Questions & Mysteries Why do people want get rid of M3?

[Doggo]

Forget dick riding your fav and only talk about that trio. Ever since Robin people says Oda will make a M4 or something. Now even Jinbe isn't in the mix and the closest might be Yamato soon.

But my question is... Why do people have a problem with these 3 standing above all others until the end?

The bolded part is the part you might be looking with the wrong perspective.
SOME people have a problem with just SANJI being placed anywhere near Luffy or Zoro.
This is the main trigger for the "no more M3" rant. Why? Who knows.
Some don't like the fact that sanji "doesn't train" to get strong. Some just don't like the character. Some are insecure, etc, etc, etc.

 

[Cinera]

Because Oda hasn't respected Sanji as a combatant and I would like for formidable combatants to actually join the crew.

Quoting myself from the spoiler thread:


The combination of Law, Zoro and Luffy have felt more like a monster trio than Sanji, Zoro and Luffy have for the last decade. Given Zoro and Luffy's feats now, I don't see End of Wano Sanji being on the same tier with them (let alone their end of Wano versions), so I don't think the dynamic that sometimes existed preskip would be restored.

Like let's look at the best case for Sanji. He leaves Wano at Katakuri level. Well Katakuri level fighters get low diffed by Base Kaido. Both Luffy and Zoro should leave Wano above Base Kaido.

In addition to his Rooftop feats, by the end of Wano Zoro will get:

• Mastery of Haoshoku enhancement
• A black Enma

Luffy was already able to go toe to toe with Hybrid Kaido (apparently without Gear 4th!) for 30 minutes+, and he'll probably eventually defeat him.

At the end of Wano, Luffy and Zoro will be some flavour of Mid Top Tiers.

A YC 1 like Katakuri gets low/no diffed by them. And Katakuri level is the best End of Wano Sanji can hope for.

End of Wano Sanji gets low/no diffed by Luffy and Zoro.


On the other hand, by portrayal, End of Wano Law probably pushes End of Wano Zoro to at least high difficulty, and Yamato has the hype and performance to justify that if Oda wanted to.

Oda could write the story so that Law and Yamato leave Wano as Low Top Tiers (and it's what I'm hoping for).

Given the choice of Sanji being the 3rd strongest Strawhat and being a YC 2 - YC 1 while Luffy and Zoro are solid Top Tiers (he'll be low/no diff material for them), or Yamato and Law joining the crew as Low Top Tiers (so relative to Zoro and Luffy), I'll pick the latter every time.

I do not care for a monster trio where the 3rd strongest is at best low difficulty fight for the other two.


Tl;Dr: Sanji is too weak to make the Monster Trio feel meaningful.

@Kishido you didn't reply to this.

@Doggo: The above is my complaint. I don't have a problem with Oda making Sanji stronger, but Oda has not, and it seems like he will not.

 

[Doggo]

@Kishido you didn't reply to this.

@Doggo: The above is my complaint. I don't have a problem with Oda making Sanji stronger, but Oda has not, and it seems like he will not.

Oda literally made him a power ranger.
Hold that judgement until at least this arc is over. We don't even know who he's fighting against. And the most likely options DEFINITELY boosts his reputation quite a bit.

 

[Cinera]

Oda literally made him a power ranger.
Hold that judgement until at least this arc is over. We don't even know who he's fighting against. And the most likely options DEFINITELY boosts his reputation quite a bit.

I based my assessment on the assumption that he solos a Calamity.

I just think that the difference between Kaido and the Calamities is far too big.

 

[Doggo]

I based my assessment on the assumption that he solos a Calamity.

I just think that the difference between Kaido and the Calamities is far too big.

The gap is some artifical mean shounen writers use to hype the main baddie. In other scenarios, this gap is often thinned, if not completely gone.
These gaps also don't hold up very well in a narrative sense, unless we want to think that Kaido and Big Mom are these "unique" pirates that will never be matched ever again by those who succeed them. This is often not the case in shounens as well.
Don't take these gaps seriously.
The commanders are the only characters we have seen with bounties over 1B, aside from the Yonkos themselves. Shichibukais had their bounties frozen in their -500M range and were powerhouses already. Supernovas don't have huge bounties as well, by New World standards, and yet some of them are said to be on pair with said commanders, etc.
One Piece powerscaling is all over the place. There are "general standings", but these tend to not hold due to plot demands. It's not like the characters walk around with the Sayajin gadgets that tells them people's power scores. The only time we had something like this was in EL and SOMEHOW that still brings debate even today. "oh but DF. Oh but just physical strenght", etc.
Getting more analytical is fun, but, ultimately, in my experience, pointless. Oda will always give priority to plot over consistency. This week's chapter kinda shows it by the spoilers.

 

[Kishido]

@Kishido you didn't reply to this.

@Doggo: The above is my complaint. I don't have a problem with Oda making Sanji stronger, but Oda has not, and it seems like he will not.

I don't need to because I see your post history and there is no need to talk with you as we see things completely different

But I respect your opinion and go with it

 

[Cinera]

I don't need to because I see your post history and there is no need to talk with you as we see things completely different

But I respect your opinion and go with it

I'd like to hear how you see it.

 

[Manos. AsuraZoro]

Both fanbases have some fans that trash the other character.
Luffy zoro and sanji will always be the M3 of the strawhats.
But there is a difference in strength between them.
Luffy>>zoro>sanji imo.
Sanji will be one of the very few people capable of fighting and defeating an admiral

 

[Finalbeta]

What did Luffy accomplish to demonstrate he is > Zoro or even just likely?

 

[Sanji D Cook]

The M3 is not changing no matter how some think it should. It will always be Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji. People need to accept it.

 

[Rivaille]

Forget dick riding your fav and only talk about that trio. Ever since Robin people says Oda will make a M4 or something. Now even Jinbe isn't in the mix and the closest might be Yamato soon.

But my question is... Why do people have a problem with these 3 standing above all others until the end?

In my case it is not that I want to get rid of the M3 but more like that I do not think that someone like Jinbe will end up in the same group as Robin, Franky and Brook.

In term of feats and standing, he should be group with Luffy, Zoro and Sanji.

 

[Sir Yasheen]

In my case it is not that I want to get rid of the M3 but more like that I do not think that someone like Jinbe will end up in the same group as Robin, Franky and Brook.

In term of feats and standing, he should be group with Luffy, Zoro and Sanji.

Well have to see how Oda plays the Tobi Roppo fights. But I can honestly see Jinbe occupying a tier between Robin/Franky/Brook and the Monster Trio along with Yamato.

Remember the monster trio fought opponents over five times stronger than Frankys in Enies Lobby so there’s definitely wiggle room for another tier

 

[Rivaille]

Well have to see how Oda plays the Tobi Roppo fights. But I can honestly see Jinbe occupying a tier between Robin/Franky/Brook and the Monster Trio along with Yamato.

Remember the monster trio fought opponents over five times stronger than Frankys in Enies Lobby so there’s definitely wiggle room for another tier

Why Oda will create another tier within the crew when he can just pair Jinbe with Luffy, Zoro and Sanji ?

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Why Oda will create another tier within the crew when he can just pair Jinbe with Luffy, Zoro and Sanji ?

Because Luffy Zoro and Sanji are the captain along with his right and left hands. They’re the crews leaders as well as the strongest members.

Oda isn’t adding a late addition to the crews leadership

 

[Rivaille]

Because Luffy Zoro and Sanji are the captain along with his right and left hands. They’re the crews leaders as well as the strongest members.

Oda isn’t adding a late addition to the crews leadership

-Jinbe was a captain himself and has prove himself to be a leader
-He also proves that he can lead the crew during the Big Mom’s chase
-At no point Sanji was said to be Luffy’s left hand
-Jinbe is now one of the strongest crew members
-Oda already did that when Jinbe lead the crew in WCI.

 

[Sir Yasheen]

-Jinbe was a captain himself and has prove himself to be a leader
-He also proves that he can lead the crew during the Big Mom’s chase
-At no point Sanji was said to be Luffy’s left hand
-Jinbe is now one of the strongest crew members
-Oda already did that when Jinbe lead the crew in WCI.

1. Franky was also a leader of a team.
2. He drove the ship then immediately apologized for its condition to Sanji.
3. You’re serious... Luffy recommending the three of them separating into three groups, Sanji leading groups of straw hats and allies on multiple occasions, it’s clear that the monster trio is the leadership.
4. Jinbe is fighting someone same tier as Page One who Sanji overpowered easily.
5. Driving the ship isn’t the same as leading the crew.

 

[Finalbeta]

There's no accurate element that places Sanji above Yamato right now, that is highly debatable.

 

[Rivaille]

1. Franky was also a leader of a team.
2. He drove the ship then immediately apologized for its condition to Sanji.
3. You’re serious... Luffy recommending the three of them separating into three groups, Sanji leading groups of straw hats and allies on multiple occasions, it’s clear that the monster trio is the leadership.
4. Jinbe is fighting someone same tier as Page One who Sanji overpowered easily.
5. Driving the ship isn’t the same as leading the crew.

-Franky was not a Pirate captain and not a shishibukai
-He is an humble man but when the crew were crying about Pedro he was the one who make them focus
-Where did it say that Sanji is the left hand of Luffy? I did not ask for much, so can you provide that?
-Jinbe fought Who’s who whole crew before facing the man whereas Sanji fought Page One alone
-I agree. Which is why Jinbe did not just drive the boat. As I said he also make them focus when they crying for Pedro.

 

[Sir Yasheen]

-Franky was not a Pirate captain and not a shishibukai
-He is an humble man but when the crew were crying about Pedro he was the one who make them focus
-Where did it say that Sanji is the left hand of Luffy? I did not ask for much, so can you provide that?
-Jinbe fought Who’s who whole crew before facing the man whereas Sanji fought Page One alone
-I agree. Which is why Jinbe did not just drive the boat. As I said he also make them focus when they crying for Pedro.

1. He lead a bounty Hunter troop. I see no difference between that and a pirate captain.
2. And they immediately said “give me orders Nami” Nami is the leader before jinbe
3. It never says Zoro is Luffys right hand man either, but everyone can read and understand. Same with Sanji.
4. Sanji one shot Black Marias group while tied up and one shot headliners left and right. That “crew” doesn’t mean anything.

Jinbe isn’t strong enough and the crew respects his experience but the he’s not a leader of the crew.

Post automatically merged: May 27, 2021

There's no accurate element that places Sanji above Yamato right now, that is highly debatable.

There wasn’t one placing him above Franky first half of Enies lobby... we know how that went down too.

You think Odas changing the basic crew structure after 20 years? Hard doubt

 

[worst pirate]

Well there are instances throughout the Manga where Oda focuses on different groups in the SH crew , Some of them are listed below (focus only on L/Z/S) :

1) Luffy/Zoro/Sanji : trio focusing on the top 3 members of crew in strength .

2) Zoro/Sanji : duo highlighted as the wingman of Luffy , and take charge when Luffy is not available even completing the task with great synchronization
and teamwork ( whilst bickering on those instances).

3) Luffy/Zoro : duo highlighted with Captain/Vice Captain traits , even further emphasis is placed on their strength and will power in extreme circumstances and as one the leading members of new generation.

Any person dismissing these factions which have stood for 1000+ chapters is purely either basing his opinions on face value of things or his own agendas .