Chapter Discussion Was Kizaru "Seeing Stars"?

#1
A bit of a brief and overdue post around the Viz translation for 1094.

As we all know by now, Viz decided that they want to "stand out" for the week by translating Kizaru's statement completely different from any other translation team, namely; with Kizaru stating "I'm seeing... stars...!!"

But is this an accurate translation? Already we should suspect something is off when Viz is the only translation team on the planet to translate it this way, but let's look a little deeper:

The actual wording which we can extract from the raws is the following: こりゃあ ... いかん...!!!

The first part of the phrase, " こりゃあ " - is a commonly used phrase to which would simply be a way of saying "This is..." in a surprised manner. So for example, in a statement like "What the hell is that!?!?", It'll be fit in instead of "is that" as a way of signifying your surprise.

The second part of the phrase, "いかん", is a shortened way of saying something is unsatisfactory. It's more appropiately used in the context of "this is undesirable", and usually used in broader contexts where your attempt is to stress the problematic nature of something and how it demands more focus.

So, the most literal translation would be: "This is.....problematic!!". Any translation still wouldn't really do justice to both the informal tone and the implication of what Kizaru was saying when understood appropiately. It'd be more akin to: "Uh-oh.... this is becoming problematic.." alongside the underlying tone that he needs to put significantly more focus onto solving the "issue", i.e Luffy.

There are two take-aways here:

One, nothing about " seeing stars" of any kind. Viz just decided to take creative liberties for the 972517258th time and indirectly cause another messy discussion on what actually happened.

Two, there was literally not a more informal way Kizaru could've said that. We've seen, only a few chapters earlier in-fact, that Kizaru usually shifts to a more serious tone when a situation escalates to an unexpected level which he acknowledges - such as when Luffy landed his kick on Kizaru. It's worth noting that throughout the entirety of the fight right after the kick, Kizaru goes back to his casual tone. This statement, is no exception in that regard.
I tend to actively avoid shoving my own interpretation when discussing issues like these, but it's really hard not to in this case. More specifically, why would Kizaru literally respond with the equivalent of "lol wth" if Luffy's attack was the ultimate Admiral-killer? Why would he maintain his unserious tone if such a massive hinderence towards his ability to accomplish his mission took place, when we've quite literally seen him change his tone in accordance to unexpected hinderences earlier?

Ultimately, this is one of those cases where the Japanese and the implications it has are invaluable in understanding the context. Interpret what happened however you want, but Kizaru's phrase once understood properly makes it very clear he genuinely doesn't care, even now - a consistent theme throughout the fight. Why exactly is something we'll soon discover, but it's clear that Kizaru has lots more to show if only at this stage he's realizing "Damn I'll probably have to take this seriously".
Feel free to correct me in the comments if anything I've said was misleading, but I hope this post atleast served in bringing some clarity to the issue.
 

ZenZu

The only one who can beat me is me
#4
This community is fucking nuts. Nonstop discourse over a tiny speech bubble. Weekly kanji experts. More translation wars than discussing the actual content.


I actually enjoyed reading this one though I can't lie but tell me how I understood the overall message on first read without needing such an in depth breakdown of japanese? Heck you don't even need to know what he said.

Just looking at Kizaru's expression both before and after getting hit sets the tone here. It's not that serious, you just have some diehard Yonkou fans trying to make this a bigger deal than it was presented to us. And then everyone gets caught up in that nonsense.

I didn't mind what Viz went with either, though after reading your post it does look like they could have kept it more grounded.
 
S

Sasaki Kojirō

#6
This is all typical Viz just trying to 'jazz' up the language. "I'm seeing stars" is the kind of stuff they do. They are looking at the situation for localization, and Japanese just sounds too 'generic' for them.

こりゃ…いかん
Whoa this isn't good... says he cares.
Just isn't enough for them...


Viz somehow helped poor kizaru by relieving his tension in his translation.

 
#14
This is all typical Viz just trying to 'jazz' up the language. "I'm seeing stars" is the kind of stuff they do. They are looking at the situation for localization, and Japanese just sounds too 'generic' for them.

こりゃ…いかん
Whoa this isn't good... says he cares.
Just isn't enough for them...


Viz somehow helped poor kizaru by relieving his tension in his translation.

A certain fandom trahstalked VIZ when what VIZ did was better for their idol portrayal and that's why Sandman preferred TCB this time.
 
#16
This is all typical Viz just trying to 'jazz' up the language. "I'm seeing stars" is the kind of stuff they do. They are looking at the situation for localization, and Japanese just sounds too 'generic' for them.

こりゃ…いかん
Whoa this isn't good... says he cares.
Just isn't enough for them...


Viz somehow helped poor kizaru by relieving his tension in his translation.

Common VIZ L. Why do they keep changing shit, they think fans are stupid and don’t read other scans or something?
 
#18
I read in 3 languages, English, Spanish and Portuguese, and Viz always messes up.
To me, "I'm seeing stars" = "Oh no, this is bad" = "Tu m'as eu sur ce coup" (French official, you got me with this move) all mean the same shit.

They all portray the same feeling.

I don't even understand the people who see a difference between these and who don't even comprehend that this is simply Kizaru reacting to the gravity of Luffy's punch.

I really don't understand the people who think that "I'm seeing stars" is to be taken literally because of the "cartoon stars" drawn in the manga or that "Oh no, this is bad" is Kizaru reacting to Saturn or reacting because "he will fall down". This is another level of copium.
 
Top