General & Others Why rooftop fight was trash
- Thread starter Charlotte Sky
- Start date
That fight had the potential to be one of the best of the entire manga but in the end it was trash indeed.
Different chapters wasted just to separate Big Mom from Kaido (and she was previously threw away from Onigashima by Jimbei and Robin already, so there was no need to do that again) and to let Luffy having a power up after an hit on his head.
Law's role was just to spam his teleportation, Zoro served as human shield for 1 attack while Kidd and Killer had almost no role until the end.
There were some really cool looking panels,but from a narrative point of view it was an useless mess.
Different chapters wasted just to separate Big Mom from Kaido (and she was previously threw away from Onigashima by Jimbei and Robin already, so there was no need to do that again) and to let Luffy having a power up after an hit on his head.
Law's role was just to spam his teleportation, Zoro served as human shield for 1 attack while Kidd and Killer had almost no role until the end.
There were some really cool looking panels,but from a narrative point of view it was an useless mess.
H
You are right but you said so many shits on your posts about Zoro.
I'm a Zoro fan. Who thinks rooftop fight was great is not a true fan. Zoro most time was baby-sitting Luffy. He was great but still nerfed for Enma and not having Shusui with him.
The problem with your arguments is that you are stupid enough to not realize Zoro was always stronger than Luffy since chapter 1.
BM attacks was a joke. I don't know why they needed to separate them, she was only doing "magic" weak damage. Those fireball of Prometheus that the 3 captains didn't even dodged and Zeus attacks seems as strong as Law throwing rocks on Kaido.
Kaido screaming everything someone touches him made us not understanding what was damaging him and what was not. Law's and Kid's attack can't damage Kaido at all. They were a joke. I really wanted to know how much damage Killer did on Kaido and how much damage Kaido took from Zoro's huricane, but he screamed as much as those joke attacks from Kid and Law. Luffy G4 is not using adv armament so he made the same damage as their first battle. Oh, let's not forget Luffy has "GUTS" to tank Kaido's boro breath. Useless attack on manga since everybody can deal with it. Also I'm not sure why Kaido is changing forms. Oden and Scabbards knocked down Dragon Form which made Kaido went to human form to fight them. Okay Human Form > Dragon Form. But Kaido was doing great in all forms against Supernovas, why he suddenly went into hybrid form?
Zoro so far with Ashura did the most damage on Kaido leaving a scar. And Luffy plot armor allowing him to coat conqueror is now toe to toe in base form with Kaido.
[automerge]1620225706[/automerge]
How dumb can you be? This is the same poor excuse when Luffy fought Doffy "It is Luffy + Law x Doffy". Go read the fucking manga, both said to each others that they were already damage. Luffy had some fights until get to the rooftop, he already used G4 twice, Kaido was with BM that damage Luffy too a little. Luffy almost got eaten by Kaido. You make this seem like Kaido is only 10% while Luffy is 100%.
LUFFY WAS FUCKING KNOCKED OUT moments ago. Luffy is way worst than Kaido and he is toe to toe. Luffy will win. Raid will not fail.
I'm a Zoro fan. Who thinks rooftop fight was great is not a true fan. Zoro most time was baby-sitting Luffy. He was great but still nerfed for Enma and not having Shusui with him.
The problem with your arguments is that you are stupid enough to not realize Zoro was always stronger than Luffy since chapter 1.
BM attacks was a joke. I don't know why they needed to separate them, she was only doing "magic" weak damage. Those fireball of Prometheus that the 3 captains didn't even dodged and Zeus attacks seems as strong as Law throwing rocks on Kaido.
Kaido screaming everything someone touches him made us not understanding what was damaging him and what was not. Law's and Kid's attack can't damage Kaido at all. They were a joke. I really wanted to know how much damage Killer did on Kaido and how much damage Kaido took from Zoro's huricane, but he screamed as much as those joke attacks from Kid and Law. Luffy G4 is not using adv armament so he made the same damage as their first battle. Oh, let's not forget Luffy has "GUTS" to tank Kaido's boro breath. Useless attack on manga since everybody can deal with it. Also I'm not sure why Kaido is changing forms. Oden and Scabbards knocked down Dragon Form which made Kaido went to human form to fight them. Okay Human Form > Dragon Form. But Kaido was doing great in all forms against Supernovas, why he suddenly went into hybrid form?
Zoro so far with Ashura did the most damage on Kaido leaving a scar. And Luffy plot armor allowing him to coat conqueror is now toe to toe in base form with Kaido.
[automerge]1620225706[/automerge]
How dumb can you be? This is the same poor excuse when Luffy fought Doffy "It is Luffy + Law x Doffy". Go read the fucking manga, both said to each others that they were already damage. Luffy had some fights until get to the rooftop, he already used G4 twice, Kaido was with BM that damage Luffy too a little. Luffy almost got eaten by Kaido. You make this seem like Kaido is only 10% while Luffy is 100%.
LUFFY WAS FUCKING KNOCKED OUT moments ago. Luffy is way worst than Kaido and he is toe to toe. Luffy will win. Raid will not fail.
You're even dumber. I never said Luffy wasn't damaged but it still isn't a 1v1 since Kaido fought all supernova at once and they dealt more damage than he did on Luffy.
I don't know what percentage it is for either of them by the way.
Besides Yamato is joining, she said it twice already. I don't think she will last long, she will serve as a plot device for Luffy to recover his strenght/haki or whatever.
And you are agreeing with me, I said Luffy will win and that the raid will succeed.
I don't know what percentage it is for either of them by the way.
Besides Yamato is joining, she said it twice already. I don't think she will last long, she will serve as a plot device for Luffy to recover his strenght/haki or whatever.
And you are agreeing with me, I said Luffy will win and that the raid will succeed.
Being knocked out doesn't mean more damage. Apoo knocked him out, he was fine second after.
If someone broke his leg and someone else is knocked out a few second and given a few more seconds to recover, who is more damaged?
Kaido is affected by the damage he took, there isn't a big difference but he took a lot more hits than Luffy.
There is no plot armor so far in this Luffy vs Kaido.
You make it seem like I'm a Kaido fanboy.
What about Yamato? You don't think she is coming?
If someone broke his leg and someone else is knocked out a few second and given a few more seconds to recover, who is more damaged?
Kaido is affected by the damage he took, there isn't a big difference but he took a lot more hits than Luffy.
There is no plot armor so far in this Luffy vs Kaido.
You make it seem like I'm a Kaido fanboy.
What about Yamato? You don't think she is coming?
H
Being knocked out it means more damage wtf? Luffy received enough damage at their first battle with Kaido, receive enough damage against Apoo to be knocked out for a few seconds and again against Kaido to be knocked out for a longer time. Luffy most battles he wins by knocking out his opponent how is that not more damage? Luffy fine second after? He got knocked out for few seconds only but he already took a big damage otherwise this "endurace god of Katakuri fight" wouldn't have been knocked out. It is stupid to make an argument like yours.
It is plot armor, Luffy had to train while fighting with Katakuri to learn future sight. He failed sometimes and succeeded others. Same thing with adv armament. But now with the most advanced technique that people like Doffy and Katakuri that already awakened their DF and have CoC can't use but Luffy is already a master without even trying like the others advanced haki he learned. It is plot armor. Before you try that shit argument that "conqueror can't be trained" it can, you train how to control. That is why Rayleigh said he shouldn't use that power until he learn how to do it without using in his allies. So Luffy TRAINED conqueror haki to hit enemies only. So he should have trained to coat.
Really how much absurd is to have such a power and never even cross your mind that coating your attacks with it is a possibility? It is ridiculous that quotation from Luffy "I was thinking about it", haki since beginning is unlocked by extreme situations, okay that happened to Luffy no need to say such bullshit like he was thinking about it.
Edit: Sorry forgot to talk about Yamato. I bet Yamato is just going to see Luffy being defeated by Kaido or to betray Luffy. I don't see now anything supporting Yamato betrayal on Luffy but if Oda comes with a good explanation would be awesome!
Besides that she is not helping Luffy to defeat Kaido. He wants a 1v1 would be disrespectful of her taking part on that fight and would makes no sense on Oda writing for that speech of Luffy at 1010.
It is plot armor, Luffy had to train while fighting with Katakuri to learn future sight. He failed sometimes and succeeded others. Same thing with adv armament. But now with the most advanced technique that people like Doffy and Katakuri that already awakened their DF and have CoC can't use but Luffy is already a master without even trying like the others advanced haki he learned. It is plot armor. Before you try that shit argument that "conqueror can't be trained" it can, you train how to control. That is why Rayleigh said he shouldn't use that power until he learn how to do it without using in his allies. So Luffy TRAINED conqueror haki to hit enemies only. So he should have trained to coat.
Really how much absurd is to have such a power and never even cross your mind that coating your attacks with it is a possibility? It is ridiculous that quotation from Luffy "I was thinking about it", haki since beginning is unlocked by extreme situations, okay that happened to Luffy no need to say such bullshit like he was thinking about it.
Edit: Sorry forgot to talk about Yamato. I bet Yamato is just going to see Luffy being defeated by Kaido or to betray Luffy. I don't see now anything supporting Yamato betrayal on Luffy but if Oda comes with a good explanation would be awesome!
Besides that she is not helping Luffy to defeat Kaido. He wants a 1v1 would be disrespectful of her taking part on that fight and would makes no sense on Oda writing for that speech of Luffy at 1010.
Last edited by a moderator:
Chill out dude. It can be trained, never said the contrary.
But Kaido did say that only a handful of people can do it.
Katakuri and Doffy already hit their ceiling, they can't use CoC on top of their attacks. It's as simple as that.
Luffy's ceiling is higher. Hence the picture of Shanks, Roger, Whitebeard, Rocks and Oden behind him. You compare him to these guys not to Doffy and Kata lol. No matter how long they have been training, they reached their limits.
I reiterate my point about the damage intake. Being knocked out doesn't necessarily mean more damage, I thought I explained it clearly.
Another example if you want, if one gets his arm cut and bleed like a motherfucker but doesn't lose consciousness and someone else gets knocked out a few seconds, gets back up and gets a few seconds to recover, who is more damaged?
For example imo, Kiku took more damage than Luffy.
But Kaido did say that only a handful of people can do it.
Katakuri and Doffy already hit their ceiling, they can't use CoC on top of their attacks. It's as simple as that.
Luffy's ceiling is higher. Hence the picture of Shanks, Roger, Whitebeard, Rocks and Oden behind him. You compare him to these guys not to Doffy and Kata lol. No matter how long they have been training, they reached their limits.
I reiterate my point about the damage intake. Being knocked out doesn't necessarily mean more damage, I thought I explained it clearly.
Another example if you want, if one gets his arm cut and bleed like a motherfucker but doesn't lose consciousness and someone else gets knocked out a few seconds, gets back up and gets a few seconds to recover, who is more damaged?
For example imo, Kiku took more damage than Luffy.
H
Keep your headcanon to yourself. Also see my edited part of my last answer. There is no such thing as ceiling. Haki is something that everybody can learn and train to get stronger. Everybody that has CoC can learn how to coat it. Luffy didn't even won against Kata, I can compare with him how much I want. And he won Doffy but doesn't know much about haki and DF as he does. So it is all bullshit as BM only using adv CoC with Page One and not on rooftop with all that speech "I will kill you. I will be King(or Queen idk, whatever) of Pirates. You don't know what it means to be it".
Haki is about extreme situations, you will unlock haki when that situation comes. But it seems to work only on "protagonists" never with villains unless it is a flashback.
Okay, good point about losing a limb x getting knocked out. But still... none have happened to Kaido. So he is in better situation. Luffy fucking said that his attacks weren't even deep enough to really damage Kaido. But Kaido's attack were deep enough to damage Luffy. So at best they are at equals conditions. But no way Kaido is worst than Luffy.
Haki is about extreme situations, you will unlock haki when that situation comes. But it seems to work only on "protagonists" never with villains unless it is a flashback.
Okay, good point about losing a limb x getting knocked out. But still... none have happened to Kaido. So he is in better situation. Luffy fucking said that his attacks weren't even deep enough to really damage Kaido. But Kaido's attack were deep enough to damage Luffy. So at best they are at equals conditions. But no way Kaido is worst than Luffy.
Of course there is such thing as ceiling, otherwise there'd be no hierarchy between characters. You would just need to train to get stronger.
Some characters have a higher ceiling than others, have more talent with haki than others.
If you think this is not true, then there is no point to argue since we're on a completely different page.
Luffy defeated Katakuri, Kata and Luffy said it. You're the one with the headcanon.
You didn't understand any of my point by the way, I said you can't compare Luffy's ceiling to Katakuri or doffy's ceiling. If at one point they were close, his potential far exceed theirs.
Some characters have a higher ceiling than others, have more talent with haki than others.
If you think this is not true, then there is no point to argue since we're on a completely different page.
Luffy defeated Katakuri, Kata and Luffy said it. You're the one with the headcanon.
You didn't understand any of my point by the way, I said you can't compare Luffy's ceiling to Katakuri or doffy's ceiling. If at one point they were close, his potential far exceed theirs.
