General & Others Wano had very few abandoned plot points

[Logiko]

That, instead, Is blatantly false. Luffy zoan Is model Nika, so clearly he should have a Nika form.

A human form of a human ? Nika is just Luffy, the warrior of liberation. He only becames free of any limits once he awakens. There can't be a "nika form" the Nika form is what Luffy would be.

And that Is another clearly false statement since gears are not at all loke to Hybrid forms.

Not explicitely no. But in One Piece you always need to take into account the subtext. And the fruit of Luffy was created just like other Zoans. Which can been seens through all the aspect of his transformations.

So no. its not the only one. You WANT it to be the only one (to justify your rant about it), nuance.

 

[Dragon777]

A human form of a human ? Nika is just Luffy, the warrior of liberation. He only becames the free of any limits once he awaken. There can't be a "nika form" the Nika form is what Luffy would be.

Again, Is pretty useless trying to wriggle away.

Luffy's model Is of a God: Nika, Just like Sengoku's Is that of a (statue of) Buddha. They aren't Just human being and we know because their fruit are...mythical, not normal zoans. The zoan of a normal human Is the one chopper ate.

So yes, obviously there should be a full Nika (god) form.

Not explicitely no. But in One Piece you always need to take into account the subtext. And the fruit of Luffy was created just like other Zoans.

So no. its not the only one. You WANT it to be the only one (to justify your rant about it), nuance.

Sorry, agree: you have to try to justify all that, and so your rant about all being logical.

I am sorry that it doesn't work in the least, but the base material is just that.

 

[Logiko]

Again, Is pretty useless trying to wriggle away.

Luffy's model Is of a God: Nika, Just like Sengoku's Is that of a (statue of) Buddha. They aren't Just human being and we know because their fruit are...mythical, not normal zoans. The zoan of a normal human Is the one chopper ate.

So yes, obviously there should be a full Nika (god) form.

No. I'm sorry. But no.

In fact the fact of them being mythical should indicate you the fact that they will not behave like normal devil fruits.

Human human fruit are by essence not normal Zoan fruits in the first place and mythical are even more rare. You are searching to rant on something that is completely senseless.

Nika is just Luffy. He becomes the Sun god once he awakens and breaks his limits. Simple as that.

Sorry, I agree: you have to try to justify all that, and so your rant about all being logical.

I'm not the one that needs to justify that. The story justified this for me already. The presence of multiple transformations for a Zoan fruit already proves that Luffy uses hybrid forms. Now, you either accept or deny that. That's not my problem lol

And hey.. let's admit that the nika nika fruit is somehow different.. it wouldn't even be bad writting as the fruit is mentionned to be something very interesting that attracted both Shanks AND the government. So its not even convoluted.

So even if the fruit was unique in its form (which it isn't). The revelation of Nika would not be downgraded because of that.

 

[Dragon777]

No. I'm sorry. But no.

In fact the fact of them being mythical should indicate you the fact that they will not behave like normal devil fruits.

Human human fruit are by essence not normal Zoan fruits in the first place and mythical are even more rare. You are searching to rant on something that this completely useless.

Nika is just Luffy. He becomes the Sun god once he awakens and breaks his limits.
...

I'm not the one that needs to justify that. The story justified this for me already. The presence of multiple transformations for a Zoan fruit already proves that Luffy uses hybrid forms. Now, you either accept or deny that. That's not my problem lol

And hey.. let's admit that the nika nika fruit is somehow different.. it wouldn't even be bad writting as the fruit is mentionned to be something very interesting that attracted both Shanks AND the government. So its not even convoluted.

So even if the fruit was unique in its form (which it isn't). The revelation of Nika would not be downgraded because of that.

Well, let's say that I can even agree with you about that. If we are saying that Luffy's fruit works differently, that Is unique, then sure.

Also, what one likes and what one does not are not necessarly connected to something like this. Idk, I very much like Kizaru's evolution and I find It perfectly justified; others don't and think he should have acted before (etc.).

 

[Logiko]

Well, let's say that I can even agree with you about that. If we are saying that Luffy's fruit works differently, that Is unique, then sure.

Also, what one likes and what one does not are not necessarly connected to something like this. Idk, I very much like Kizaru's evolution and I find It perfectly justified; others don't and think he should have acted before (etc.).

Your taste are your own and are perfectly legitimate and valid.

I understand that people don't like G5, after all, its not easy find "cool" a character that is goofing so much.

I'm only judging the revelation on a technical point of view from a narrative standpoint. And from this point of view, the G5 revelation is ground breaking. So much that it should be used in storytelling classes.

 

[Gauntlet]

No. Its a relevant element that will serve the storyline and its narration.

How will Zoro and Franky's statements serve any purpose in the plot, especially as the opportune time has past. At best they can only serve as an afterthought of either a flashback, or reason why they didn't attempt to fulfill their declarations, but either way their plot point will be less than relevant to the current situation, and even then that'd only raise questions on why these matters weren't significant to the characters during the readiment of the war.

No. That's not how it works mate. Again, you are confusing plot point and plot line.

Plot points can be left behind, never to be relevant again after their initial introduction. A plot point without any significance after has no point.

The problem is that there should be no expectations in the first place. Expectations in One Piece are mostly fuelled by fan who think they can analyse the story but actually don't have the element to understand how it really works.

Expectation can be set up by the author writing in plot points that have potential to go somewhere. If the plot points don't go nowhere, it stands to reason to question why said plot point exist.

That's how Sanji fan started to expect a fight in whole cake when the entire character arc of sanji points toward the opposite. Or Zoro killing Kaido, or Luffy killing Big Mom etc. What a character say is - again - not necessarily what will happen. In fact it will most likely not happen.

Sure. Sanji fighting somebody was just hope from fans, but can you blame them for expecting one of the most prominent fighters of One Piece to have a fight? Fighting is one of his most important character traits. Zoro killing Kaido was simply a theory that many hoped to happen for most people at 1st that grew into actual expectations when Zoro declared that he'll cut down Kaido, then proceeded to go to the rooftop. Sucks that Zoro never reflects on why he failed to even knock down Kaido as Zoro did show genuine disappointment in himself for not doing so, but that's whatever at this point. Luffy versus Big Mom was a dropped plotline that didn't even have a proper resolution. Luffy was big on defeating all of the Yonko, yet he wasn't even part of Big Mom's downfall. Even Zoro played more of a part of her defeat than Luffy.

There is what we call legitimate expectation : Expectation created by the storyline
And
Illegitimate expectation : Expectation created by wishes and a poor analysis of the story


In other word : Stay close to what the story say and needs, not what you want the story to be.

Some of us are, and frankly there are still incomplete plot lines and dropped plot points that may never see light of day again, and if they do, many of them have long since past their chance to be in the spotlight and to be used as greatly as they could have potentially been used as the matters some of them pertained to have come to past.

 

[Logiko]

How will Zoro and Franky's statements serve any purpose in the plot, especially as the opportune time has past. At best they can only serve as an afterthought of either a flashback, or reason why they didn't attempt to fulfill their declarations, but either way their plot point will be less than relevant to the current situation, and even then that'd only raise questions on why these matters weren't significant to the characters during the readiment of the war.

The purpose of those lines of dialogue is simple, to show that the strawhats are over optimistic.

Plot points can be left behind

No. A plot point is a fixed point in the story. Only storylines can be abandonned, but it it usually don't happen in storytelling as stories would feel unfinished if that happened. And this would be a much bigger feeling than just "zoro's story was abandonned", it would be something like "i don't understand the end of the story"

Expectation can be set up by the author writing in plot points that have potential to go somewhere. If the plot points don't go nowhere, it stands to reason to question why said plot point exist.

Yes, but ONLY if the narration follow those plot point. For example the rreason why we expected Sulong to have an impact in the war was because the narration supported the expectation of seeing Sulongs in the war.

Expectations that are not supported by the narration are illegitimate.

Sure. Sanji fighting somebody was just hope from fans, but can you blame them for expecting one of the most prominent fighters of One Piece to have a fight

Its ok to illigitimately expect something that will not happen. The problem arrives when people rant about it. They analysed the story badly, they take responsibility, those who rant are just fueling unececessary toxicity.

Fighting is one of his most important character traits.

Not for Sanji. Sanji is a cook first, a fighter second.

Luffy versus Big Mom was a dropped plotline that didn't even have a proper resolution.

No. Again you are confusing plot points (a line of dialogue) and plot lines.

Luffy was big on defeating all of the Yonko,

Which is - again - not a necessity to become King of the Pirate. Luffy only needs to be on top.

and frankly there are still incomplete plot lines and dropped plot points that may never see light of day again

Again, no.

You are confusing plot points and plot line. Lines of dialogues and the narration.

 

[YonkoGodLuffy]

The only ones that claim this are zorotards who believed in ZKK