaneously.


If he lost to a mortal Zahard who along with the family heads weren't yet at the level they are now in current times then that makes any arguments for him decrease even further.


Data Zahard was known as the strongest Data in there at all times even in the past when the other datats of FH's were there.


Only person who would have been greater was a properly copied Urek.


If the gap already existed from that point already then there's truly no room for V being in the same tier as current Z or the family heads.

--When did Gustang compared V to Zahard in relation to strength or power level?

--So? When has Gustang every said anything where he mentions Zahard as superior/stronger than V lol?

--"Everyone changed during that climb after all" -- Again I don't see how this has anything to do with V being > Zahard.

--Nothing but head canon you created. We do not have timeline of when they did their immortality contract. Arlen already had the contract.

--What? It makes sense for zahard to remove V and arlen's data lol

--Bunch of nothing burger explanations from you which proves nothing at all.

Poor attempt at downplaying V.

 

[Cadis Etrama Di Urek]

--When did Gustang compared V to Zahard in relation to strength or power level?

--So? When has Gustang every said anything where he mentions Zahard as superior/stronger than V lol?

--"Everyone changed during that climb after all" -- Again I don't see how this has anything to do with V being > Zahard.

--Nothing but head canon you created. We do not have timeline of when they did their immortality contract. Arlen already had the contract.

--What? It makes sense for zahard to remove V and arlen's data lol

--Bunch of nothing burger explanations from you which proves nothing at all.

Poor attempt at downplaying V.

Downplay the dude who got killed and lost his entire forces to a far weaker Zahard and couldn't stop his son being personally killed by Zahard and also couldn't save Arlene?


Same Arlene who had to save both her dead lover and son's souls because V couldn't step up?


Imagine my shock when the irregular with the most historic hattrick of L's is not rated in my books.


So once again, unless V showed the same potential and growth speed as Urek in canon then by all means he shall forever remain weaker than all the current family heads let alone Urek himself or Zahard.


Until then you can keep wanking the king of L's amongst irregulars.


Better hope be stays dead too and not try to take over Baam this arc again lest Urek puts him down to save his favourite Baam from that L magnet.

 

[MonsterKaido]

Downplay the dude who got killed and lost his entire forces to a far weaker Zahard and couldn't stop his son being personally killed by Zahard and also couldn't save Arlene?


Same Arlene who had to save both her dead lover and son's souls because V couldn't step up?


Imagine my shock when the irregular with the most historic hattrick of L's is not rated in my books.


So once again, unless V showed the same potential and growth speed as Urek in canon then by all means he shall forever remain weaker than all the current family heads let alone Urek himself or Zahard.


Until then you can keep wanking the king of L's amongst irregulars.


Better hope be stays dead too and not try to take over Baam this arc again lest Urek puts him down to save his favourite Baam from that L magnet.

V and arlen losing against zahard (Who is V level himself) and 10 FHs is nothing to scoff at all. If anything that was the normal outcome.

Why you using this to downplay V is beyond me

You do understand V is MC's father correct? MC's fathers get wanked and hyped a lot in general. There is a reason why V and zahard were separated from rest of FHs. Even data eduan makes comparison between V and Zahard. And no evidence zahard far surpassed V post revolution.

You mean if V shows he will get crazy hype?

 

[Cadis Etrama Di Urek]

V and arlen losing against zahard (Who is V level himself) and 10 FHs is nothing to scoff at all. If anything that was the normal outcome.

Why you using this to downplay V is beyond me

You do understand V is MC's father correct? MC's fathers get wanked and hyped a lot in general. There is a reason why V and zahard were separated from rest of FHs. Even data eduan makes comparison between V and Zahard. And no evidence zahard far surpassed V post revolution.

You mean if V shows he will get crazy hype?

This may sound surprising but V and Arlene did not take on Z and the other family heads combined.

It was Zahards forces that eliminated both V, Arlene and the entirety of his forces.

It was not a 11 on 2 situation so V and Arlene along with their forces lost pretty overwhelmingly against regents and Z himself in that war.


Btw In this story the MC's father is far less relevant than the mother, Baam is more interested in knowing Arlene than V also so even more irrelevancy for him in the long run.


V has no special feats, no special area that he was overwhelmingly superior in amongst the irregulars unlike Arlene with her spells for example.


He didn't break or create records or create a lasting impact in the tower, the only thing he has is that he died pretty early.



And amazing to me you think Urek, the man who SIU has stated he plans to properly expand on his story in lore, the only man with connections to Phantaminum that we don't know of would be used to hype a dead Irregular far lesser than him in lore too.





Urek is far more important than V in story sorry to tell you, Baams father is no role model on how not to turn evil while climbing the tower like Urek is.

 

[MonsterKaido]

This may sound surprising but V and Arlene did not take on Z and the other family heads combined.

It was Zahards forces that eliminated both V, Arlene and the entirety of his forces.

It was not a 11 on 2 situation so V and Arlene along with their forces lost pretty overwhelmingly against regents and Z himself in that war.


Btw In this story the MC's father is far less relevant than the mother, Baam is more interested in knowing Arlene than V also so even more irrelevancy for him in the long run.


V has no special feats, no special area that he was overwhelmingly superior in amongst the irregulars unlike Arlene with her spells for example.


He didn't break or create records or create a lasting impact in the tower, the only thing he has is that he died pretty early.



And amazing to me you think Urek, the man who SIU has stated he plans to properly expand on his story in lore, the only man with connections to Phantaminum that we don't know of would be used to hype a dead Irregular far lesser than him in lore too.





Urek is far more important than V in story sorry to tell you, Baams father is no role model on how not to turn evil while climbing the tower like Urek is.

Doesn't change the fact that zahard's side had an overwhelming advantage lol. Its not only raw power but abilities also matter in war. Having someone like tu pierre is obviously way more advantageous.

Zahard didn't even killed or defeated V by himself. We have no idea where V was when zahard was murdering baby baam.

That doesn't change the fact it was V not arlen who was highlighted in terms of power and leadership

Both zahard and V were leaders. V was the first to go under revo and decided to change the tower forever by also giving the ability to other FHs. But but V is not relevant Bruh what you smoking lol?

Tell that to yourself. Urek's main goal is get out of tower lmfao

 

[Cadis Etrama Di Urek]

Doesn't change the fact that zahard's side had an overwhelming advantage lol. Its not only raw power but abilities also matter in war. Having someone like tu pierre is obviously way more advantageous.

Zahard didn't even killed or defeated V by himself. We have no idea where V was when zahard was murdering baby baam.

That doesn't change the fact it was V not arlen who was highlighted in terms of power and leadership

Both zahard and V were leaders. V was the first to go under revo and decided to change the tower forever by also giving the ability to other FHs. But but V is not relevant Bruh what you smoking lol?

Tell that to yourself. Urek's main goal is get out of tower lmfao

Remind me again which family head cares about V?


Gustang forgot him pretty quickly, only remembers Arlene well and he's irrelevant to Traum and Arie Hon and he weren't friends same with Edhuan and Ari Han. Same with Ha and the others, he has no relevant connections with any family head or Zahard anymore.


Even Urek told Baam not to care much about his connections to the past and also don't be tied down by his fate.


SIU seems pretty hellbent on viewing V as old history, even his "revival" got cucked cause he has no place in the current times anymore.


Arlene remains the only relevant history of Baams past.


V being the first to undergo revolution, extremely important piece of the story btw.


Urek didn't need the little thing called revolution unlike V.

 

[MonsterKaido]

Remind me again which family head cares about V?


Gustang forgot him pretty quickly, only remembers Arlene well and he's irrelevant to Traum and Arie Hon and he weren't friends same with Edhuan and Ari Han. Same with Ha and the others, he has no relevant connections with any family head or Zahard anymore.


Even Urek told Baam not to care much about his connections to the past and also don't be tied down by his fate.


Everyone seems pretty hellbent on viewing V as old history, even his "revival" got cucked cause he has no place in the current times anymore.


Arlene remains the only relevant history of Baams past.


V being the first to undergo revolution, extremely important piece of the story btw.


Urek didn't need the little thing called revolution unlike V.

Caring about V = V not being on same level as Zahard? FHs most likely hated V as he was wrongly famed for ameuz's death.

What has all that to do with V's power level again? We know that they all hate V.

So? How is that a negative against V?

V is more relevant from the perspective of changing TOG forever. V will show in future arcs confirmed where as that is not 100% the case with arlen.

Zero proof urek > Current zahard. This thread is not about who has more potential.

 

[Cadis Etrama Di Urek]

Caring about V = V not being on same level as Zahard? FHs most likely hated V as he was wrongly famed for ameuz's death.

What has all that to do with V's power level again? We know that they all hate V.

So? How is that a negative against V?

V is more relevant from the perspective of changing TOG forever. V will show in future arcs confirmed where as that is not 100% the case with arlen.

Zero proof urek > Current zahard. This thread is not about who has more potential.

TOG is all about fucking potential and growth, that's why we have Baam as protagonist and not some random new irregular who had the same growth rate as the family heads and Z in the past.


There needed to be an irregular with more potential than Zahard to defeat him and that's Baam.


Urek's potential was the most explosive and infinite thing the tower ever witnessed in canon, there's far more arguments of him being greater than Zahard than there is for V possibly being equls with Arie Hon let alone Zahard as king as of current or even in the past.


The only people Arie Hon ever lost to were Zahard and Urek for example, if V is not in this conversation it doesn't bode well for him in the slightest about his strength.


Seems pretty straightforward me thinks.

 

[MonsterKaido]

TOG is all about fucking potential and growth, that's why we have Baam as protagonist and not some random new irregular who had the same growth rate as the family heads and Z in the past.


There needed to be an irregular with more potential than Zahard to defeat him and that's Baam.


Urek's potential was the most explosive and infinite thing the tower ever witnessed in canon, there's far more arguments being greater than Zahard than there is for V possibly being equls with Arie Hon let alone Zahard as king as of current or even in the past.


The only people Arie Hon ever lost to were Zahard and Urek for example, if V is not in this conversation it doesn't bode well for him in the slightest about his strength.


Seems pretty straightforward me thinks.

Yeah. Baam is him. He is destined to beat Zahard. He may have a part of outside god literally. Not sure what has this to do with V again.

First the whole ari hon thing is blog post only and very debatable if its canon any more. I don't think it should be used as of now. Urek is definitely above FHs like gustang no doubt.

Bruh what? I don't know what is with this V downplay where the FB literally highlights how special V was compared to someone like Gustang. He was the first to do revo. It was his choice because of which all FH including zahard became more powerful.

No proof current urek > current zahard. That is head canon.

 

[Cadis Etrama Di Urek]

No proof current urek > current zahard. That is head canon.

Dunno, the past two chapters have been pretty hellbent on saying Urek probably has no equal within the tower.



We have this priceless gem here from narrator.


Don't think SIU is dumb and doesn't know what he's doing with this when he wrote it.

 

[MonsterKaido]

Dunno, the past two chapters have been pretty hellbent on saying Urek probably has no equal within the tower.



We have this priceless gem here from narrator.


Don't think SIU is dumb and doesn't know what he's doing with this when he wrote it.

Urek is no doubt one of the strongest. His potential may only be second to baam though I believe he zahard and V are all on similar levels. Hence current zahard has advantage.

I don't think characters like proust can even gauge full power of characters like zahard or urek.

 

[Cadis Etrama Di Urek]

Urek is no doubt one of the strongest. His potential may only be second to baam though I believe he zahard and V are all on similar levels. Hence current zahard has advantage.

I don't think characters like proust can even gauge full power of characters like zahard or urek.

From Narrator to Proust to Luslec.

The latter also said he couldn't gauge Urek's depth and the former was too direct to be frank in how it called Urek.


But like I said, it's pretty consistent that he's bottomless or that he could be the actual strongest being in the tower right now.


As we go further Urek will keep getting wanked later on, either when Baam comes across a special test in the upper floors that Urek smashed while he himself struggled with or once again with his overall status in the tower.


SIU seems far too consistent in these two areas for it to mean nothing, if we get more absolute statements like the narrator one again further as we go then it's pretty much sealed ngl.


At that point fence sitting would seem pretty redundant.