General & Others Ruination of a character - Sanji, The Predator, The Gag and the Rock Lee of One Piece

Edwar.D.O

Edwar.D.O

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#281
#281
Rekien said:
Ussop was there when the crew needed him the most in ennies lobby....now where was Sanji in WCI? Almost left Luffy to starve, would have left Luffy to starve and die if BM was willing to go through her promisse with Germa, and dont pretend that was not the case. Not only that but made Luffy go against BM to save his stupid family, putting the crew in even more risk...He never even properly apologized to Luffy and everyone.
Where is Sanji now in Wano? Ran off the moment he saw a brothel, now ran off again when he heard a girl and got captured.

Thats the diference between Ussop and Sanji.
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How can you compare the Ussop and Sanji situation like that? Sanji was the one they went to save in his case. Ussop was there for Robin yes? As he fucking should be.

I never said their situations were the same nor do I believe them to be. But you’re literally making light out of Ussop situation just to slander Sanji.

Sanji didn’t make Luffy do anything? Even Luffy said he expected Sanji to want to save them because of how he is. If you were being bullied by someone at school and your school is on fire (God forbid) and you have a chance to save that bully and you do, I can only see this as merit because you’ve put your ill will to the side and become the bigger and better person. Luffy had already started beef with BM, the would have had to go up against her regardless. How would they have escaped without Germa? Jinbe situation benefited from them all going up against Big Mom then and there.

As I said before compare Ussop and Sanjis situations if you want, even though they are completely different, but don’t make light of Ussops situation just to slander Sanji. Nobody was threatening Ussops family, no one had a gun to his head, he was being completely unreasonable, this isn’t like Sanji who had matters and scores to settle, who was literally trapped and being held hostage himself. For him he saw no way out of that situation. Before we knew about the cuffs it seemed pretty much hopeless and impossible.
 
Doggo

Doggo

Welcome to the House of Hope
‎
#282
#282
Where was Sanji in WCI?
Getting fucked by his "family" that screwed him since birth, were threatening the man who saved his life and gave him a home.
Threatening to take one of the things he loves most in his life, which is cooking, threatening his friends and so on.
Faced an entire army of Big Mom Pirates to rescue Luffy, fucking recreated a wedding cake that was made with ingredients from all over the world to stop Big Mom from trashing their ship and everyone aboard, saved nami, brook and chopper in Zou.
I WONDER WHERE HE WAS.
No, I actually dont wonder shit, because I read the fucking story and know exactly where he was.

Wanna complain about Robin 2.0? Be my guest. But saying that the character "had a choice" there is basically going against the premise of the entire thing.

Luffy took that beating without moving one muscle. After all that, he IMMEDIATELY screams to Sanji, saying that he KNOWS Sanji is lying. That all of that act and hits, were hurting Sanji much more than they were hurting Luffy.
He SCREAMS that he can't be PK without Sanji on his side.
He decides TO STARVE to death for Sanji.
In the end, he was rewarded. Sanji came back, asked Luffy for help, just like Nami and Robin did, and Luffy helped him, because he KNOWS the kind of man Sanji is.
But you wanna play the "the logical idea" when Oda creates dozens, DOZENS, of dumb situations for MANY other characters. BUT IF IT INVOLVES SANJI??? REAL SHIIIIT.
I never thought going through Sanji's background was necessary, but I'm actually GLAD Oda made something good out of it. Not the best execution, but a good one.

Still dont like the arc? Fair enough.
Blame Oda then. He is the one that came up with that.
 
Rekien

Rekien

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#283
#283
Zoro D Goat said:
Robin sacrificed herself to protect the Strawhats from danger. No one denies that. Usopp left because he can't go with the Strawhats without Going Merry. Not because he wasn't good enough. And Going Merry was tearing apart. That's a selfish reason for leaving the crew. Even Zoro got mad about it.

Sanji wanted to protect Zeff AND his crew. I don't think you understand what's going on in Sanji's situation. Luffy let Sanji hits him and Sanji only wants to drove Luffy away. Sanji can't leave his family behind because he's too GODDAMN KIND despite the fact that the Vinsmokes treated him like shit. Even Reiju stated that Sanji is the kindest person in the world. Oh and Pedro died because of Sanji even though Pedro was ready to sacrifice himself?:christindeed:Even Carrot say that it wasn't Sanji's fault. And what did Jinbei even do?
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WRONG, Ussop always knew Merry situation, he knew what kind of guy Luffy was. What made him want to leave was gettign beat up by Frankie's underlings and losing the money, making him feel utterly useless. Merry was just an excuse.

Zeff is not part of the crew. And i guess he is not kind enough to worry about the people he is putting at risk by helping them....I will say again, the sole reason why Pedro died is because of Sanji's selfishness, if Pedro didnt sacrefice himself the entire crew would be dead, soo yes, Pedro is dead because of Sanji's selfishness. Jinbe saved Luffy and Nami, did you forget?
 
Rekien

Rekien

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#285
#285
Edwar.D.O said:
Sanji didn’t make Luffy do anything? Even Luffy said he expected Sanji to want to save them because of how he is. If you were being bullied by someone at school and your school is on fire (God forbid) and you have a chance to save that bully and you do,
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Your comparisson is wrong, lemme fix it.

If the Bully was inside the fire, and you where already out....Would you willingly risk your friends life by making them go into the fire again just to save your Bully while you stay in the outside baking a fucking cake?

because thats more like what happened in there.
 
Doggo

Doggo

Welcome to the House of Hope
‎
#288
#288
Rekien said:
WRONG, Ussop always knew Merry situation, he knew what kind of guy Luffy was. What made him want to leave was gettign beat up by Frankie's underlings and losing the money, making him feel utterly useless. Merry was just an excuse.

Zeff is not part of the crew. And i guess he is not kind enough to worry about the people he is putting at risk by helping them....I will say again, the sole reason why Pedro died is because of Sanji's selfishness, if Pedro didnt sacrefice himself the entire crew would be dead, soo yes, Pedro is dead because of Sanji's selfishness. Jinbe saved Luffy and Nami, did you forget?
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If you actually think Oda is going to dive deep into a "If you help this person, he will kill many others" matter, my man you haven't even read Baratie.
Luffy decided he wanted Sanji as his cook, when Sanji fed Gin. An enemy.
 
Edwar.D.O

Edwar.D.O

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#291
#291
Rekien said:
Your comparisson is wrong, lemme fix it.

If the Bully was inside the fire, and you where already out....Would you willingly risk your friends life by making them go into the fire again just to save your Bully while you stay in the outside baking a fucking cake?

because thats more like what happened in there.
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Rekien said:
Your comparisson is wrong, lemme fix it.

If the Bully was inside the fire, and you where already out....Would you willingly risk your friends life by making them go into the fire again just to save your Bully while you stay in the outside baking a fucking cake?

because thats more like what happened in there.
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So after the entire conversation between Reiju and Sanji you expected Sanji to get up and leave his family to die? Seriously?

Also its more an analogy, I’m not directly comparing the facts of both situations I’m just trying to give you a brief idea, because all in all from what you’re saying you either didn’t properly read WCI or you didn’t understand it lol
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Zoro D Goat said:
@Doggo @Edwar.D.O you two are now in charge of this thread. I have school right now so take care boys.:beckmoji:
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Study hard my brother, we’ll be waiting for you on the other side.
:myman:
 
Rekien

Rekien

‎
#294
#294
Doggo said:
If you actually think Oda is going to dive deep into a "If you help this person, he will kill many others" matter, my man you haven't even read Baratie.
Luffy decided he wanted Sanji as his cook, when Sanji fed Gin. An enemy.
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I thought you where already "tired of this argument" what gives?

Sanji was not willing to let an enemy go withoud feeding them, but he was willing to let Luffy starve......Yep, indeed a traitor.
 
Doggo

Doggo

Welcome to the House of Hope
‎
#295
#295
Rekien said:
Ussop says "i already knew" when Fankie shows him the state of the ship...So yes, Merry was just an excuse he was using for himself because he felt he wasnt good enough to keep up with the crew.

Pay attention to the story, idiot.
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That's called "denial".
You know something, but you intentionally denies it, convincing yourself it to be a lie.
That's what Usopp did with Merry.
One of the stages of "mourning".
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Rekien said:
I thought you where already "tired of this argument" what gives?

Sanji was not willing to let an enemy go withoud feeding them, but he was willing to let Luffy starve......Yep, indeed a traitor.
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He fed Luffy.
 
Edwar.D.O

Edwar.D.O

‎
#296
#296
Rekien said:
Ussop says "i already knew" when Fankie shows him the state of the ship...So yes, Merry was just an excuse he was using for himself because he felt he wasnt good enough to keep up with the crew.

Pay attention to the story, idiot.
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LOL.
Him already knowing doesn’t change the reason why he left the crew, Merry was with them since he began his journey, he didn’t want to part with Merry after all the ship did for them, he was to stubborn to admit that the ship couldn’t carry on but he didn’t want to believe it for himself. Luffy told him to leave and out of rage he challenged Luffy for ownebwship of the ship and lost. He didn’t leave or challenge Luffy because he was weak and lost the money. He was the one who saw the incarnation of the Merry that told him that they’ll carry the crew for just a little longer, the going Merry was given to them by Kaya someone that he cares very deeply about, his issue was that he saw it as them just throwing away the merry when it exhausted all it’s used, he in anger compared that to him but that’s not why he left the crew. Franky explanation of what ussop saw fixing the ship was even more realisation to him that the Merry was a nakama too and that it was struggling but still carrying on to do their best to help the crew, ussop cared deeply for the ship and the ship cared deeply for them. Ussops anger sparked from Luffy not reacting in the same way to him at this moment. He was selfish, unrealistic and unreasonable because he couldn’t comprehend losing merry. He was not a carpenter but he did all he could, he thought he could patch Merry up again and they could continue to sail. This was literally impossible and he didn’t want to accept this reality.
You’re trying to tell me all of this was an excuse and the real reason was because he was weak and lost money. Even if this were to be true that makes his reasoning for choosing to challenge Luffy and leaving the crew even worse. And you have the guts to compare this to Sanji?


Calling me an idiot and tell me to pay attention?

 
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Rekien

Rekien

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#297
#297
Edwar.D.O said:
LOL.
Him already knowing doesn’t change the reason why he left the crew, Merry was with them since he began his journey, he didn’t want to part with Merry after all the ship did for them, he was to stubborn to admit that the ship couldn’t carry on but he didn’t want to believe it for himself. Luffy told him to leave and out of rage he challenged Luffy for ownebwship of the ship and lost. He didn’t leave or challenge Luffy because he was weak and lost the money. He was the one who saw the incarnation of the Merry that told him that they’ll carry the crew for just a little longer, the going Merry was given to them by Kaya someone that he cares very deeply about, his issue was that he saw it as them just throwing away the merry when it exhausted all it’s used, he in anger compared that to him but that’s not why he left the crew. Franky explanation of what ussop saw fixing the ship was even more realisation to him that the Merry was a nakama too and that it was struggling but still carrying on to do their best to help the crew, ussop cared deeply for the ship and the ship cared deeply for them. Ussops anger sparked from Luffy not reacting in the same way to him at this moment. He was selfish, unrealistic and unreasonable because he couldn’t comprehend losing merry. He was not a carpenter but he did all he could, he thought he could patch Merry up again and they could continue to sail. This was literally impossible and he didn’t want to accept this reality.
You’re trying to tell me all of this was an excuse and the real reason was because he was weak and lost money. Even if this were to be true that makes his reasoning for choosing to challenge Luffy and leaving the crew even worse. And you have the guts to compare this to Sanji?


Calling me an idiot and tell me to pay attention?

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Yes, you literaly dont have the ability to pay atention to anything. Merry was an excuse he was making up for himself, it was not even close to the full reason, he knew there was no way for the ship to keep on going from the get go, nakama or not. He always knew Luffy was not the kind of man to leave a nakama behind. Luffy saying he should left the crew was the nail in the coffin even if he apologized immediately after saying it. Ussop was having doubts of his own prowess after being beaten up by some underlings and losing the money, he felt like he was dragging everyone down since he didnt even had the ability to properly repair Merry and blamed himself for it, thats what kicked out his insecurities and made him chalenge Luffy.

Yes, i agree there is no comaprisson to Sanji situation, because unlike Sanji, Ussop leaving the crew didnt end up putting everyone at risk and even then he was more of a man than Sanji ever was during WCI.
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Doggo said:
That's called "denial".
You know something, but you intentionally denies it, convincing yourself it to be a lie.
That's what Usopp did with Merry.
One of the stages of "mourning".
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He fed Luffy.
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With a bento he made for Pudding, because she broke his hearth. if she kept her mouth shut and got the bento from him, Luffy would starve and die.
 
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Doggo

Doggo

Welcome to the House of Hope
‎
#298
#298
Rekien said:
Yes, you literaly dont have the ability to pay atention to anything. Merry was an excuse he was making up for himself, it was not even close to the full reason, he knew there was no way for the ship to keep on going from the get go, nakama or not. He always knew Luffy was not the kind of man to leave a nakama behind. Luffy saying he should left the crew was the nail in the coffin even if he apologized immediately after saying it. Ussop was having doubts of his own prowess after being beaten up by some underlings and losing the money, thats what kicked out his insecurities and made him chalenge Luffy.

Yes, i agree there is no comaprisson to Sanji situation, because unlike Sanji, Ussop leaving the crew didnt end up putting everyone at risk and even then he was more of a man than Sanji ever was during WCI.
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With a bento he made for Pudding, because she broke his hearth. if she kept her mouth shut and got the bento from him, Luffy would starve and die.
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Still fed Luffy.
 
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